[dookiex]

I think silverrain might be a mute and has only one smiley in his collection

LOL, good one oh mighty popcorn eater.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Quote:

Originally Posted by majkel /img/forum/go_quote.gif LOL! What's the best amp you have thoroughly auditioned? For me last week it was ASL Twin Head MkII w/DACTs, replaced caps, rolled tubes, gold pin ceramic tube sockets. <- Tara Labs Air 1 <- Cairn Fog v.2 modded <- power cord... I don't remember. We had HD600's, HD650's, Grado GS1k's, RS2's, UE9's, K1000 + dedicated SS output stage (ASL TH as preamp). We had a couple of tube sets like 45 Emission Labs, 2A3 Full Music and the like. What the owner said about my rig? Slight difference. I'm using a better (IMHO) DAC now than the Cairn Fog v.2. My amp is directly connected to the DAC PCB, so no IC (best IC in other words). Sure my amp is slightly worse than TH but we also had RudiStor NX-33. I'd never say it sounds better than mine, nor stated it any of the participants. I think mine is more transparent. And so on... Do I really need to write all of this to prove I can say something? I can add long auditions of complete O2 system driven by Accuphase DP800/DC801. I'll just repeat basing on what I heard and on what I can hear each day - the HD650 with the stock cable are great headphones to "fix" rig imperfections as they can hide or dampen many things, add their own, artificial but pleasant timbre and make people happy that way. The Pro 750's are better headphones no doubt but not suitable for tiny OTL's as they are low impedance. Saying they have recessed midrange is a big mistake and shows only the headphone setup flaws to be directed outside of the 'phones. Listening to drum'n'bass on the HD650's would be a torment for me, these are lullaby-dedicated headphones.

So you "auditioned" all these amps and yet found them sound no better than your DIY portable "Moonlight" which means you can form your opinion about anything by just using that amp? Did I get it right?
If you hear HD650 dampening things there is definitely something wrong, they are either underdriven or just don't match the amp. BTW, I don't remember ever saying or reading much about them being "great" with stock cable. I personally don't even remember how they sound stock.

 

[silverrain]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dookiex /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think silverrain might be a mute and has only one smiley in his collection LOL, good one oh mighty popcorn eater.

(breaks muteness)
It is an indicator that someone is watching a thread with interest, even though they have nothing to contribute...yet.
(resumes muteness)

 

[dookiex]

Ha ha ha. Brilliant!

 

[majkel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew_WOT /img/forum/go_quote.gif If you hear HD650 dampening things there is definitely something wrong, they are either underdriven or just don't match the amp. BTW, I don't remember ever saying or reading much about them being "great" with stock cable. I personally don't even remember how they sound stock.

So what's the matter? You argue my opinion about the HD650's while you don't even remember how they sound originally

I am telling you on what equipment I auditioned several models of headphones, and I'm not saying my amp is best for all of them. It is obviously not, however I can re-adjust the sound replacing some components to fit other headphones. I will try with the HD650 maybe today but the fact I have to spice up the sound means these headphones are far from being neutral. ATM my amp is set up for shortest signal path, minimum components used and maximal transparency. Sure, I need to hear the HD650's with another cable, probably balanced as I know what can cable replacement do to pretty funny headphones like Creative Aurvana Live! On the other hand, the HD650 and ASL TH owner spent with them several years and would tell you the same what I had written here. In the meantime, I'll remind you: we are looking for headphones matching hard electronica IIRC. Regarding my amp - I'll probably present it to head-fi when I realize I really need advertising abroad. At this time, the demand is keeping me busy till late Fall, with RudiStor and Leben owners in the queue. Sorry guys for OT but it's not me bashing other opinions. I'm just posting mine. Stock HD650's at present lose to K701's, DT880's, HD600's, Proline 750's/2500's, E9's (no surprise) IMHO.

 

[dookiex]

Question, since we are comparing stock Ultrasones to recabled Senns, where's the comparison between recabled Ultrasones AND recabled Senns?

 

[parhelictriangle]

Let me put it this way. My (stock) 650s (with an incredibly simple setup) certainly don't make Autechre sound like a lullaby. Nor do they make, say, Venetian Snares or Aphex Twin or Naked City or Boredoms or Ruins or Secret Chiefs 3 sound dull or laid back.

The level of hyperbole around here renders some of your opinions absolutely worthless.

 

[dookiex]

Neither do my Ultrasones

Look folks, both the Senns and the Ultrasones are honestly equally good and impressive but they definitely have different sound signatures and very audible different execution to their sound. Due to that, it really depends on the individual to decide which direction they enjoy more, Ultrasones or the Senns. It's kind of silly with the back and forths on which one is better when it's really which sound is more of his or her style.

 

[majkel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by parhelictriangle /img/forum/go_quote.gif Let me put it this way. My (stock) 650s (with an incredibly simple setup) certainly don't make Autechre sound like a lullaby. Nor do they make, say, Venetian Snares or Aphex Twin or Naked City or Boredoms or Ruins or Secret Chiefs 3 sound dull or laid back. The level of hyperbole around here renders some of your opinions absolutely worthless.

What did you compare the HD650's to? Try some Ultrasone's or Beyerdynamic's and see what your music might sound like. I owned the HD595's for more than a year, know them very well, and they are just another pair of not so snappy headphones, pretty enjoyable with electronica but nowhere having the impact and immediacy of Beyerdynamic DT880 Pro, DT990 Pro, or Ultrasone Proline 750/2500 (E9 of course, too). Despite being effective, the HD595's need a current efficient, well matching amp, and then, compared to amplified HD650's I'd choose the former any day, as I don't care for some better technical aspects but overall impression.

 

[silverrain]

I bought new PRO 750, and new (new model) HD650 -- after comparing both after burn-in, the 750 sounds more natural, better bass, better everything, over the 650, so I sold the 650 -- the 750 are keepers.

I then also got the new PRO 2500, and they have a little less highs than the 750, but gives a nice relaxing realistic-sounding listening experience, so I have kept them, too.

Over the years, I've bought the HD650 3 times, and always end up selling them, so I know I've given them a fair trial.
Tried the HD595 2 times, and they are gone, too.
I also have the HD580, which I like better than the HD650, so no need for 2 big Senns for me at this time.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverrain /img/forum/go_quote.gif I bought new PRO 750, and new (new model) HD650 -- after comparing both after burn-in, the 750 sounds more natural, better bass, better everything, over the 650, so I sold the 650 -- the 750 are keepers. I then also got the new PRO 2500, and they have a little less highs than the 750, but gives a nice relaxing realistic-sounding listening experience, so I have kept them, too. Over the years, I've bought the HD650 3 times, and always end up selling them, so I know I've given them a fair trial. Tried the HD595 2 times, and they are gone, too. I also have the HD580, which I like better than the HD650, so no need for 2 big Senns for me at this time.

Interesting, I have older HD650 model and with Zu cable it just runs circles around PL750, I mean that's even unfair to compare two, totally different class. Better details, bass, not mudded mids, extended non shrilling highs. This sound IS natural. I didn't even bother doing comprehensive A/B of two (it was that obvious) and concentrated on comparing PL750 with K271S (which won by a big margin, btw)
How something with metal tone and bath tub frequency response can be called "natural". I can see that some can like and even enjoy *that* but calling it natural?

Is it like other phones, speakers, or real life sound? Not to my recollection.

And IMO HD595 is the worst phone that ever came out from Senns, yes, I used to own one.

 

[wavoman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dookiex /img/forum/go_quote.gif Neither do my Ultrasones Look folks, both the Senns and the Ultrasones are honestly equally good and impressive but they definitely have different sound signatures and very audible different execution to their sound. Due to that, it really depends on the individual to decide which direction they enjoy more, Ultrasones or the Senns. It's kind of silly with the back and forths on which one is better when it's really which sound is more of his or her style.

x2!! Perfectly put. I have HD 600's (not 650's) with Zu, and Pro 750's with Drew's (moon-audio) Silver Dragon. The 600 is open, mellow, nice for classical music. It is not even my favorite open phone -- that award goes to the beyer 880/600 ohm (technically semi-open. Also my cable is still stock but that is about to change) -- nonetheless I wouldn't give up the 600, and it gets a lot of use between me and my wife.

The Ultrasone Pro 750 is like having a wild teenager at home -- you don't toss them away, but they're a handful. What a sound and soundstage -- amazing. Sometimes very real, sometimes not from this earth. Love it or hate it. I love it. It's a closed can for darn sure. Unique. Fantastic with the right type of music (and that's hard to predict -- today's current up-tempo heavily processed lighter rock and pop sure sound great). We do a lot of HP listening here, and the 750 is never far away from me.

If I could only have one HP from what I own today it would be the beyer 880/600 first, the 750 second, and the 600 third. Lucky no one can make me make that choice!

 

[dookiex]

Actually, the apple stock earbuds are technically the worst phones that Senns ever released

I really don't feel that the HD650s run circles around the Pro/Proline 750/2500 and the other way around either. They are two pretty different sounding sounds and depending on which one your prefer, you can't go wrong. I just wouldn't mix using the HD650s ever since the Ultrasones are much more accurate for that purpose.

 

[FallenAngel]

Sold the Pro750 (recabled) and kept the HD650. Good amp with HD650 makes them fantastic, kind of boring driven off an amp that's not as good. Pro750 though don't scale as well - they're nice, good while amped, but never great while well amped.

 

[dookiex]

I've never plugged them into monster amps. Are you saying that bigger beefier amps will distort the Pro/Proline 750/2500? They are pretty low impedance at 40 ohms.