The Reference 6SN7 Thread

[LobalWarming]

Just to be a pedant, most *American* Loctals were made by Sylvania. I have been enjoying the world of European loctals recently with tubes from STC (5b/254m and soon 5a/152m), GEC (KT81), and Siemens (c3m). I never even knew of the existence of Euro loctals until a few years ago.

You could have gotten away with the pedant term... if the French had made loctals, but they didn't.

 

[Isaacc7]

While I’ve got the topic stirred up I have a question. One of my 14n7 NU and 2 of my Mullard 12j5 briefly flash when starting up and then operate as normal. I’ve read that isn’t all that uncommon with miniature tubes but haven’t heard anyone talk about it with octals.

 

[mordy]

While I’ve got the topic stirred up I have a question. One of my 14n7 NU and 2 of my Mullard 12j5 briefly flash when starting up and then operate as normal. I’ve read that isn’t all that uncommon with miniature tubes but haven’t heard anyone talk about it with octals.

This is a quick heat feature - the first time I came across it it really scared me; I thought the tube shorted out! ( Mullard EEC31 -octal base)
But it isn’t uncommon in certain tubes and normal operating protocol.

 

[Isaacc7]

This is a quick heat feature - the first time I came across it it really scared me; I thought the tube shorted out! ( Mullard EEC31 -octal base)
But it isn’t uncommon in certain tubes and normal operating protocol.

What worried me is that only one or two of these did it and the other didn’t. They do behave themselves after it so I guess I’ll stop worrying.

 

[mordy]

What worried me is that only one or two of these did it and the other didn’t. They do behave themselves after it so I guess I’ll stop worrying.

Seems possible that only certain production runs had this feature.

 

[Isaacc7]

Gah, for the zillionth time I have learned that the “sound“ of a tube really depends on the circuit and the other tubes being used. I had written off the ecc31 (with 6sn7 adapter). Every time I tried it I got a weird, phasey diffuse sound. They were brought back to mind because I was trying to figure out why another set of inputs (triode wired ktz41) went from diffuse, phasey sound to pretty good. Then it hit me, I switched over to 6aq5, a completely different tube from what I had been using as an output. Wondered if the ecc31 would respond the same way with that tube. It does!

I’m very happy to finally enjoy a tube so many have extolled. I can’t emphasize just how bad a sound I had been getting with them before. Have to keep reminding myself that my amp is completely different than all the others talked about here. It’s a good idea to find out what amp someone is using when they talk about the sound of a tube.

The 6n7 was originally designed to be used in push-pull in class B or having both triodes paralleled. Using a 6n7 to 6sn7 adapter is using the 6n7/ecc31 in a completely different way than designed. Does anyone know how the ecc31 and ecc32 measure when used as a twin triode? Plenty of people say they sound similar but I wonder if they are literally the same tube just with a common cathode in the ecc31.

 

[LobalWarming]

Gah, for the zillionth time I have learned that the “sound“ of a tube really depends on the circuit and the other tubes being used. I had written off the ecc31 (with 6sn7 adapter). Every time I tried it I got a weird, phasey diffuse sound. They were brought back to mind because I was trying to figure out why another set of inputs (triode wired ktz41) went from diffuse, phasey sound to pretty good. Then it hit me, I switched over to 6aq5, a completely different tube from what I had been using as an output. Wondered if the ecc31 would respond the same way with that tube. It does!

I’m very happy to finally enjoy a tube so many have extolled. I can’t emphasize just how bad a sound I had been getting with them before. Have to keep reminding myself that my amp is completely different than all the others talked about here. It’s a good idea to find out what amp someone is using when they talk about the sound of a tube.

The 6n7 was originally designed to be used in push-pull in class B or having both triodes paralleled. Using a 6n7 to 6sn7 adapter is using the 6n7/ecc31 in a completely different way than designed. Does anyone know how the ecc31 and ecc32 measure when used as a twin triode? Plenty of people say they sound similar but I wonder if they are literally the same tube just with a common cathode in the ecc31.

AFAIK, they are identical. Just that the ECC32 costs 4-5 times as much and therefore sounds 2 times better... because brain-biasing.

 

[mordy]

Gah, for the zillionth time I have learned that the “sound“ of a tube really depends on the circuit and the other tubes being used. I had written off the ecc31 (with 6sn7 adapter). Every time I tried it I got a weird, phasey diffuse sound. They were brought back to mind because I was trying to figure out why another set of inputs (triode wired ktz41) went from diffuse, phasey sound to pretty good. Then it hit me, I switched over to 6aq5, a completely different tube from what I had been using as an output. Wondered if the ecc31 would respond the same way with that tube. It does!

I’m very happy to finally enjoy a tube so many have extolled. I can’t emphasize just how bad a sound I had been getting with them before. Have to keep reminding myself that my amp is completely different than all the others talked about here. It’s a good idea to find out what amp someone is using when they talk about the sound of a tube.

The 6n7 was originally designed to be used in push-pull in class B or having both triodes paralleled. Using a 6n7 to 6sn7 adapter is using the 6n7/ecc31 in a completely different way than designed. Does anyone know how the ecc31 and ecc32 measure when used as a twin triode? Plenty of people say they sound similar but I wonder if they are literally the same tube just with a common cathode in the ecc31.

From what I read they should sound similar or the same, but unless someone lends me an ECC32 I don't think that I will find out.
The ECC31 may be less expensive to buy under another designation - NR73 (this was the UK Navy designation for the ECC31).

 

[Isaacc7]

From what I read they should sound similar or the same, but unless someone lends me an ECC32 I don't think that I will find out.
The ECC31 may be less expensive to buy under another designation - NR73 (this was the UK Navy designation for the ECC31).

Yeah, there’s no way I’m going to pay what ecc32 are going for. It’s why I went for the ecc31 lol. Also found some Visseux 11n7 that I hope will work as well as the ecc31. They were pretty cheap, right up my alley lol.

 

[LobalWarming]

From what I read they should sound similar or the same, but unless someone lends me an ECC32 I don't think that I will find out.
The ECC31 may be less expensive to buy under another designation - NR73 (this was the UK Navy designation for the ECC31).

I have ECC31, ECC32 and ECC34. I've been told the ECC33 sounds better than the other 3.

To my ears the difference between ECC31 and ECC32 isn't that big. ECC32 definitely less than twice as good.

Also... in the 6N7 family is the 12V FDD20. Great, lower cost alternative to the ECC31. Not quite as rich in the Mullard Magic mids, but very sweet open soundstage. And it's very pretty too...

...until it's in the 6SN7 socket adapter. Image not posted for eye-averting reasons

 

[mordy]

Yeah, there’s no way I’m; going to pay what ecc32 are going for. It’s why I went for the ecc31 lol. Also found some Visseux 11n7 that I hope will work as well as the ecc31. They were pretty cheap, right up my alley lol.

You may also consider the FDD20 which sounds similar to the ECC31, but when I checked now the prices are crazy.

I have ECC31, ECC32 and ECC34. I've been told the ECC33 sounds better than the other 3.

To my ears the difference between ECC31 and ECC32 isn't that big. ECC32 definitely less than twice as good.

Also... in the 6N7 family is the 12V FDD20. Great, lower cost alternative to the ECC31. Not quite as rich in the Mullard Magic mids, but very sweet open soundstage. And it's very pretty too...

...until it's in the 6SN7 socket adapter. Image not posted for eye-averting reasons

Yeah, those bath tub adapters are ugly!

 

[TLO]

I have ECC31, ECC32 and ECC34. I've been told the ECC33 sounds better than the other 3.

To my ears the difference between ECC31 and ECC32 isn't that big. ECC32 definitely less than twice as good.

Also... in the 6N7 family is the 12V FDD20. Great, lower cost alternative to the ECC31. Not quite as rich in the Mullard Magic mids, but very sweet open soundstage. And it's very pretty too...

...until it's in the 6SN7 socket adapter. Image not posted for eye-averting reasons

I have ECC31, ECC33, ECC34 n ECC35, n they all have the same basic Mullard house sound. Only if you listen very closely, you can still hear the very slight differences in the final sound production here and there due to the differences in the electrical specs. I have heard the ECC32 on multiple times but same as others, I wouldnt pay for the current asking price.

I believe many like the ECC32 a lot is becos of its additive wide soundstage sound, overall it has a well-rounded tone from high to low.
ECC31 is very close behind ECC32 in wide soundstage sound but has a more "neutral" sound compared to ECC32, which has more coloration, IMO. Fact is many love coloration...LOL. Out of these, ECC33 has the best clarity from high to low, this is why some prefer ECC33 over ECC32. ECC34 has the darkest tone in the family but not dark like the famous RCA 6SN7 grey glass, it is still a Mullard after all and retain the Mullard house sound. TBH, I dont think one can go wrong with any of these tubes as they all sound amazing regardless of your personal preference.

Oh yeah, dont ask me which one to get becos I will say get a pair of each...

 

[Isaacc7]

Sadly, with more listening I have to still say the ecc31 still isn’t great in my system. This is the best they’ve ever sounded. Now there is an actual sound stage and imaging. But the system still sounds congested and compressed. I might have a hare brained idea for a new adapter to remedy this particular situation and add another tube to my possible tube types. Not that I need even more choices mind you.

 

[Isaacc7]

You may also consider the FDD20 which sounds similar to the ECC31, but when I checked now the prices are crazy.

Yeah, those bath tub adapters are ugly!

Not too long ago they were in the range of $20-$30 but now they are easy to ignore because of the price. And yeah, those are ugly adapters lol. Not sure I could ever trust those side contact tubes, they just bother me for some reason.

 

[mordy]

Not too long ago they were in the range of $20-$30 but now they are easy to ignore because of the price. And yeah, those are ugly adapters lol. Not sure I could ever trust those side contact tubes, they just bother me for some reason.

They bother me too - very difficult to insert and even worse to pull out. However, the FDD20 I have was adapted to an octal socket.