Turntable chosen... Let the upgrades begin!

[memepool]

http://www.cartridgedb.com/resonance...p?cdesc=Empire 500 ID&cmass=5.3&ccomp=20

According to the cartridge db the Empire is not a great match for the Pioneer arm but just to be sure this is accurate I'll double check in some old magazines.

I found original spares on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...OMOBOX:NEWLIST

and JICO make one too

http://www.export-japan.com/marketin...roducts_id=334

It must be a pretty good quality cart anyway if JICO are charging that much as their prices are usually very reasonable.

I'll have a dig and let you know.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Here are the specifications from the back of the box (courtesy of an eBay seller who's selling the cartridge for $49.50 shipped.

Quote:

Empire 500 ID Cartridge Specifications Frequency Response Bandwidth - 6Hz-35,000Hz Frequency Response - 20Hz-23,000Hz +-1 3/4 dB Tracking Force Range - 3/4 to 3 1/2 grams (not sure about the first number) Recommended Tracking Force - 1.0 grams Separation - @ 200Hz (21dB), @ 1kHz (30dB), @ 5kHz (20dB), @ 12.5kHz (17dB) LM Distortion - @ 9.54 cm/sec - 0.3%, @ 14.5 cm/sec - 0.4% Stylus Shape and Size - 0.2 x 0.7 [unit?] bi-radial elliptical Cantilever - Boron vapor internally damped, tapered aluminum alloy Effective Tip Mass - 0.6 mg Compliance (Dynamic) - 20 x 10^(-x) cm/dyne, (Static) - 28.5 x 10^(-6) cm/dyne Tracking Ability - @ 300Hz - 17.9 cm/sec, @ 1kHz - 38 cm/sec Channel Balance - within 1.0 dB Vertical Tracking Angle - 20 deg Output - @ 1kHz @ 3.54 cm/sec - 4.0 mV Number and Type of Magnets - 2.5 ... [?] (Moving Magnet) Load Resistance - 47k Ohms Capacitance - 150 pF Hum Sensitivity @ 60 Hz - 0.94 uV..etc. Total Weight - 5.3 grams Stylus Replacement No. & Color - S500 ID (Purple)

I figure the tracking force and weight information will be helpful...

 

[infinitesymphony]

According to the PL-400 manual, the tracking force of the stock PC-150 cartridge was 2.2 to 2.5 grams. The manual also says, "You can attach any cartridge weighing between 4g and 9g to this tonearm provided that only the accessory headshell is used with it."

 

[memepool]

The specs are fairly average although the tracking weight is a bit suspect. Usually only Moving Coils need anything over 2 grams to track securely and the range seems far too wide which suggests a dated design perhaps.

Certainly Hi-Fi Choice weren't impressed back in 1977 and classed it as below par. Although that could have been based on the price, they gave the ADC QLM 34 III 'best-buy' status and it wasn't much cheaper. The ADC cost £18 against £23 for the Empire back then and both were being imported from the US so the playing field was fairly level.

They also said the Empire was suited to low mass arms in the 4-10g range which is more in agree ment with the cartridge database.

Certainly Empire did make good carts but this doesn't seem to have been one of them so as it doesn't seem to be a good match for your arm I'd just go for the ADC cart for now.

In the future I would search for a low mass ADC magnesium headshell on ebay and this will allow wider choice of carts or if your reciever has an MC input then I'd maybe go for somehting like a Denon DL110.

You might also consider building your own phonostage from one of the kits that have been mentioned by others as the phono sections on some recievers were not upto much.

I have been listening to a Pioneer SX 676 lately and the phonostage is pretty poor compared to the one on my old Marantz reciever (although it sounds great with CD) so not all vintage recievers had great phonostages and very few seemed to have MC capabilities. Another option is the NAD 20 series integrated amps from the early '80s, like the 3020 which has a brilliant phonostage for the money.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Thanks again for the information! Glad to know that I might get a possible upgrade in sound quality.

As it stands, the PL-400 sounds much better than the PL-990 (cheapo) and the pitch control makes me extremely happy, but it could use a sonic upgrade or two.

I found a ADC headshell + QLM 32 MKIII cartridge combo on eBay... Is this a lighter headshell, and is this a risky buy?

I've tried a few different receiver phono stages and they sound pretty similar, so I'll probably stick with the one in the Pioneer Elite A-35R--it's supposed to be decent. It doesn't have moving coil input, so I'll stick with MM unless I get really into vinyl.

After looking around at cartridges, it seems that 17g for a tonearm really is heavy. If I'm correctly reading the graphs at cartridgedb.com, it looks like the AT440ML might also be a good fit... What about the Shure M-97XE? I've read that it's low-mass, though the cartridge DB doesn't have compliance specs on it.

Ah, and is the ADC QLM 34 III that you mentioned much different from the ADC QLM 32 III? It looks like the output voltage is higher, at least.

 

[memepool]

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinitesymphony /img/forum/go_quote.gif I found a ADC headshell + QLM 32 MKIII cartridge combo on eBay... Is this a lighter headshell, and is this a risky buy?

This looks like a Nagaoka headshell with an extra ballast weight underneath which is quite a handy feature. The ADC attached is from an earlier series.
I'm pretty sure this is a lower mass headshell than the one on your Pioneer so yes it's a good buy but the cartridge I'll have to look up.

But personally I'd buy it for the headshell as those are quite rare and this will bring you arm mass down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinitesymphony /img/forum/go_quote.gif After looking around at cartridges, it seems that 17g for a tonearm really is heavy. If I'm correctly reading the graphs at cartridgedb.com, it looks like the AT440ML might also be a good fit... What about the Shure M-97XE? I've read that it's low-mass, though the cartridge DB doesn't have compliance specs on it. Ah, and is the ADC QLM 34 III that you mentioned much different from the ADC QLM 32 III? It looks like the output voltage is higher, at least.

17g is fairly high mass by modern standards but not hugely so. The Shure tracks upto 15g I think with the brush down but the AT I'd have doubts about. Jico have replacements for the ADC carts for 23USD so it's a fairly small gamble and generally I'd be inclined to replace any stylus off ebay unless the seller is a shop, it's still shrinkwrapped or else or you can inspect it properly.

 

[infinitesymphony]

When you say that the Shure tracks up to 15g, do you mean that it's 2g away from appropriate tracking, or is that well above what I'd need? A 17g tonearm and a 6.6g cartridge with an optimum tracking force of 1.25g...

The ADC QLM 32 MKIII from the auction is also the one that LPgear.com stocks. The QLM 34 seems to be a bit harder to find.

I might be overanalyzing... You said that the QLM is perfect for the headshell I have now--if I get the lighter eBay headshell + cartridge, won't that change the tracking force?

 

[memepool]

You are quite right, I mean the guide arm mass quoted for the Shure is upto 15gms with the brush down becuase the brush provides extra damping.
I have tested a Shure V15V on a Rega RB250 and it's quite happy with the extra damping provided by the brush.

The ADC QLM series (30/32/33/34) were all rated well for higher mass arms apart for the QLM 36 (which came out when the prevaling trend in arm mass was getting lower towards the end of the 1970's) according to my old magazines.
The difference between the MkI / II / III was that the stylus tips were finer.

The general sound of these will be not unlike the Shure, with a good rich bass, transparent flat midrange and gently rolled off treble above 15-18khz. A classic '70s warm vintage sound.

The ADC magnesium headshells have a mass of around 6-7 grams compared to the 10-11gms of the satndard Pioneer so that would give you an overall arm mass of 12-13 gms which is more akin to a standard modern tonearm like the Rega RB250.

That headshell you found I think is Nagaoka but I can't see any brand name on it. I can see that it has a compartment for ballast weights under the cartridge mount which suggests it is a low mass headshell with provision to vary the mass so therefore a good buy and as I said JICO make decent cheap replacements as well as LP gear for the ADC QLM series so it's advisable to change the stylus if you buy a 2nd hand one.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Is there any way to check the total weight of the headshell + tonearm?

How 'bout a few pictures?

I just asked the eBay seller of the headshell + cartridge ADC QLM 32 MKIII about it, and here's what he had to say:

-stylus replaced with a Pfanstiehl aftermarket stylus
-complete unit weighs 14 grams
-headshells believed to be Technics

Is it still a good deal? I'm really torn between buying the ADC cart separately (from LPGear) or buying a new headshell and something like the M-97XE... It's not much more expensive than the ADC, but the cost of a decent headshell makes the deal a little less sweet.

 

[Black Stuart]

Memepool,
why should'nt IS think about a Pickering XV-15. I have heard the 103 and I reckon the Pickering MM is better, it's what I use on my Kenwood KD990. This comes with a small brush in front of the stylus. I don't like the effect it has on the sound so removed it.

The headshell on his Pioneer is a good solid piece of alu, I definately would'nt change that and as it's a detachable h/shell, no reason why IS should'nt remove it and use a little Blutac as an interface before replacing it - this is very effective at stopping resonances passing from arm to stylus and vice versa.

Infinitesymphony - a good strong wall shelf is, as memepool says essential, that is if your wall can take it. If you have a stud wall (timber struts and plasterboard) this is a different matter.

If you have a suspended timber floor then this can be rectified with proper support from underneath - to isolate your TT from floorborne vibrations is an absolute must - the difference in sound quality cannot be overstated.

Also check out what phono leadout wires you have, as these can be pretty basic even in top quality decks from even a few years ago but first get your deck on a solid support system, wall or floor and take it from there - do not rush.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif The headshell on his Pioneer is a good solid piece of alu, I definately would'nt change that and as it's a detachable h/shell, no reason why IS should'nt remove it and use a little Blutac as an interface before replacing it - this is very effective at stopping resonances passing from arm to stylus and vice versa. ... Also check out what phono leadout wires you have, as these can be pretty basic even in top quality decks from even a few years ago but first get your deck on a solid support system, wall or floor and take it from there - do not rush.

I'm not planning on replacing the headshell unless it's a necessary step in order for me to use a different cartridge. By "phono leadout wires," do you mean the RCA plugs coming out of the tonearm?

 

[memepool]

It's not a question of the weight of the arm and cart rather the mass as the weight is counterbalanced by the counterweight when you set the downforce appropriate to whatever cartridge you choose.
The only way to determine the mass short of recourse to physics equations is to consult the manufacturer I suppose.
The headshell you linked to on ebay doesn't look like a Technics as they usually have circular holes cut out of them, but I am not sure it's a Nagaoka either cometo that as it's not square enough.
So either you can take a chance on it, as on the basis of the ballast attached it would be a logical deduction to assume it's low mass, or else just get the ADC from LPgear and keep an eye out for the ADC LM1 like the one cgrums has just got.

Black Stuarts recommendation of the Pickering is also a good one but I think this will also require a lowering of arm mass as does the Shure.

 

[infinitesymphony]

That makes sense... I'll probably go for the ADC from LPGear, since I trust them more than this eBay seller (who spelled Technics "Techniques"

), and I'll be buying a bunch of stuff from them anyway. Is this Audiotechnica MG-10 similar to what I should be looking for in a headshell replacement?

 

[memepool]

Yes that Audio Technica is the modern equivalent of the ADC LM1 but I am not sure about the design of the mounting holes since that doesn't seem to allow for any alignment of the cart in headshell which is not a great.

But I saw this

http://cgi.ebay.com/ADC-XLM-ll-PHONO...QQcmdZViewItem

which includes a better series of ADC cart (2 up form the basic QLM) and also the original ADC magnesium headshell. These were sold together because the cart is actually of medium / high compliance so the idea was to fit this low mass headshell to make it compatible with older higher mass arms which is exactly the solution which you want.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Whoa, thanks for the link! That's tempting! It looks like LPGear is also selling the headshell + cartridge for $74.95.

Quote:

"In addition the cartridge includes an ADC headshell to fit plug in European and Japanese type turntables."

Will it also work with a U.S. model like mine?

Is the headshell a proprietary mount or standard mount? Also, I have to ask what you think the sound quality will be like in comparison to other cartridges (including the aforementioned QLM and M-97XE)

.

Quote:

"We...will guarantee to provide you with a replacement stylus for as long as you own this cartridge."

That seems like a nice deal from the eBay seller.

Edit: Reading about the features of the XLM II is making me even more enthusiastic about the cartridge... "[The XLM II's] tracking angle is adjustable enough to compensate for any straight tonearm height." So, this combination would allow me to adjust VTA, offset angle, and overhang just as a function of the headshell + cartridge... Hmm.

Edit #2: I see that there's an ADC XLM II and an ADC XLM II Improved. Apparently, there were some high-compliance issues where the cartridge would bottom out... Not exactly good news for my setup.