[TKSingh]

Fred,
I would be very interested in a detailed review of the Scout. I would also love a review of the Unify arm (maybe on a Clearaudio Championor Solution) and if you have access maybe a comparably set up Basis 1400

Ken

 

[Tuberoller]

I can do the Champion but not the Basis.I am also gonna try to get a few Bluenote tables from Todd Green of Headroom and Todd the Vinyl Junkie fame to review.I heard these at CES and really,really liked them.They have some great tables and arms as well as phono stages.

All the stories you have heard about the Clearaudio tables being difficult to set-up are true.The massive amounts of acrylic don't bode well for precisise machine work.

 

[Zanth]

A review would be marvelous. I am exceptionally interested in finding out how the Scout could out perform its big brothers.

 

[Tuberoller]

Quote:

Originally posted by Zanth A review would be marvelous. I am exceptionally interested in finding out how the Scout could out perform its big brothers.

The review in last month's Stereophile alluded to this.I agree to an extent.I still think the Scout is one of the best sounding tables I have ever heard.I'll post a review later this week.

 

[Scott Naylor]

Tuberoller-

Thanks for your thoughts on turntables, but I've got to stick my neck out and challenge a couple of things you've said about Regas and Linns. I can't dispute the set-up considerations of the LP-12 - I worked for a Linn dealer for several years and have set-up so many I sometimes dream about them. Not all happy dreams, btw. People like to mess around with them and it's possible to totally screw up what the thing is capable of if you've not learned the many tricks to getting them dialed in. .. so the recommendation of a used LP-12 always has the caveat of needing access to good set-up help or the patience to learn.

All Regas running fast. Okay, here's one way to make a Rega run fast - don't level the platter. One of the idiosyncracies about the design is that when placed on a perfectly level surface the platter will not be absolutely level because of how the weight is distributed among the three feet. The shelf needs to be adjusted to account for this. On the P2 and older P3, running fast is also a symptom of a worn belt. It's pretty darn hard for a P9 to run fast unless the power supply/motor has been mucked with in some way - the thing is designed to run at perfect speed and the power supply helps control that. There's a P9 here at the house and it's running absolutely spot on according to the strobe, as does two of my hi-fi nut buddies who also own the deck.

Yes, there are some Regas out there running fast and some that are running slow, but reading your comments implies this is a problem unique to them. I just listened to a Scout - a 'table that I think breaks new ground for VPI musically and like a lot - and we checked it. Oops, running over 1% slow. I've seen $10k+ rigs - including VPI's- that have been ultimately off one way or the other even after optimum set-up. Okay, enough about 'table speed.

Here's my fundamental beef - there are basic, important musical differences between how Rega/Linn 'tables portray music and, say, VPI and Basis 'tables do that has nothing to do with what speed the turntable is running at. I prefer the musical presentation of a correct-speed running LP-12 ,P9 or a Xerxes to a correct-speed running Aries or Basis 2500. A person could manipulate a VPI (well, some are easier than others) and Basis to run fast and this does not change my impression. I've done it, btw, just to put my own crazy views to the test.

Finally, your comment that Rega 'tables are out-of date designs borders on mean-spirited, mate. The materials and techniques used on the tables are the result of design and engineering choices. Roy and Phil have tried everything out there - acrylic, carbon fibre, composites, mass damping...you name it - and the materials they use are what meets the desired performance outcome. Now, a person is entitled to prefer the sound of another company's product that's for sure.

My hope is that all this does not sound antagonistic - I've really liked the tone of this board here because it's so devoid of the garbage that goes on on many of the others - this is just presented as an alternative view. Hey, we certainly agree on the Scout! It's a killer rig.

with kind regards,
Scott

 

[Scott Naylor]

Tuberoller, forgot to pick at you about your Clearaudio comment too! Aren't you lucky today. I've had the chance to set up every one of their 'tables currently in the line except the Champion 2 and found their build quality to be exemplary. The only finicky aspect is that the linear-tracking arms are very sensitive to set-up to work properly, but this has nothing to do with build quality. The fit/finish on the Master Reference is scary good and there's a lot of trickle-down through the line. Besides, I thought one of the inherent advantages to acrylic was it's an excellent material to work with for meeting high-tolerance machining criteria.

Just another .02. Oh, and by the way, as you've guessed I don't really care for the sound of the Clearaudios regardless of what speed they're running.

The Unify arm sure seems a great value - it's cool looking and nice to set-up, but beware the tonearm cable is on the short side.

smiles,
Scott

 

[00940]

Troll ?

 

[Tuberoller]

Quote:

Originally posted by angel_teres I don't think Mr.Tuberoller has the 21 tables he claims to and doubt even more that he has the expertise he makes claim to.His comments border on insanity and exhibit the lack of any real knowledge in table set up or use. Let's see some pics of your 21 tables.Or how about all the cartridges you claim to have reviewed.I will reserve ultimate judgement until I see the proof. Angel

What's your damage? I see that you live in Chicago.I'm sure we can arrange a visit if you are gonna be a good boy.I have every bit of gear I say I do and most likely more,as I have lost count.


I see you are new here.We are usually much more cordial to one another around here and we try to keep the flames at bay.You sound like a troll.

 

[carlo]

Quote:

Here's my fundamental beef - there are basic, important musical differences between how Rega/Linn 'tables portray music and, say, VPI and Basis 'tables do that has nothing to do with what speed the turntable is running at. - Scott Naylor

Aye. A PRaT minded source in the right type of system is just so damned musically involving that it can't be quantified. Its not a detail or bass or anything else issue, its just music. I still vote that the Planar 3 (I haven't heard a P3 yet) is the best stock table under $1k when properly set up. Throw an OL arm in and worlds open up.

I'm reitterating but whatever, the Basis 1400/OL RB250 didn't hold me. The VPI mk III and IV w/OL RB250 was too hi-fi. The Scout/JMW 9 was what made me forget my old analog rig. The Scout gets the groove of the Rega but is quieter, has better pitch/speed, and is cleaner if not groovy.

It should be noted that the Planar 3 has an AC synchornous motor. Having a power source at exactly 60hz solves most speed problems.

 

[Tuberoller]

hey Scott,

Thanks for the input.I hear you loud and clear.I know that table speed plays far less a role in overall sonic character than the basic design of the table itself.I'm also aware of how crucial leveling a table is.I always level the platter.I have isolation bases as well as leveling shelves, etc.I guess my major complaint with most Regas and Linns and Clearaudios is difficulty in set-up.For the vast majority of listeners proper set-up remains elusive.The problems with Regas running fast has had so much written about it,it could literally fill volumes.The Review in Stereophile last month mentions this as well and goes on to further state that this is most likely a design flaw of Rega tables.I know how to set-up a table.I have all the tools,the experience and knowledge to ignore measurements when things don't hash and adjust for best sound.If you want the real nitty gritty on table set-up difficulty talk to the guys at Music Direct.They sell Clearaudio,VPI and Rega.Ask which tables they think offer the best performance,ease of set-up,etc.I sold about 110 VPI tables and had three(all HW-19 variants) that ran at incorrect speed(all slow).Unfortuantely all those tables had to be sent back because speed adjustment on the HW-19 is difficult or impossible.I know we won't do much to change one another's perspective but you are so nice about it I hate to disagree with you.

I always love talking analog gear and you sound like you know your way around an table.I would love for you to come to the meet at my house in April so we can do some analog stuff and listen to some music and all the great gear we will have on hand.thanks for being civil.

 

[Scott Naylor]

Tuberoller-

Hello and thanks for the lively banter! Yes, I'm sure Music Direct has product favorites as well they should. I had favorites too and it was odd how that always seemed to be what I ended up persuading people towards. I've had good experiences with Music Direct as far as buying records, have met the guys, and they seem a first-class lot. They do seem to be somewhat at odds with themselves as they sell Rega, are quite vocal with the tune "all Regas run fast", and tout an aftermarket acrylic platter as the way to finally realize your Rega's full potential. Oh well!

As I'm thinking aloud, I guess I'm just wishing for a perfect world where everyone could get to listen to at least a couple two or three of the many fine analogue products out there and have their choice supported by a competent local-ish dealer. That's not the case and so we find mailorder filling a niche. Anyway, none of that furthers anything one way or the other and yes, I'll probably always choose a Linn over a VPI and you won't and we'll both enjoy music yes?

Hey, thanks for the invite for April. Maybe if my health permits I can come and torment you in person.

many kind regards,
Scott

 

[Tuberoller]

Scott,

Those guys at Music Direct have long since established favorites.I gotta eat some of my words,however.I talked with one of the guys at MD a few hours ago and he said the easiest tables to set-up are the Pro-jects.I told him he destroyed my argument but he was persistent and even yelled out loud to one of the other guys who loudly concurred.He did say he thinks VPIs sound best with a great cartridge but gave the low bucks,ease of set-up and cost-performance ratio win to the Musichall and Pro-ject tables.

I really do hope your health allows you to attend our meet.I'm sorry to hear your are'nt doing well,and wish you a speedy and complete recovery from whatever health concerns you have.

 

[Ohoen]

Tuberoller, is there any chance you'll be getting a Bottlehead Seduction for reviewing anytime soon? My Rat Shack pre is perfectly acceptable in my setup but I still feel the shame... I'd also be really interested in your thoughts on Thorens tables. Budget, budget, budget. Analog is a tough shoe to polish for University students.

 

[gavinbirss]

Noname ....

My suggestiion is not to go for a particular brand but rather the technology and the ruggedness of the design.

Any well built and rugged deck with a strong motor and a platter that does not vibrate will do.

Any good mechanical tonearm will also do. (look out for linear tracking ones)

On the cartridge side look at what is selling the best.
(hint Denon MC 103)

Happy listening ...
Gavin

 

[TKSingh]

Tube, where's that review !