[buzzlulu]

I'm one of those people who liked the Z1R with the Kimber cable on them, to enhance the bass more. If anything, it is their strength.

Is that the only thing the Kimber cable brought to the party or do you feel it brought other positive things as well (or perhaps even some negative things)?

By Kimber I assume you are referring to the Sony Kimber (and not the Axios).

 

[up late]

If people are trying to use science as an unequivocal fact then they clearly don't understand how scientific theory works. The very best case is there is strong evidence to support your theory but you can never actually prove without a doubt that something is a fact which is why statistics is such an important tool as you have to calculate your data to see if it is statistically significant or not. In some situations a statistically significant result might not even by over 50% confidence.

i don't think anyone has been trying to do that here with regard to headphone measurements anyway

 

[Beagle]

no that isn't it exactly. it's about the selective use of tyll's measurements.

I thought the thread was about the Z1R? My bad....

 

[rnros]

no that isn't it exactly. it's about the selective use of tyll's measurements.

Yes, agree that you are referring to the selective use Tyll's measurements, but do not agree with your assumption that this fails any test of logic, or honest representation.

The fact is, for some, this is the reasonable conclusion going forward given the evidence and expert opinion of variance and inconsistency across time, place, and implementation with measurement results.

In the same way that one expects a level of respect and fairness towards an individual who published measurements in good faith, the same good will should be shown to those who relied upon the published data in good faith.

Back on topic, the Z1R is a benchmark headphone worthy of the accolades.

 

[buzzlulu]

What are people's take on how these headphones respond to balanced vs. unbalanced? My only experience, when I had them on lengthy demo, was balanced 4.4 into the WM1Z.
Now that I am coming back (with my pair arriving tomorrow) most of my use will be in combination with my 1Z and the balanced Sony/Kimber cable 4.4.

My balanced question specifically refers to when I want to use them with my big rig (2 channel) as an alternative to the Utopia's. I can use the Sony supplied in the tin 3 meter 1/4" SE cable - or purchase the Sony/Kimber SE version - or go third party and have a balanced cable made to use with my Moon 430HA - in which case it would need to be terminated with either a 4 pin XLR or twin 3 pin mini XLR's.

I do not think the included 3 meter SE cable can be re terminated to balanced ????

Am I spinning my wheels with a balanced cable w/ the Moon and should I simply stick with the SE included in the box - or will these cans step up significantly when going from SE to Balanced?
Using them with the 1Z is easy - balanced

 

[Sarnia]

Well glad to see this thread has calmed down!

For those who do like the Z1Rs and who live in the UK or Europe, Amazon UK currently have a 20% discount on Warehouse goods. There are three pairs of "Used-Like New" pairs for £1,292.13 after the extra discount.

Amazon seem to have finally fixed the issue with the bogus seller that was pushing the prices down, so this is probably as good as it's going to get.

 

[MacedonianHero]

But that is exactly it: The question is about the objective measurement. There is this belief about science amongst many that it is somehow perfect and unquestionable. I'm not saying that you have this, but with a lot of people running amateur measurement rigs, not enough people understand the actual limitations of what is being done. All MH is doing is stating his experiences, something I could suggest a number of possible reasons for, mainly connected to music. It's not as bad as some people claiming that their measurements are "not science" then claiming that their measurements show truths about headphones (ie: that they effectively are scientific) when they feel it is convenient to them.

I'm one of those people who liked the Z1R with the Kimber cable on them, to enhance the bass more. If anything, it is their strength.

Thanks Amos..that sums up my point exactly. I'm glad you got it at least. The headphones he mentioned, those measurements did jive with my experiences. The Z1R was so far off that it really took me aback from what I was hearing and had me re-look at this subject altogether. FWIW, the Abyss, K812 measurements (and a few others) missed the mark on what I was hearing as well, but nothing was as far off as what I heard as the Z1R measurements which is only fairly recent.

 

[MacedonianHero]

I thought the thread was about the Z1R? My bad....

That's kind of his thing Dave.

 

[Beagle]

Thanks Amos..that sums up my point exactly. I'm glad you got it at least. The headphones he mentioned did jive with my experiences. The Z1R was so far off that it really took me aback from what I was hearing. FWIW, the Abyss measurements (and a few others) missed the mark on what I was hearing, but nothing was as far off as what I heard as the Z1R measurements.

They should take all their gear (or adaption of same) and go measure live music events in wonderful venues, from a listeners vantage point. It'd be interesting to see the results and to see how many people would stop going to concerts.

 

[MacedonianHero]

They should take all their gear (or adaption of same) and go measure live music events in wonderful venues, from a listeners vantage point. It'd be interesting to see the results and to see how many people would stop going to concerts.

Very good point!

Back on topic, gotta say the Hugo 2 and Z1R is a brilliant combination! Endgame territory IMHO.

 

[Currawong]

Is that the only thing the Kimber cable brought to the party or do you feel it brought other positive things as well (or perhaps even some negative things)?

By Kimber I assume you are referring to the Sony Kimber (and not the Axios).

Yes, the Sony Kimber. Someone could easily make a cable that brings out less bass emphasis, but if that were the desire, I reckon a different pair of headphones would be in order. I like headphones best when I play to their strengths and I feel the bass is one of them.

 

[up late]

I thought the thread was about the Z1R? My bad....

it is

 

[up late]

Yes, agree that you are referring to the selective use Tyll's measurements, but do not agree with your assumption that this fails any test of logic, or honest representation.

The fact is, for some, this is the reasonable conclusion going forward given the evidence and expert opinion of variance and inconsistency across time, place, and implementation with measurement results.

In the same way that one expects a level of respect and fairness towards an individual who published measurements in good faith, the same good will should be shown to those who relied upon the published data in good faith.

Back on topic, the Z1R is a benchmark headphone worthy of the accolades.

leaving the issue of the selective use of tyll's measurements to aside, it is erroneous to rely on your hearing to question the accuracy of those measurements

 

[Beagle]

leaving the issue of the selective use of tyll's measurements to aside, it is erroneous to rely on your hearing to question the accuracy of those measurements

Your ears are the final arbitrator of what you like, all that matters. If you like how something sounds, measurements are irrelevant. You cannot use measurements to say that that can't be so.

 

[nordkapp]

Any idea when the "new" measurements will be released? Not that it will change my feelings at all. Just curious. BTW, this discussion is fascinating....sarcasm.