[kevin638880]

I just dont understand what people expect.
They buy a DD/hybrid iem with elevated bass and expect it to sound like BA.

Clearly if i liked fast less physically present bass. I would have looked the other way the minute FR graph surfaced for EXT.

I think it is just reality not matching expectations. In any case, everyone hears differently and no need to be offended just because someone thinks differently. At the end of the day, whatever you enjoy will be the best - who really can say otherwise?

Although for the overhype bit I think it is a bit uncalled for, can't really fault a product/person just because many people like it and others don't. Impressions are only for reference and of course they could be different from your expectations. I think SP2000T is utter trash in relation to its price and I think it belongs to the SE territory, but I wouldn't say people are hyping this just because of the positive response. Not saying Crin is wrong and I actually agree with most of his views, but "affecting purchasing decisions because many people overhype something" is, IMO, a bit too strong of a statement.

Anyway let's get back to discussing the IEMs instead of focusing on subjective preferences.

Edit (just to get back on topic): I don't think the quantity is overwhelming here - I am not a basshead (LX is way too much for me, for example) and EXT is perfectly acceptable. Definitely slower than BA bass but....ok yeah I agree with you, if that is the case I would just buy a BA then.

Although before 20-30 hours the bass is quite overbearing and bleeds into the mids sometimes.

 

[aaf evo]

That sub-bass roll-off though....
Any chance you can graph the EXT on the same chart to compare?

Thank you!

Legit my first thoughts too, but Erlkonig #2 has a roll off as well so I'm not really surprised either.

 

[Skullar]

I think it is just reality not matching expectations.

Generally speaking, not just for VE customer base. What i have noticed that people glue to some sort of company house sound and cling to it.

Cant blame consumer all the time though as some releases can get confusing. Such as EE EVO where many expected same tuning with technical improvements but instead got fairly different iem.

Not sure if EXT was branded as VE8 evolution from marketing perspective but if it was that might be part of confusion. Because clearly looking at driver set up you could not make the sound alike even if you wanted to.

 

[aaf evo]

Maybe the fact it’s called “Elysium” extended and from a graph/impressions perspective it looks like it sounds nothing like an OG Elysium is probably giving people false expectations.

 

[kevin638880]

Generally speaking, not just for VE customer base. What i have noticed that people glue to some sort of company house sound and cling to it.

Cant blame consumer all the time though as some releases can get confusing. Such as EE EVO where many expected same tuning with technical improvements but instead got fairly different iem.

Not sure if EXT was branded as VE8 evolution from marketing perspective but if it was that might be part of confusion. Because clearly looking at driver set up you could not make the sound alike even if you wanted to.

Don't recall that branded as VE8 evolution? Think it is the Elysium Extended part creating perceptions and expectations. Although OG has a BA bass and EXT has DD bass, so I guess the same logic applies....

Maybe the fact it’s called “Elysium” extended and from a graph/impressions perspective it looks like it sounds nothing line an OG Elysium is probably giving people false expectations.

Yeah - I noted in my initial post that the EXT does not sound like the Elysium at all, except for some intangible qualities of the DD mids.

 

[gLer]

That sub-bass roll-off though....
Any chance you can graph the EXT on the same chart to compare?

Thank you!

Very first thought and question that popped into my mind when I saw that graph. That left side droop is just...no. But then bass extension and rumble isn't exactly what you're buying a Phönix for. Would love to see EXT on the same rig by comparison, and EVO too if you have access to one.

except for some intangible qualities of the DD mids.

Wasn't that the best part of Ely though? Bass too light, treble too bright, mids to die for? Seems EXT fixes all the bad and keeps the good.

 

[Tristy]

Another interesting take here comparing to MMR's recent creation...
https://www.headfonia.com/mmr-balmung-review/3/

 

[kevin638880]

Wasn't that the best part of Ely though? Bass too light, treble too bright, mids to die for? Seems EXT fixes all the bad and keeps the good.

Yes and I can see why people prefer the OG more than the EXT because there is nothing "in front of" the mids, as in, it is always the star of the show. In fact, I think 5 years ago I would say the EXT is rubbish because I didn't like (DD) bass back then.

EXT is more "balanced" in that regard and depending on track, the mids are not always the standout feature, comparatively speaking. I personally think the EXT mids is absolutely amazing and I still consider that as one of the standout features (DD bass is nothing new, but DD mids + VE vocal tuning is something special for me) and I just can't see myself going back to BA mids, but I also can see myself picking the OG depending on track or my listening mood.

 

[gLer]

Another interesting take here comparing to MMR's recent creation...
https://www.headfonia.com/mmr-balmung-review/3/

Everyone keeps describing the EXT as V-shaped yet rave about the mids. To my understanding mids will generally be recessed in a V-shaped IEM...otherwise it wouldn't be a V-shaped IEM, but rather a U (neutral mids) or W (forward mids). What am I missing?

 

[uckexk]

Everyone keeps describing the EXT as V-shaped yet rave about the mids. To my understanding mids will generally be recessed in a V-shaped IEM...otherwise it wouldn't be a V-shaped IEM, but rather a U (neutral mids) or W (forward mids). What am I missing?

The mids are indeed recessed, not nearly as forward as Elysium. I wish some reviews were more consistent.

 

[kevin638880]

Everyone keeps describing the EXT as V-shaped yet rave about the mids. To my understanding mids will generally be recessed in a V-shaped IEM...otherwise it wouldn't be a V-shaped IEM, but rather a U (neutral mids) or W (forward mids). What am I missing?

Quoting what Deezel said, it is probably the quality of the DD mids drawing us in, not the position.

By the way, OG Elysium is known for mids but is also a "Mild V-shape" according to Crin's measurements (that's why I have trust issues with graphs...).

Edit: actually, I should be more clear....I like the vocals and for me vocals = mids, so....

 

[Tristy]

Everyone keeps describing the EXT as V-shaped yet rave about the mids. To my understanding mids will generally be recessed in a V-shaped IEM...otherwise it wouldn't be a V-shaped IEM, but rather a U (neutral mids) or W (forward mids). What am I missing?

The mids are indeed slightly behind the bass on tracks which have a lot of bass but the mids have this captivating characteristic which my attention seems to be naturally drawn to. Its strange and hard to explain but vocals seem to occupy their own space behind the bass which you can still zone in on and appreciate even on bass heavy tracks.

From my impressions - "Voices always seems to cut through the mix and have a tangible element to them that I’ve never heard before. I am putting this down to the use of the HALC mid’s, they aren’t forward in the mix but they always manage to be legible, emotive and grab your attention… there's a heft to the mids that I’ve not heard before in any other IEM."

 

[kevin638880]

The mids are indeed slightly behind the bass on tracks which have a lot of bass but the mids have this captivating characteristic which my attention seems to be naturally drawn to. Its strange and hard to explain but vocals seem to occupy their own space behind the bass which you can still zone in on and appreciate even on bass heavy tracks.

From my impressions - "Voices always seems to cut through the mix and have a tangible element to them that I’ve never heard before. I am putting this down to the use of the HALC mid’s, they aren’t forward in the mix but they always manage to be legible, emotive and grab your attention… there's a heft to the mids that I’ve not heard before in any other IEM."

That is very consistent with my own experience I wrote a few pages back: "I am glad the EXT has retained the quality of the Elysium vocals (VE always have some kind of magic when tuning for vocals) even tho it sounds not as prominent as the Elysium due to the comparatively elevated bass response. However, in some percussion-heavy tracks it does seem to cover up the vocals a bit more than the Elysium."

But again as Deezel said, maybe that was the intent of the recording to focus on the percussion instead.

 

[aaf evo]

Aghhh I need to stop visiting this thread cannot wait to get mine. Retaining the OG Elysium vocal magic with more bass just sounds amazing to me.

 

[tgx78]

My top 3 IEMs compared