[jerick70]

I'd rather opt for a Black Widow 2 even though it's probably very very hard to get. I was recently told the following, and I trust this man a lot.

"The BW2 has the V281's speed, black background, and liveliness, but is more organic or romantic, moreso in the bass. Where the BW2 fails is driving planars."

The other thing that most hi end tube amps fall flat on their face in is affordability. When you have to spend as much or more than the amp is worth on tube replacements to bring out the best in the amp that is a no go in my book. This is exactly why I sold my WA5-LE. I was going to have to shell out well over $3K to get the best tubes. I only paid $2400 for the amp.....

 

[sahmen]

I've not heard the H20 but I did own an H10. With Burson opamps it was a beast in sound, drive, and power. Gustard makes very nice kit. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend the H10 to someone looking for an excellent low cost headamp. Now the H20 is most likely just as good. I don't see a lot of reviews out there though.

Thanks. I used to own the H10, and sold it, not because I did not like the sound but because at that time I was particularly interested in an amp which could drive my He-6 well, and I wound up getting a speaker amp for it. Now the solution I am considering is one that should have all the connectivity options of the V281 and the H20, as seen from the photos, seems to have those, which is mostly what makes the H20 preferable to the H10, and even the Liquid Platinum to me. On the other hand, I find the Liquid Platinum attractive for its Tube/hybrid construction, and for its status as a Cavalli endorsed "clone-implementation" of his Liquid Crimson, which has an intriguing reputation on Head-fi as a great sounding amp. I expect the competition between the H20 and the Liquid Platinum to be quite intense, but I am looking forward to it. I wish there were more H20 reviews though.

 

[jerick70]

Thanks. I used to own the H10, and sold it, not because I did not like the sound but because at that time I was particularly interested in an amp which could drive my He-6 well, and I wound up getting a speaker amp for it. Now the solution I am considering is one that should have all the connectivity options of the V281 and the H20, as seen from the photos, seems to have those, which is mostly what makes the H20 preferable to the H10, and even the Liquid Platinum to me. On the other hand, I find the Liquid Platinum attractive for its Tube/hybrid construction, and for its status as a Cavalli endorsed "clone-implementation" of his Liquid Crimson, which has an intriguing reputation on Head-fi as a great sounding amp. I expect the competition between the H20 and the Liquid Platinum to be quite intense, but I am looking forward to it. I wish there were more H20 reviews though.

The H10 was mediocre with the stock opamps. But with Burson v5s it was incredible. Lifted the veil and kicked some major a$$. It's only downfall was the SE only output.

I feel your frustration mate. Exotic head-fi kit is a pita sometimes when you are trying to decide what to get and you can't listen anywhere.

What I've done in the past is just take the plunge and buy the piece of gear that intrigues me the most. You can usually sell it if you don't like it.

 

[Pharmaboy]

I agree. Very few sabre implementations really work. What I dislike about them is the fuzzy rendering of instruments and their "bodies" and the etched, edgy treble. Bass rendering is one notish as well and lacks punch/slam (not volume)

I favor a DAC like the RS06 before all Sabres.

V281 owner/fanboy here. The V281 is the best amp/preamp I've ever heard (I have 4 other amps, 2 of which are also preamps). Each has its positive points, but as a total solution, there's no contest vs the V281...

My first DAC was a sabre implementation (Stello DA100)...could never ameliorate the brightness/edginess of it, no matter what tweaks I tried. 2nd DAC was an inexpensive Sabre implementation (Peachtree Audio DAC iTx) that sounded more natural & less edgy. Was happy with that for awhile.

And then I got the Audio GD NOS 19. End of Story. Later got the AGD DAC-19, more out of curiosity than anything else. 90%+ of what the NOS 19 does, and still way better than any other DAC I'd heard. IMO short of an extreme cost sabre implementation (some are said to sound extremely good), I need multibit for good digital, and NOS multibit for the best sound.j

I've never heard any digital that equals really good analogue, but NOS multibit produces a true alternative version of musical truth IMO.

 

[111MilesToGo]

I feel a need to ask another technical question wrt the V281 here. It has been indicated a couple of times in this thread, but maybe @fdg could answer with his authority. What is the operating principle, class A or class A/B? Please, Mr. Fried Reim, could you comment on what was chosen for the V281 and why?

PS: My other question regarding the “balanced“ topic was answered VERY satisfactorily. Thanks again.

I don't know, and I don't think the manual says (could be some kind of custom design), but by process of elimination:

Class A? No, because the v281 doesn't get hot but marginally warm.

Class B? Possibly, it has two amps per channel. Depends on if these do push-pull action. Also possible because v281 gets warm but not hot. However, the v281 has a very low THD, lower than some other class A amps like the Schiit Lyr 2 (class A / AB), so it may not be class B either.

Class AB? Again, the amp doesn't get hot so it's never operating in class A mode I'm sure.

Class D? Most likely not. Lower audio quality and seem to be used for subwoofers in speaker setups.

This review:

Headphone Guru Violectric HPA V281 review

...mentions that the v200 is Class AB. Since the 281 is supposed to be four v200 amps, I assume that means that the v280/281 are also Class AB.

Thank you very much for your indicative though indirect answers. There had been a few others with similar outcome in this thread (I tried the Search function, but to little avail only).

Thus, I would like to ask @fdg for an answer. Please forgive me for maybe duplicating older things, and a Big Thank You in advance.

PS: I‘m hoping to audition the V281 at my dealer sometime in the next two or three weeks ... looking forward to it a lot.

 

[astrostar59]

Violectric V281 review

(Apologies, not my photo, I will take some in a day or so.)

This amp landed today. I was using the little Metrum Aurix to this point on both my LCD2-C and LCD4s. On the LCD2-C I had the Aurix set to no gain (unity) to more or less it should be straight through albeit with an impedance 'fixer' down to 2 ohms via the Lundhai transformer it uses for that. So dead simple signal path.

No test with the LCD4 yet, as I am on my second system without them at the moment. Also using the standard LCD2 cable which is SE 6.3mm plug.

Right away I can hear more detail and transparency. The soundstage has also expanded, much more 3D and wider, higher and deeper. The instruments are more separated v the Aurix, it is less confused when things get busy. The bass has more authority, is more tuneful and textured. Vocals are smooth and realistic, very detailed, on female vocals never sharp or thin / edgy especially.

Mids are still classic Audeze, but this time more detail and the layering is superb, placement is very easy to work out in the head stage. It is so unfettled, so on the job, seems to be coasting along. Things are not slow or muddy, lack of textures or details, the amount of information is incredible, and I can pick things out that were lost before, masked by other instruments. The best way to describe the mids is to view an old painting, and try to see what is going on, then to see it cleaned and there, it is all there to see. But it is all there without a penalty, harshness or lack of realism in doing it.

The control over the drivers is one olf the most remarkable aspects to this amp, it feels like they are hard wired to the output, really kicking their butt here. The LCD2-C is no slough, but it does sound like it has woken up from it's slumber, like the drivers are going to fly out the frames. In fact it feels like the LCD2-C has just caught up my my LCD4 out of the Aurix, maybe surpassed it. The other odd thing is the transparency has increased, but the treble level seems only marginally higher than the Aurix. It is as though the detail level of what is going on is greater, without an attention of it. Hard to describe.

Track swopping, I notice a bigger difference between music styles and the quality of the recording, acoustics of the venue / studio ect. I leads me to believe the V281 is not colouring or 'beautifying' the incoming signal, really only supercharging it and flinging it out at the headphone, take that you sucker! Ha Ha. This is all good stuff.

Wow, I like this thing A LOT.

The little Metrum Aurix is still a great little amp and bear in mind it's then price at about 650 euros. It's soundstage is more intimate, everything is closer together, and it may be struggling a bit to drive my LCD2 and the LCD4s. On the LCD4 in my other system, I have a 10v line out from my DAC, which does wake up the Aurix a bit more to then drive the LCD4s, but.....

It is only the first few hours, and already the sound is changing, the amp heating up. It sounds better even after 3 hours switch on than cold. I think it will have some burn in, this stuff nearly always does, all those capacitors. My DAC took a month of being on 24/7.

Kassandra DAC with my LCD4s.

Well, I learnt over the last few years a better DAC makes a HUGE difference to the final sound, both on my speaker rig and HPs. Bits are not bits. Now I can hear how a better HP amp in the chain has an impact too. I still put the source as tantamount, first to building a good system, the first thing to resolve.

Once the source is correct, great balance has been achieved, then the HP and amp choice follows IMO. I used to have various artificial or brittle sounding DACs that then had to be 'controlled' up stream. That meant favouring a coloured sounding HP or amp. So maybe by chance I end up getting a decent HP amp last, who knows. It seems to be the icing on the cake, completing a nicely balanced system.

Anyway, my thoughts, will shut up now and listen to more music.

Very very very happy with this V281. If you are after a different amp I would look at this for sure. Especially on the LCD HPs which are already warm and fairly forgiving. I considered a tube amp around the same budget, but was not sure it would add too much to the sound, get too coloured? I wanted to wake things up in the dynamics, really control the LCD4 - Max it Out.

My DAC is a tube based unit already. I do think it is good to have tubes somewhere in the chain, either in the DAC or the amp, and have used that method for 20 years or more.

So more to come I think. And running it balanced next week when the Draug silver cable lands - to be continued..... big smile on my face.

 

[astrostar59]

[QUOTE="

I've never heard any digital that equals really good analogue, but NOS multibit produces a true alternative version of musical truth IMO.[/QUOTE]

I believe it is possible to equal a top TT. My choice to do that would be the Aries Cerat Kassandra Signature Limited Edition. It's an all out assault on digital. An all tube design with 24 AD1865 NOS chips, no filter, fantastic gain stage and tube regulated power supply. It is 2 chassis and weighs 120 kilos. Having met the Designer of it at Munich Hi-End and spoken to a guy who owns one plus the TechDAS AirForce 1 Premium Turntable, it on that same level, right at the top of what digital can do. He told me he used to have the MSB Select II and the Kassandra S LE was better.

You can get close for less by careful choices. I have had quite a few NOS DACs inc the Audio Note (UK) DAC 5 Special, and now the Aries Cerat Kassandra Ref II version. R-2R done well is the answer I am convinced of it, and preferably sans filter i.e straight through, no messing with the data.

 

[fdg]

@ 111MilesToGo
... and others who like to know what class our amps work, if it is A - A/B - B.
Most SS amps work in class-A/B as this is a good measure to avoid zero-crossing distortions compared to class-B.
In former times, when electronics had been not so good, class-A was "invented" to avoid those
zero-crossing distortions by simply raising the idle current to the max.
Those amps showed very good linearity at the expense of dissipating masses of heat.
Well, not so bad in winter, but in Europe - where air condition is not so common - a bad idea in summer
With modern components it is possible to come across the class-B issues between around -1 V to +1 V voltage swing.
Class-A/B means that there is some idle current and for small signals (little output voltage around 0 to +1 dB = 0,5 to 1V) it is possible that they get through the amp in class-A mode. The larger the amplitude, the more it is class-B.
We at Lake People / Violectric / Niimbus are designing amps with the best available components in Class-A/B.
These are 0,1 and 1% metal film resistors, best PP and PS capacitors, fast and low noise video transistors.
We buy from reliable sources to avoid fake components which can be found in most asian gear !
We achieve lowest possible distortion figures - so there is no need for class-A.

Cheers, Fried

 

[111MilesToGo]

@ 111MilesToGo
... and others who like to know what class our amps work, if it is A - A/B - B.
Most SS amps work in class-A/B as this is a good measure to avoid zero-crossing distortions compared to class-B.
In former times, when electronics had been not so good, class-A was "invented" to avoid those
zero-crossing distortions by simply raising the idle current to the max.
Those amps showed very good linearity at the expense of dissipating masses of heat.
Well, not so bad in winter, but in Europe - where air condition is not so common - a bad idea in summer
With modern components it is possible to come across the class-B issues between around -1 V to +1 V voltage swing.
Class-A/B means that there is some idle current and for small signals (little output voltage around 0 to +1 dB = 0,5 to 1V) it is possible that they get through the amp in class-A mode. The larger the amplitude, the more it is class-B.
We at Lake People / Violectric / Niimbus are designing amps with the best available components in Class-A/B.
These are 0,1 and 1% metal film resistors, best PP and PS capacitors, fast and low noise video transistors.
We buy from reliable sources to avoid fake components which can be found in most asian gear !
We achieve lowest possible distortion figures - so there is no need for class-A.

Cheers, Fried

Thank you very much indeed for another reasoning and transparency, @fdg! Your amps are transparent, and so are you / is your company.

Cheers, and keep on going strong!
111MilesToGo

 

[Pharmaboy]

[QUOTE="

I've never heard any digital that equals really good analogue, but NOS multibit produces a true alternative version of musical truth IMO.

I believe it is possible to equal a top TT. My choice to do that would be the Aries Cerat Kassandra Signature Limited Edition. It's an all out assault on digital. An all tube design with 24 AD1865 NOS chips, no filter, fantastic gain stage and tube regulated power supply. It is 2 chassis and weighs 120 kilos. Having met the Designer of it at Munich Hi-End and spoken to a guy who owns one plus the TechDAS AirForce 1 Premium Turntable, it on that same level, right at the top of what digital can do. He told me he used to have the MSB Select II and the Kassandra S LE was better.

You can get close for less by careful choices. I have had quite a few NOS DACs inc the Audio Note (UK) DAC 5 Special, and now the Aries Cerat Kassandra Ref II version. R-2R done well is the answer I am convinced of it, and preferably sans filter i.e straight through, no messing with the data.[/QUOTE]

I'd love to try this DAC--but @~$21K, it's hopelessly expensive for me. I'll have to make do with less expensive options. My next DAC will be the Audio GD R2R 1...with V281 as preamp from its XLR output.

BTW, in response to your experience with the V281 driving the LCD-2Cs...I recently acquired vintage pre-fazor (early) versions of the LCD-2 and LCD-3. The LCD-2 strikes me as more of an all-rounder, doing justice to pretty much any genre of music; while the LCD-3 is more of a specialist, favoring classical/choral/small group jazz genres. But there's no doubt the the V281 drives each one with authority and control that none of my other amps (including some quite good ones) can quite match.

 

[astrostar59]

@ 111MilesToGo
... and others who like to know what class our amps work, if it is A - A/B - B.
Most SS amps work in class-A/B as this is a good measure to avoid zero-crossing distortions compared to class-B.
In former times, when electronics had been not so good, class-A was "invented" to avoid those
zero-crossing distortions by simply raising the idle current to the max.
Those amps showed very good linearity at the expense of dissipating masses of heat.
Well, not so bad in winter, but in Europe - where air condition is not so common - a bad idea in summer
With modern components it is possible to come across the class-B issues between around -1 V to +1 V voltage swing.
Class-A/B means that there is some idle current and for small signals (little output voltage around 0 to +1 dB = 0,5 to 1V) it is possible that they get through the amp in class-A mode. The larger the amplitude, the more it is class-B.
We at Lake People / Violectric / Niimbus are designing amps with the best available components in Class-A/B.
These are 0,1 and 1% metal film resistors, best PP and PS capacitors, fast and low noise video transistors.
We buy from reliable sources to avoid fake components which can be found in most asian gear !
We achieve lowest possible distortion figures - so there is no need for class-A.

Cheers, Fried

Thanks Fried, and may I say (arrived today) got your fabulous V281 hooked up to my Audio Note DAC and the LCD2-C. Hell, it sounds marvelous. So yeah, Class A/B is cool. I have a big Plinius power amp that runs either 200 watts full class A or class A/B switchable to my speakers. In A/B mode it is about 5 watts of pure class A, then moves to A/B. It seems to work well. In full class A the heatsinks get really hot, almost too hot to touch. And it eats about 850 watts of mains on 230v.

In class A is sounds a bit softer (very slightly) and more tube amp style, more organic and real? In A/B the bass is more controlled amongst other things. I prefer class A for serious listening on it. If your amp was pure class A, it would pump out a LOT of heat, so it would need big heatsinks on the side and the chassis would need to be twice as big I think. Also even though amps on class A are designed for it, it is inevitable the parts inside will get hotter, so capacitor life and other components will have a shorter life span.

I love this V281, can't wait till I can try out as balanced output for the HP. And later on my LCD4s and better DAC. And pitch it against my passive pre amp in my speaker system. Might be interesting?
This amp is well worth the money IMO, I can't fault it to be honest. I like the looks ad well, chunky facia, small width and height but deep, works well in a rack.

Does the V281 use any feedback?

 

[jerick70]

Violectric V281 review

(Apologies, not my photo, I will take some in a day or so.)

This amp landed today. I was using the little Metrum Aurix to this point on both my LCD2-C and LCD4s. On the LCD2-C I had the Aurix set to no gain (unity) to more or less it should be straight through albeit with an impedance 'fixer' down to 2 ohms via the Lundhai transformer it uses for that. So dead simple signal path.

No test with the LCD4 yet, as I am on my second system without them at the moment. Also using the standard LCD2 cable which is SE 6.3mm plug.

Right away I can hear more detail and transparency. The soundstage has also expanded, much more 3D and wider, higher and deeper. The instruments are more separated v the Aurix, it is less confused when things get busy. The bass has more authority, is more tuneful and textured. Vocals are smooth and realistic, very detailed, on female vocals never sharp or thin / edgy especially.

Mids are still classic Audeze, but this time more detail and the layering is superb, placement is very easy to work out in the head stage. It is so unfettled, so on the job, seems to be coasting along. Things are not slow or muddy, lack of textures or details, the amount of information is incredible, and I can pick things out that were lost before, masked by other instruments. The best way to describe the mids is to view an old painting, and try to see what is going on, then to see it cleaned and there, it is all there to see. But it is all there without a penalty, harshness or lack of realism in doing it.

The control over the drivers is one olf the most remarkable aspects to this amp, it feels like they are hard wired to the output, really kicking their butt here. The LCD2-C is no slough, but it does sound like it has woken up from it's slumber, like the drivers are going to fly out the frames. In fact it feels like the LCD2-C has just caught up my my LCD4 out of the Aurix, maybe surpassed it. The other odd thing is the transparency has increased, but the treble level seems only marginally higher than the Aurix. It is as though the detail level of what is going on is greater, without an attention of it. Hard to describe.

Track swopping, I notice a bigger difference between music styles and the quality of the recording, acoustics of the venue / studio ect. I leads me to believe the V281 is not colouring or 'beautifying' the incoming signal, really only supercharging it and flinging it out at the headphone, take that you sucker! Ha Ha. This is all good stuff.

Wow, I like this thing A LOT.

The little Metrum Aurix is still a great little amp and bear in mind it's then price at about 650 euros. It's soundstage is more intimate, everything is closer together, and it may be struggling a bit to drive my LCD2 and the LCD4s. On the LCD4 in my other system, I have a 10v line out from my DAC, which does wake up the Aurix a bit more to then drive the LCD4s, but.....

It is only the first few hours, and already the sound is changing, the amp heating up. It sounds better even after 3 hours switch on than cold. I think it will have some burn in, this stuff nearly always does, all those capacitors. My DAC took a month of being on 24/7.

Kassandra DAC with my LCD4s.

Well, I learnt over the last few years a better DAC makes a HUGE difference to the final sound, both on my speaker rig and HPs. Bits are not bits. Now I can hear how a better HP amp in the chain has an impact too. I still put the source as tantamount, first to building a good system, the first thing to resolve.

Once the source is correct, great balance has been achieved, then the HP and amp choice follows IMO. I used to have various artificial or brittle sounding DACs that then had to be 'controlled' up stream. That meant favouring a coloured sounding HP or amp. So maybe by chance I end up getting a decent HP amp last, who knows. It seems to be the icing on the cake, completing a nicely balanced system.

Anyway, my thoughts, will shut up now and listen to more music.

Very very very happy with this V281. If you are after a different amp I would look at this for sure. Especially on the LCD HPs which are already warm and fairly forgiving. I considered a tube amp around the same budget, but was not sure it would add too much to the sound, get too coloured? I wanted to wake things up in the dynamics, really control the LCD4 - Max it Out.

My DAC is a tube based unit already. I do think it is good to have tubes somewhere in the chain, either in the DAC or the amp, and have used that method for 20 years or more.

So more to come I think. And running it balanced next week when the Draug silver cable lands - to be continued..... big smile on my face.

Beautiful DAC. Is it worth the asking price?

 

[astrostar59]

Beautiful DAC. Is it worth the asking price?

Hell yes! It is the absolute best analogue / natural sound I have ever heard from a DAC. Before I got it I had the Audio Note (UK) DAC 5 which is also an R-2R chip with great tube regulated power supply and tube gain stage, no filtering, no up sampling. But the Kassandra is on another level, huge dynamics, wide open gate for detail and micro detail (it has no coupling caps in the signal path). Bass that is the best digital bass I have ever heard, one thing digital can lag behind good vinyl. And super smooth natural treble. Then the liquid midrange, I could go on.

Before I ordered it, I demoed other top DACs, inc the Chord DAVE, CH Precision C1, Naim CD555 (used), MSB Platinum IV with Signature Power Base, Lampizator Golden Gate with discrete digital board, various Meridian DACs. I can't recommend the Kassandra highly enough. It just works, so so right....

 

[Fegefeuer]

huh

once your headphones run balanced on the V281 this thread might explode given the current summer's heat here in Germany.

 

[astrostar59]

huh

once your headphones run balanced on the V281 this thread might explode given the current summer's heat here in Germany.

Indeed. In Spain it is 47°C in Madrid, ouch....

Here is the Norne Draug All Silver that I will use on the LCD4s balanced.