[beowulf]

  Google Chinese-English translate of a "not so positive" 1st impression:
https://translate.google.com.hk/translate?sl=zh-CN&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=zh-TW&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.andaudio.com%2Fphpbb3%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ff%3D25%26t%3D115589%26start%3D5175%23p1171257&edit-text= 
 
The reviewer thinks the Z1R should worth only Yen60,000 (slightly more expensive to the Z7)

 
I had a lot of difficulty parsing this review in Engrish, but got the impression that one of the things he disliked was a sense of harsh reverberation and too much brightness.
 
If that is the case, I have the opposite impression. My main problem with the Z1R at the moment is that I'd prefer a slightly brighter sound in general. They're probably neutral enough, but my ears tend to prefer a brighter signature. I miss that more often than more tamed bass. They could also have slightly more air, even being closed, but I guess that's the price to pay for the excellent seal and isolation.
 
After one week of ownership (exactly one week tonight) I'm not firmly in a "must keep" state. They are very good, but I have to agree that I'm not sure they justify the cost. Then again, the build quality of the whole product (including case) justifies a premium compared to something like the HD800S, just not to this extent.
 
Still have three more weeks to test it in the return window. Right now I'm leaning towards keeping because well... they sound bloody good, look bloody good and feel bloody good, but I'd prefer to see it in the ~1600 EUR MSRP price band instead of 2200, especially because the expectations were incredibly high and I expected an almost flawless product, which turned out to be merely good, not perfect.
 
Edit: Just did the Yen conversion. The reviewer thinks they should be worth 530 EUR. Given the sound and overall materials/build construction, I find that totally unrealistic. Good luck finding something in that price range coming even remotely close to the Z1R. I can't think of a single model.
As for the subjective sense of what "sound is worth" and excluding all the rest, then it is of course subjective, so it's a respectable opinion.

 

[pietcux]

Google Chinese-English translate of a "not so positive" 1st impression:
https://translate.google.com.hk/translate?sl=zh-CN&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=zh-TW&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.andaudio.com%2Fphpbb3%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ff%3D25%26t%3D115589%26start%3D5175%23p1171257&edit-text= 

The reviewer thinks the Z1R should worth only Yen60,000 (slightly more expensive to the Z7). He thinks the Z1R bass response is its major weakness: slow and soft, with extension only comparable to "2nd tier" closed cans.

That is what Nonax also said, so again a can not for everyone. But isn't that true for all cans ever made? I would like to have the chance to give it a proper listen and judge myself. The Z7 got the same bad comments from the same people and guess what, that was causing me to buy it late. But now that I have it I love it's sound, especially the bass.

 

[Whitigir]

Z7 seems to be really is the successor to Z7. Whether it is worth the price tag or not is upon personal justifications. Do we have a Z7 owner here that own the Z1R yet.

Cd3000 can be had for that pricing of $540 Euro ? Bad thing is there is no replacement parts and they are beat up

 

[Sonic Defender]

Bummer that so early on the Z1R seems to be somewhat polarizing. So Beowulf, now with even more time would you sell the 800S or the Z1R if you could only afford to keep one of them?

 

[TSAVJason]

So

Google Chinese-English translate of a "not so positive" 1st impression:
https://translate.google.com.hk/translate?sl=zh-CN&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=zh-TW&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.andaudio.com%2Fphpbb3%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ff%3D25%26t%3D115589%26start%3D5175%23p1171257&edit-text= 

The reviewer thinks the Z1R should worth only Yen60,000 (slightly more expensive to the Z7). He thinks the Z1R bass response is its major weakness: slow and soft, with extension only comparable to "2nd tier" closed cans.

so far in my evaluation and opinion this reviewer is crazy.

 

[Soundsgoodtome]

If you prefer a tight sounding neutral phone with airy highs I can see how the Sony can seem to be a sub 1k can. However given that it can't satisfy everyone and is tilted to one side of tuning, Beowulf's sub 2k pricing seems more fair. However we are talking big name brand and novelty along with totl build quality so what Sony is asking is the premium for being one of the first kid on the block to have one.

Still I wait for more impressions to decide between it and the Eikon.

So
so far in my evaluation and opinion this reviewer is crazy.

 

[beowulf]

  Bummer that so early on the Z1R seems to be somewhat polarizing. So Beowulf, now with even more time would you sell the 800S or the Z1R if you could only afford to keep one of them?

 
That's not an easy choice, since they are somewhat similar in mids/highs but quite different in lows and soundstage. The isolation aspect is another major difference, and so are the needs for amplification.
The Z1R are the most versatile, IMHO, so perhaps if I could only have a set, I would pick the Z1R. They're much easier to drive (therefore cheaper to drive) and I can use them even when there is ambient noise in the room. I also really like the build quality and physical design of everything, case included.
 
In terms of pure sound-per-money if you already have the amplification and if you're OK with a wimpier bass (and to a certain extent, thinner mids and overall body), plus are able to listen in silence, then I think the 800S offer more smiles-per-coin. You can get a brand new pair at 1350 EUR if you look around, while the Z1R will cost you at least 1900. That's a 550 EUR ($600) difference.
 
I really want to keep the Z1R, but am having trouble digesting the price give what it adds to my collection. I know I'll miss it if I return it, but I'm not sure the passion is strong enough to do otherwise.
It's weekend, so I'm going to do some more listening without being in a hurry.
 
Btw, found another track where the bass can get a bit too thick. Fiona Apple - "Valentine" (I think some of you commented Fiona before, so maybe it was the same album). The opening is quite punchy, to say the least... a bit too much. Might be intentional in the mastering of the track, tho.

 

[purk]

   
That's not an easy choice, since they are somewhat similar in mids/highs but quite different in lows and soundstage. The isolation aspect is another major difference, and so are the needs for amplification.
The Z1R are the most versatile, IMHO, so perhaps if I could only have a set, I would pick the Z1R. They're much easier to drive (therefore cheaper to drive) and I can use them even when there is ambient noise in the room. I also really like the build quality and physical design of everything, case included.
 
In terms of pure sound-per-money if you already have the amplification and if you're OK with a wimpier bass (and to a certain extent, thinner mids and overall body), plus are able to listen in silence, then I think the 800S offer more smiles-per-coin. You can get a brand new pair at 1350 EUR if you look around, while the Z1R will cost you at least 1900. That's a 550 EUR ($600) difference.
 
I really want to keep the Z1R, but am having trouble digesting the price give what it adds to my collection. I know I'll miss it if I return it, but I'm not sure the passion is strong enough to do otherwise.
It's weekend, so I'm going to do some more listening without being in a hurry.
 
Btw, found another track where the bass can get a bit too thick. Fiona Apple - "Valentine" (I think some of you commented Fiona before, so maybe it was the same album). The opening is quite punchy, to say the least... a bit too much. Might be intentional in the mastering of the track, tho.

I can see why you are having a second thought.  It seems that even the Ether Flow C maybe a better choice compared to the Z1R.  $2200 or so is a good sum of money.  I personally would use half of it and get a really nice amplifier for your HD800s including a balanced cable.  Perhaps the HDVD600 will be a really good choice.  Of course if you absolutely need a closed can then the HD800s is a no go option and the Z1R is the choice.
 
I could see why someone would rate the Z1R as not even a good deal for $1000.   The HD800 is dirt cheap these days plus he may already have a really good amplifier to drive them  well and the Elear is pretty darn amazing for just 1K.  The HD800 isn't anemic in bass if you have a good amp to drive them.  Again, I can't recommend an ECP audio highly enough.  Heck the Apex Peak/Volcano (thanks James!) if you can find one...is splendid at driving the HD800 as well.

 

[beowulf]

  I can see why you are having a second thought.  It seems that even the Ether Flow C maybe a better choice compared to the Z1R.  $2200 or so is a good sum of money.  I personally would use half of it and get a really nice amplifier for it.  Perhaps the HDVD600 will be a better choice.  Of choice if you absolutely need a closed can then the HD800s is a no go.
 
I could see why someone would rate the Z1R as not even a good deal for $1000.   The HD800 is dirt cheap these days plus he may already have a really good amplifier to drive them  well.  The HD800 isn't anemic in bass if you have a good amp to drive them.  Again, I can't recommend an ECP audio highly enough.  Heck the Apex Peak/Volcano (thanks James!) if you can find one...is splendid at driving the HD800 as well.

 
I don't think the 800/800S can pull off the right bass consistently, even with the best amp in the world. It's just not there. The wide soundstage is amazing but also a bit artificial. I also think the Z1R is better than the Ether Flow C in many aspects, and at least around here the Flow is very expensive.
 
$1000? For the Z1R? It can easily be sold for more than that, even $1500 would be fine. $2200 is too much, but it will probably drop from that relatively fast. What will you get for $1000 that is this well built? The Elear? Don't think so. It's still a quality flagship and can compete higher.
 
Anyway, I need closed cans for some occasions, so while I want to reduce the number of headphones, won't be able to go lower than two. That's my magic number now, I want just two. One closed, one open, both good. There will always be gaps, but it can't be that bad.
 
I'm going to checkout the Utopia, which is a candidate to replace the 800S (if I can get past the loss of soundstage in return for some improvements). Having that, the Z1R could be a fine closed set. Even being just two, that's a lot of dough... better be sure it's a choice to last.
Even if I return the Z1R (still to determine) they'd become tempting again if price drops to $1300-$1500, HD800S range, while better built.
 
Time for some pro reviews. Where are the pros? Lazy pros. Let's see those measurements too.

 

[purk]

   
I don't think the 800/800S can pull off the right bass consistently, even with the best amp in the world. It's just not there. The wide soundstage is amazing but also a bit artificial.
I also think the Z1R is better than the Ether Flow C in many aspect, plus it can easily be sold for more than that, even $1500 would be fine. $2200 is too much, but it will probably drop from that relatively fast.
 
I need closed cans for some occasions, so while I want to reduce the number of headphones, won't be able to go lower than two. That's my magic number now, I want just two. One closed, one open, both good. There will always be gaps, but it can't be that bad.
 
I'm going to checkout the Utopia, which is a candidate to replace the 800S (if I can get past the loss of soundstage in return for some improvements). Having that, the Z1R could be a fine closed set.
Even being just two, that's a lot of dough... better be sure it's a choice to last.
Even if I return the Z1R (still to determine) they'd become tempting again if price drops to $1300-1500.
 
Time for some pro reviews. Where are the pros? Lazy pros. Let's see those measurements too.

Seriously tho, the HD800S can be a bass monster as well as the CD3000...I have heard them with plenty of bass before.  You simply need to open up and give it a try.  For instance, my ECP DSHA-0/1 has plenty of bass for the HD800...and the Questyle Monoblock is also capable but to a lesser degree.  The HDVD600 used is a  steal if you want to amp the HD800/S.

 

[gto88]

  Seriously tho, the HD800S can be a bass monster as well as the CD3000...I have heard them with plenty of bass before.  You simply need to open up and give it a try.  For instance, my ECP DSHA-0/1 has plenty of bass for the HD800...and the Questyle Monoblock is also capable but to a lesser degree.  The HDVD600 used is a  steal if you want to amp the HD800/S.

How about a speaker amp with adapter? can it be good too.

 

[purk]

  How about a speaker amp with adapter? can it be good too.

I have not tried that route but I have heard great things about First Watts amp driving the HD800/S.

 

[gto88]

I might try my Denon poa-8200/8300 some days.

 

[Sonic Defender]

  How about a speaker amp with adapter? can it be good too.

I use my NAD M3 amp with speaker tap cables, no need for an adapter to drive the 800S or any headphone via speaker tap cable if it is a solid state amp. I think with an Output Coupled tube amp you need an adapter box, but not with SS. There isn't a headphone amp I can afford that can come close to what my M3 does for headphones. I doubt even the Blue Hawaii would sound better so try speaker tap if you have the opportunity and a decent amp already.
 
Edit: here is a list of headphone I have driven via my M3 with speaker taps: Th 900, TH 600, HE 560, HE 400i, MDR Z7, A800, LCD2F, ZMF Vibro, HD 800S, MT220.

 

[Shiki]

The Z1R is actually comparatively good value here in Australia. It costs less than the HD800S and Ether Flow C.
 
Hope the Sony Store will have these for demo.