i think this thread should be locked, its basicly a Ipod fanboy VS Ipod bashed thread, first it belongs in the portable audio section, 2nd, even in the portable audio section it deserves to be locked becuase its a mesure of how much of a fanboy you are insted of a regular discussion,
but just to add my 2 cents, from my expiriance, stock headphones are the ones you use from the moment you buy your dap, to the moment you can get your hands on some decent headphones, most audiophiles just toss them out or save them for a rainy day when the regular phones are in repair, it could be a 5 buck sony fontopias, or the ibuds, usualy you get some pretty bad headphones with your DAP' s, some manufacturers have shown exceptions, cowon bundling crysens and iriver bundling sanss, but usualy rule of thumb is "if you want good sound, you dont use the stock buds"
what a bad day i chose to stop sniffing glue....