[papa_mia]

@toranku Out of curiosity, between Vision Ears VE8 and Pears SH3, which one would you consider to be the more versatile all rounder?
Which one is more suited to listen to orchestral music as well as rock / heavy metal from your experience?
I am easily able to demo ve8 but not so easily able to demo Pears lineup unfortunately

You realize you just asked a Pears employee about to pears or not to pears, right?

 

[Spie1904]

You realize you just asked a Pears employee about to pears or not to pears, right?

Oh you!
I’m interested in the pears quite a lot but I’m doubting on how much apex of audio64 would help in allowing longer listening sessions without discomfort.
I also prefer listening at low volume as my hearing is important to me.
Hence I’m kind of stuck between pears (what the heart wants for the flush and very isolating fit. Besides less is more philosophy on driver count matches my perception) or Audio64 (what marketing would say helps with longer listening sessions due to apex).

edit: besides because of size, there is a chance audio64 can at most do a6t for me instead of the desired A12T at which point I have more faith in pears for lower driver count solid sound

 

[toranku]

You realize you just asked a Pears employee about to pears or not to pears, right?

Wish I was paid!

 

[Randysch]

@toranku thank you for your great work and shearing your experience! For me it is awesome to read opinions while somebody isn't paid for or get the reviewed IEM for free.
I'm looking to get two IEM one neutral and one little more consumer orientated one. For the neutral ones I have B2, S8 or PP8 in mind. For the other I thought about M7 or go all in for 8sl or VX if they are worth the higher price.
What are your thoughts and which 2 IEMs would you pick?

 

[TooPoorForHiFi]

@toranku was the Monarch impression the "Correct" unit?

 

[toranku]

@toranku was the Monarch impression the "Correct" unit?

Nope, and I have not tried the fixed monarch and Clair yet

 

[arjuna93]

My thoughts on: Canal Works U77

Have you tried L05QD2? How do these two compare?

 

[Pricklyears101]

Wow it's been awhile since I've been here. Saw that @toranku has his personal take on EX800ST/EX1000 target curves, I decided to try them on my E1DA Powerdac v2 since it has PEQ and holy moly. Reminds me of the MEGA BASS setting on the old sony ericsson walkman phones! Definitely had a good chuckle to myself. And that's no way a bad thing, it's a good thing actually personally for me. That was the thing that got me into this 'hobby' all these years ago, and I've been chasing that sound signature every since with only muscle memory to go by.

Now on to my point of comparison. As someone who generally leans towards somewhere around the harman target curve but too lazy to do one for myself, I've been pretty happy with the filter someone else has already done as a preset for the EX1000 in the PDV2. Whoever you are, god bless you bro. Here's the aforementioned person's take:

It works well for both ex800ST and ex1000.

And here's Toranku's take for the ex800st:

The text file can't be imported into the pdv2 so i had to manually recreate his peq numbers with my thumbs and fingers, with around 2hz margin of error. It is definitely interesting though listening to other's take on things. I wont go much into detailed comparisons, as both they achieve my objective of smoothing the high peaks and giving some bass boost but in their own ways which plays out interestingly with different songs played, and cuz I'm too lazy to go into critical listening mode. They are both made to be enjoyed. All in all, nice work!

 

[toranku]

Have you tried L05QD2? How do these two compare?

I've not tried the canal works stuff for 2 years so I cant comment

What are your thoughts and which 2 IEMs would you pick?

@Randysch Perhaps start with S8 first. See if you can get a used one on the low

 

[arjuna93]

I've not tried the canal works stuff for 2 years so I cant comment

Thanks for reply. I decided to go for L05QD2 – will say what I think when they arrive.

 

[toranku]

Personal Favorites updated

I chose to remove Sony IER-M9 and Hidition NT6 this time and introduced Empire Ears Odin and Craft Ears SIX. My preference and need for a proper bass shelf shows itself here - the M9 doesn't cut it anymore with its more midbass and warmth centric tilt while NT6 lacks subbass.

I've also managed to try qdc 8CL (CIEM) which does sound different from the universal 8SL/Gemini. Treble is much more tamed and the spike does not show. This however, does take a toll on its imaging and its transients do sound more blunted and wooly.

 

[eloelo]

Personal Favorites updated

I chose to remove Sony IER-M9 and Hidition NT6 this time and introduced Empire Ears Odin and Craft Ears SIX. My preference and need for a proper bass shelf shows itself here - the M9 doesn't cut it anymore with its more midbass and warmth centric tilt while NT6 lacks subbass.

I've also managed to try qdc 8CL (CIEM) which does sound different from the universal 8SL/Gemini. Treble is much more tamed and the spike does not show. This however, does take a toll on its imaging and its transients do sound more blunted and wooly.

8cl really does sound that different huh. Are there any bonuses to treble extension or nah? Would demoing it by jamming in the ear have slightly different sound impression than a perfect fit on the actual owner?

8cl does feel a bit different from the 8sl which I demoed, though noted my source used is different. I also find 8cl is be quite source/digital filter/cable sensitive, but I'm ununable to reproduce 8sl from memory. I would have to A/B to be sure

 

[mjoleksy]

Personal Favourites

I've been asked quite a number of times as to what I liked best. Thought I'd throw down some IEMs that I enjoy a fair bit. Keep in mind that this is my personal opinion and this list can and will change over time. Some of the factors that help evaluate are "timbre", "tonal balance", "transient response/clarity" and "technicalities". The order is not a ranking.

Empire Ears Odin: Bassy Neutral
Empire Ears' newest flagship strays away from their typical house sound that often lends itself to a lot of bass bloat. The bass shelf is kept cleaner which reduces a lot of midbass bloating and bleed. The character of the Odin is bass boosted but kept neutral in the entire midrange and treble. A slightly warm, bassier sound with tonally good mids. The dynamism of the Odin keeps itself sounding realistic and fun; and in particular finds itself incredibly suited for rendering mainstream modern pop (i.e Carly Rae Jepsen & Dua Lipa) music amazing. Big, audible bass lines with great impact without "dirtying" up the midrange too far.

However where the Odin does slightly stumble is with detail in sacrifice of a fun, bassier sound. The highs of the Odin are a tad dark too - I could definitely use more treble. Perhaps the relaxed treble tuning (in contrast to its forward bass) bottlenecks the detail behind its sound. The technical ability of the Odin is really quite solid as well and I have no qualms with the soundstage and imaging. You'll get used to the tactile bass-first approach quickly. Naturally the Odin finds itself quickly on my personal favourites/

PEARS SH3: Uppermid-Forward Neutral
Check my review. In short, pretty technical IEM that places lead instruments and vocals forward with good treble extension and coherence. Plenty midrange detail but lacks in bass resolve, particularly subbass extension. Excellent vocals with a beautiful midrange tonality.

Etymotic ER2 Series
When the brand "Etymotic" is mentioned, some would associate the brand with terms such as "clinical" and "sterile". I personally think this holds true for the ER3 and ER4 series. The tuning on the 3 and 4 lacks warmth and exhibit what I refer to as "BA timbre". I find that BA lacks that natural body and decay of DDs and instead can sound grainier and leaner. However when it comes to the ER2, I think that Etymotic has done a great job to change this preconception. The DDs used in the ER2 have a very smooth and pleasing response, as if it was rid of any peaks. The ER2 has a much more natural timbre (and tone) to my ears with its elevated bass response and depth in the sound.

I've had chats and discussions with some audio friends of mine regarding what defines resolution. Some claim that ER4 still offers better "resolution" over the smoother ER2. Some say that the grain in the ER3/4 is texture and is what defines resolution. Yada yada. For me, the ER2 is able to reproduce transients as clean, if not cleaner than the ER4. It does so in a smooth, very natural way. Take for example, the resonance in the low keys of the piano. The ER2 presents those lines/resonances in a bodied expression whereas ER4 has greater emphasis on the initial attack. Which type of presentation is better is up to the individual to decide. I think resolution is quite an all-encompassing term. It's a mixture of factors such as transient response and timbre imo.

If not, the ER2 is not as bright in the 8-10k region which makes it a more relaxing and laid back listen. Makes the ER4 sound a bit peaky, heh. I do also feel that ER2 extends much better in the mid to upper treble region where it does cymbal decay very nicely. I do think that if the ER2 had more brightness in the 8-10k region like the ER4, it would be a very very good curve.

Last point about the ER2 is that the driver packs some serious speed. It doesn't sound congested despite the typical "etymotic soundstage". Everything layers properly as it should. I think it's the fastest DD I've heard to date in an IEM. Overall, just a very good IEM. XR or SE...I think I would suggest most to spring for SE as XR can be a bit too dark sounding with its bass boost. SE has better overall balance but XR's clean subbass lift helps the bass to roar.

I do think it can be a bit ridiculous to put the ER2 next to all the top dogs - but hey this is just a list of personal favourites. The ER2 excels in the areas it is supposed to. Which is why I like it.

Craft Ears Craft SIX: W-Shaped
See my review. I do feel that the CE6 has some of the most impressive, very cleanly boosted bass I've heard in an inear. However despite the impressive bass, the CE6's weakness is with the overall balance in its treble. The lower treble finds itself recessed and upper treble boosted, which renders instruments such as cymbals to be very colored albeit fun with massive shimmer. The upper treble boost is a double edged sword for an audiophile - it absolutely reveals the noise and artifacts of poorer mixed & mastered recordings. Where the CE6 absolutely shines however is with its imaging & soundstaging - hyper accurate positioning of instruments with laser-like precision.

qdc 8SL/Gemini: Bass Boosted
The reason why I didn't include the Anole VX is because the VX has a further lift in the lower-mid treble region which makes it a bit harsh and aggressive to listen to in an extended period of time. 8SL/Gemini strikes a better balance in the FR for me. Both of them offer a great soundstage, fantastic level of separation/layering, cleanly reproduced transients free of smearing and great extension on both ends. The 8SH has a further lift in the 1-2k region but I find that this lift made vocals a bit too shrill and unnatural sounding since 8SH's vocals are not as warm too. If not, the 8SL/Gemini sports decent bass - has the speed and attack to make it an engaging listen.

However in certain tracks, the bass of the 8SL/Gemini can sound a tad hollow and "BA-like". If not I feel that the both are very well tuned with solid technicalities and decent enough tonal balance.

Shure KSE1200/1500: Bright
A friend once shared an analogy with me - "hearing the KSE is like putting on your glasses in the morning". I think this holds true. The KSE is a detail monster - it sounds like 4K resolution where you're coming from 1080p. It's just so damn clear (PLEASE USE FOAM TIPS btw). It captures every resonance, every naunce in the track. It's cliche to say, but I do hear things I've never heard before with the KSE. The resolution and detail it provides is simply outstanding and sits at the very top in that category. Add that with it's crazy speed and it also never congests. Just so damn fast. It does have a small-ish soundstage but it won't matter because the music is flashing past by in HD.

The KSE's weakness would be it's tonal balance. Has this peak at 2k which makes vocals sound a bit unnatural. It does put electric guitars forward in the mix though. Other than that, I find the bass well extended (if it isn't well extended then the fit is definitely a bit off) and has a lift to provide some warmth. Treble has that great sizzling decay with immense speed and clarity.

Fearless x Crinacle "Dawn": Subbass Boosted Neutral
Very slightly warm tonality for that sense of naturalness. Overall really solid tuning that I identify with. Subbass reaches down low albeit can use even more definition. Maybe I'm just being unrealistic at this point. Midbass carries a good punch without bloat. Upperbass bloat isn't present. For low volume listeners like me, this makes total sense in terms of tuning. I get bass without turning it up. Midrange is just as well tuned as the bass - it does have have a small hump at 1-3khz that benefits it by allowing for clear, more forward vocal voicing. I don't find it thin. YMMV.

Treble region does carry some peaks from 3-10khz. Occasionally in some songs the treble does jump out suddenly. But I don't think it's a problem. Could use more upper end air but due to the sufficient overall lower and middle treble, it isn't a big concern; but certainly something that can be improved upon. The EST actually does nothing here. It has very close to no output next to its very much more sensitive woofers and tweeters. On a technical level the Dawn does perform good. Spaced out instrument separation though the presentation is more "diffuse" where the sound is closer and larger than I would like, especially with bass transients at times. Its a little unfocused sounding. Transient response wise, I do just wish this impacts a bit harder. If not it's dynamics are quite well in line with majority of IEMs out there. I don't think I've heard the IEM that has the dynamics of a speaker yet.

By FR the 300-1000hz range is kept "flat" and free of bloat. I do think it's a key point with the sound design of the IEM. As noted by my own preference curve, I enjoy IEMs flat in that region. This is one of those IEMs that are a solid all rounder. I've thrown all my genres at it and it works with everything. Great effort from both Fearless and Crinacle here. I had doubts with the bass boost (as seen on graph) but in reality it was not boomy nor overwhelming for me. It's at a satisfying level.

Timbre is on the smooth side of things. Got accustomed to the treble peaks quickly. In an ideal world I would ask for even more resolution with even lesser transient smearing (which it already performs well in) but I guess I'm being too unrealistic. Can be even detailed if this had further treble extension. Lacks a bit of the "zing" from cymbals sometimes.

changelog:
22 Dec 19: Replaced PP8 with NT6.
29 Mar 20: Added Dawn.
20 August 20: Replaced IER-M9 & NT6 with Odin & CE6

Do prefer 8SL or Gemini--S??

 

[toranku]

8cl really does sound that different huh. Are there any bonuses to treble extension or nah? Would demoing it by jamming in the ear have slightly different sound impression than a perfect fit on the actual owner?

8cl does feel a bit different from the 8sl which I demoed, though noted my source used is different. I also find 8cl is be quite source/digital filter/cable sensitive, but I'm ununable to reproduce 8sl from memory. I would have to A/B to be sure

Typically ciems boast greater treble extension but its not always 100% the case.

Yes, fitting someone else's ciem would yield different results than from your own ciem (assuming same model) due to different amounts of residual air volume in the canal as well as potential differences in tubing length.

Do prefer 8SL or Gemini--S??

Both are really quite close

 

[mvvRAZ]

Personal Favourites

I've been asked quite a number of times as to what I liked best. Thought I'd throw down some IEMs that I enjoy a fair bit. Keep in mind that this is my personal opinion and this list can and will change over time. Some of the factors that help evaluate are "timbre", "tonal balance", "transient response/clarity" and "technicalities". The order is not a ranking.

Empire Ears Odin: Bassy Neutral
Empire Ears' newest flagship strays away from their typical house sound that often lends itself to a lot of bass bloat. The bass shelf is kept cleaner which reduces a lot of midbass bloating and bleed. The character of the Odin is bass boosted but kept neutral in the entire midrange and treble. A slightly warm, bassier sound with tonally good mids. The dynamism of the Odin keeps itself sounding realistic and fun; and in particular finds itself incredibly suited for rendering mainstream modern pop (i.e Carly Rae Jepsen & Dua Lipa) music amazing. Big, audible bass lines with great impact without "dirtying" up the midrange too far.

However where the Odin does slightly stumble is with detail in sacrifice of a fun, bassier sound. The highs of the Odin are a tad dark too - I could definitely use more treble. Perhaps the relaxed treble tuning (in contrast to its forward bass) bottlenecks the detail behind its sound. The technical ability of the Odin is really quite solid as well and I have no qualms with the soundstage and imaging. You'll get used to the tactile bass-first approach quickly. Naturally the Odin finds itself quickly on my personal favourites/

PEARS SH3: Uppermid-Forward Neutral
Check my review. In short, pretty technical IEM that places lead instruments and vocals forward with good treble extension and coherence. Plenty midrange detail but lacks in bass resolve, particularly subbass extension. Excellent vocals with a beautiful midrange tonality.

Etymotic ER2 Series
When the brand "Etymotic" is mentioned, some would associate the brand with terms such as "clinical" and "sterile". I personally think this holds true for the ER3 and ER4 series. The tuning on the 3 and 4 lacks warmth and exhibit what I refer to as "BA timbre". I find that BA lacks that natural body and decay of DDs and instead can sound grainier and leaner. However when it comes to the ER2, I think that Etymotic has done a great job to change this preconception. The DDs used in the ER2 have a very smooth and pleasing response, as if it was rid of any peaks. The ER2 has a much more natural timbre (and tone) to my ears with its elevated bass response and depth in the sound.

I've had chats and discussions with some audio friends of mine regarding what defines resolution. Some claim that ER4 still offers better "resolution" over the smoother ER2. Some say that the grain in the ER3/4 is texture and is what defines resolution. Yada yada. For me, the ER2 is able to reproduce transients as clean, if not cleaner than the ER4. It does so in a smooth, very natural way. Take for example, the resonance in the low keys of the piano. The ER2 presents those lines/resonances in a bodied expression whereas ER4 has greater emphasis on the initial attack. Which type of presentation is better is up to the individual to decide. I think resolution is quite an all-encompassing term. It's a mixture of factors such as transient response and timbre imo.

If not, the ER2 is not as bright in the 8-10k region which makes it a more relaxing and laid back listen. Makes the ER4 sound a bit peaky, heh. I do also feel that ER2 extends much better in the mid to upper treble region where it does cymbal decay very nicely. I do think that if the ER2 had more brightness in the 8-10k region like the ER4, it would be a very very good curve.

Last point about the ER2 is that the driver packs some serious speed. It doesn't sound congested despite the typical "etymotic soundstage". Everything layers properly as it should. I think it's the fastest DD I've heard to date in an IEM. Overall, just a very good IEM. XR or SE...I think I would suggest most to spring for SE as XR can be a bit too dark sounding with its bass boost. SE has better overall balance but XR's clean subbass lift helps the bass to roar.

I do think it can be a bit ridiculous to put the ER2 next to all the top dogs - but hey this is just a list of personal favourites. The ER2 excels in the areas it is supposed to. Which is why I like it.

Craft Ears Craft SIX: W-Shaped
See my review. I do feel that the CE6 has some of the most impressive, very cleanly boosted bass I've heard in an inear. However despite the impressive bass, the CE6's weakness is with the overall balance in its treble. The lower treble finds itself recessed and upper treble boosted, which renders instruments such as cymbals to be very colored albeit fun with massive shimmer. The upper treble boost is a double edged sword for an audiophile - it absolutely reveals the noise and artifacts of poorer mixed & mastered recordings. Where the CE6 absolutely shines however is with its imaging & soundstaging - hyper accurate positioning of instruments with laser-like precision.

qdc 8SL/Gemini: Bass Boosted
The reason why I didn't include the Anole VX is because the VX has a further lift in the lower-mid treble region which makes it a bit harsh and aggressive to listen to in an extended period of time. 8SL/Gemini strikes a better balance in the FR for me. Both of them offer a great soundstage, fantastic level of separation/layering, cleanly reproduced transients free of smearing and great extension on both ends. The 8SH has a further lift in the 1-2k region but I find that this lift made vocals a bit too shrill and unnatural sounding since 8SH's vocals are not as warm too. If not, the 8SL/Gemini sports decent bass - has the speed and attack to make it an engaging listen.

However in certain tracks, the bass of the 8SL/Gemini can sound a tad hollow and "BA-like". If not I feel that the both are very well tuned with solid technicalities and decent enough tonal balance.

Shure KSE1200/1500: Bright
A friend once shared an analogy with me - "hearing the KSE is like putting on your glasses in the morning". I think this holds true. The KSE is a detail monster - it sounds like 4K resolution where you're coming from 1080p. It's just so damn clear (PLEASE USE FOAM TIPS btw). It captures every resonance, every naunce in the track. It's cliche to say, but I do hear things I've never heard before with the KSE. The resolution and detail it provides is simply outstanding and sits at the very top in that category. Add that with it's crazy speed and it also never congests. Just so damn fast. It does have a small-ish soundstage but it won't matter because the music is flashing past by in HD.

The KSE's weakness would be it's tonal balance. Has this peak at 2k which makes vocals sound a bit unnatural. It does put electric guitars forward in the mix though. Other than that, I find the bass well extended (if it isn't well extended then the fit is definitely a bit off) and has a lift to provide some warmth. Treble has that great sizzling decay with immense speed and clarity.

Fearless x Crinacle "Dawn": Subbass Boosted Neutral
Very slightly warm tonality for that sense of naturalness. Overall really solid tuning that I identify with. Subbass reaches down low albeit can use even more definition. Maybe I'm just being unrealistic at this point. Midbass carries a good punch without bloat. Upperbass bloat isn't present. For low volume listeners like me, this makes total sense in terms of tuning. I get bass without turning it up. Midrange is just as well tuned as the bass - it does have have a small hump at 1-3khz that benefits it by allowing for clear, more forward vocal voicing. I don't find it thin. YMMV.

Treble region does carry some peaks from 3-10khz. Occasionally in some songs the treble does jump out suddenly. But I don't think it's a problem. Could use more upper end air but due to the sufficient overall lower and middle treble, it isn't a big concern; but certainly something that can be improved upon. The EST actually does nothing here. It has very close to no output next to its very much more sensitive woofers and tweeters. On a technical level the Dawn does perform good. Spaced out instrument separation though the presentation is more "diffuse" where the sound is closer and larger than I would like, especially with bass transients at times. Its a little unfocused sounding. Transient response wise, I do just wish this impacts a bit harder. If not it's dynamics are quite well in line with majority of IEMs out there. I don't think I've heard the IEM that has the dynamics of a speaker yet.

By FR the 300-1000hz range is kept "flat" and free of bloat. I do think it's a key point with the sound design of the IEM. As noted by my own preference curve, I enjoy IEMs flat in that region. This is one of those IEMs that are a solid all rounder. I've thrown all my genres at it and it works with everything. Great effort from both Fearless and Crinacle here. I had doubts with the bass boost (as seen on graph) but in reality it was not boomy nor overwhelming for me. It's at a satisfying level.

Timbre is on the smooth side of things. Got accustomed to the treble peaks quickly. In an ideal world I would ask for even more resolution with even lesser transient smearing (which it already performs well in) but I guess I'm being too unrealistic. Can be even detailed if this had further treble extension. Lacks a bit of the "zing" from cymbals sometimes.

changelog:
22 Dec 19: Replaced PP8 with NT6.
29 Mar 20: Added Dawn.
20 August 20: Replaced IER-M9 & NT6 with Odin & CE6

:O more treble on the Odin? I found it to be rather bright personally, definitely at the limit of what I find enjoyable. I could see some more upper treble being enjoyable to give the sense of exaggerated extension, but it is very airy and open sounding already

just out of curiosity, what source do you use with it?