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Thoughts on a bunch of DACs (and why delta-sigma kinda sucks, just to get you to think about stuff)

Discussion in 'Dedicated Source Components' started by purrin, Dec 5, 2013.
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  1. purrin
    It's all in the spec sheet. There are papers on the Internet on how to deal with the glitching using methods other than sample and hold amps.
  2. prot
    You can't and shouldn't send me a free iggy.
  3. purrin
    Actually the SACD/DSD one.
  4. eddypoon
    Jesus, isn't that actually should be considered at 80-bits of accuracy for rendition? 
    OH MY GOD......   
  5. evanft
    So even taking into account volume discounts, the DAC chips alone cost more than a base Bifrost.

    Great googly moogly. I need to hear this thing.
  6. Currawong Contributor
    For the above reasons, I expect you're going to piss a lot of people off in the high-end industry. [​IMG]
  7. drez
    20 bits is heaps though right? Especially for multibit. Iirc the best delta sigma can do 22 bits or something? I doubt the last 4 bits will be missed? Personally I can barely perceive truncation to 16 bits from 24, if I'm doing it right.
  8. Armaegis
    Because I can only afford one?
    Though for the kids out there, I highly recommend checking if your local symphony has student rates. Oftentimes a student rate or season subscription is a fraction of the "adult" cost. Sit yourself at row 10 in a concert hall and get a taste of real soundstage with instruments coming at you from all angles.

  9. Sapientiam
    Rather than clog up this thread with arcane technical stuff, now Mike's confirmed the DAC chip I'm putting down some thoughts on it on my blog here : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/blogs/abraxalito/1224-schitts-flagship-dac-uses-not-audio-dac-chip.html
    Suffice to say here that a DAC's static performance isn't the whole picture, not by a long shot.
  10. Sapientiam
    I believe his answer that only a 24bit DAC could resolve his signal is wrong. The error stems from mis-reading of an FFT's noise 'floor' which is a very common mistake on audio forums. DACs with many fewer bits than 24 can resolve very low-level signals when viewed on an FFT because the FFT inherently performs averaging over many thousands of samples. Where the 'grass' appears on an FFT plot is not the audio band noise floor of the DAC, rather the grass shows at each point how much noise is in a single FFT bin. An FFT bin has a very narrow bandwidth (typically single digit Hz) whereas audio noise floors are specified over the whole audio bandwidth (say 22kHz).
    Currawong, purrin and OJNeg like this.
  11. estreeter
    Sweet Jesus - I go to sleep, come back to this thread and it has exploded ! 
    The devil in me wishes I could set something up at a meet 3 or 4 months post Yggy becoming available whereby the audience thought they were listening to the Yggy while DAC duties were actually being performed by a Hugo TT.  Whether the latter compares sonically or not is less important than the expectations many would take to such a meet and how they might react if they perceived any of the notorious s-d hash purrin now considers kryptonite to his R2R superpowers. Those naughty people at Chord Electronics just wont leave it alone  :wink:
  12. prot
    Heard it now for sure. And since I'm relatively new here I gotta ask: are you still in your pre-ressurection period or did I miss the best years? :)

    Btw, doing it for glory is still not "charity for the god of sound". But nevertheless, I still thank you for doing it.

    That's the problem with bad reviews, noone wants to talk to you anymore. But I for one definitely want to see those too. So, good luck and keep on going. And if you ever open some sort of donations fund to cover the costs for bad reviews, pls notify.

    Also, I would like to nominate yours for The FAQ Of The Year. So much personality ... So much passion ... I wonder who's getting FAQed so hard
    HemiSam likes this.
  13. fzman Contributor
    Not to veer to far from the discussion of dacs - How many people have sought letters of recommendation, or used as "job references" people who would give really honest reviews of their abilities and performance- and not just say good things about them........   Thought so.  Bad reviews do not get written - if reviews are written by people who are blatantly lying or who write stuff because they have been bribed-- different story.
    Buy things from vendors who allow returns - judge for yourself - problem largely solved.
  14. AustinValentine
    Recommendations are generally assumed positive as a genre. That's why it's a "Recommendation" and not an "External Review of Candidate's Potential." 
    Reviews are not assumed positive as a genre, except - apparently - in high end audio. 
  15. Golfnutz
    So does this mean the Yggy portion of the R2R ladder DAC is 14-bits?
    The architecture of the AD5791 consists of two matched DAC
    sections. A simplified circuit diagram is shown in Figure 49.
    The six MSBs of the 20-bit data-word are decoded to drive 63
    switches, E0 to E62. Each of these switches connects one of 63
    matched resistors to either the VREFP or VREFN voltage. The
    remaining 14 bits of the data-word drive the S0 to S13 switched
    of a 14-bit voltage mode R-2R ladder network. To ensure
    performance to specification, the reference inputs must be force
    sensed with external amplifiers.
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