[fattymacgeek]

I currently own Shure SE 846, and looking for an upgrade in detail/soundstage. Have read many reviews on the U12t, U18t, Kaiser Encore and it seems the U12t will have the same overall signature as the SE846 with the upgrade I'm seeking. One concern I have is too much treble creating a 'lean' sound. I haven't seen many comparisons of the SE 846 to the above IEMs. Thoughts?

I agree with what others have said. I owned and loved the SE846 for years (but conversely, I had terrible luck with the universal fit). I tried all the 64 Audio line-up and ended up going with the A12t. To me, it is superior to the 846 in every way, but of course the price is much higher. I ALMOST went with the A18t which seemed to be better technically but it was a matter of sound preference for me. Pls note though that this was before the release of the N8 and the other lower tier TIA models, so it's probably worth trying them out as well. I remembered being quite surprised by the quality of the A6 (non-TIA) but the difference in detail when compared to the A12t or A18t was night and day.

 

[BBullerman]

64 Audio "loans out" any universal headphones you might want to try. This is a fantastic way to test one or more models...just reach out to them.

When I was choosing between the Fourte and the 18, i requested a loan on both.

All you need to do is provide a credit card, 64a places a 50% hold of the value for the headphones you want to try - for the U12 it'll be around $1k. Once headphones are returned after a week, your money is returned and you only end up paying for shipping which is ~$30.

Regarding this comment:

I've ready many reviews/comparisons, but did the A12 seem "bass heavy" to you?

Bass heavy can be interpreted different ways, what are you thinking exactly?

From my experience, there is an emphasis on the bass in the 12's sound signature, in the sense that bass response is emphasized and slightly louder over other frequencies. It is quite powerful and fun, but in my opinion, I wouldn't call it "bass-heavy." (This is different from say, the bass on the Legend X from Empire Ears, which has a BRIGHT spotlight on it all the damn time. It's incredible, and the LX is next on my buy list, but you lose some versatility here vs. the U12/U18.)

OK, I’m convinced - will try the loan program for U12 & U18.

Regarding bass-heavy...was thinking about how Beats signature is just over the top. I realize it sounds ridiculous comparing Beats to a $2K IEM, but that’s what I was alluding to - I love bass, just not at the expense of everything else. But the 846’s seem to have a great, powerful low-end while still keeping it in check. So if the U12 is all that except way better, count me in!

 

[toaster]

OK, I’m convinced - will try the loan program for U12 & U18.

Regarding bass-heavy...was thinking about how Beats signature is just over the top. I realize it sounds ridiculous comparing Beats to a $2K IEM, but that’s what I was alluding to - I love bass, just not at the expense of everything else.

Hah...I agree this sounds ridiculous. Once you hear the U12/U18 for yourself, you'll realize that it is. I've heard the Beats, 846, U12, U18, bought the A18, and have read your posts and what you're looking for. You will not be disappointed by any "over the top" signature with either the 12 or 18.

The U12 and U18 are both cutting-edge, extremely technically proficient transducers. I also agree with fattymacgeek that it is somewhat a matter of preference whether you will prefer the 12 or 18, (or ultimately decide you'd like to own both.) In fact, some people find the U18 bass light. Again this is a matter of preference. For me, the neutrality and extremely equal representation of frequencies, astounding level of detail, and high-end extension of the U18 was more exciting than the sound signature of the 12. For others, the less neutral, bass-emphasized (but not "over the top") U12 is preferable.

You can't go wrong with 64A's loaner program. Just give them a shout and they'll be happy to hook you up.

If you want to knock yourself out with details, specifically on the U18, you can read my review at the top of the page, here:

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/64-audio-u18-tzar.22420/reviews#review-19760

I'll also note that the one con I mention (lack of warmth) was significantly improved in the A18 custom version.

Keep us posted on what you decide.

 

[Gosod]

Only on fit. Everything else the U12t destroys it. SE846 WAS good, but is no longer competitive in it's price range imho.

You probably have not had the opportunity to listen to them with the cable TwagV2.

 

[FangJoker]

You probably have not had the opportunity to listen to them with the cable TwagV2.

I have not heard that combo, but I have owned the twag v2 and the twau v2 and thought they were nothing special compared to effect audio and wagnus cables I've owned.

 

[Gosod]

I have not heard that combo, but I have owned the twag v2 and the twau v2 and thought they were nothing special compared to effect audio and wagnus cables I've owned.

Yes of course.

is this your professional opinion?

 

[FangJoker]

Yes of course.
is this your professional opinion?

It's my ears and wallets opinion. I think it's funny that all of a sudden there's SE846 fanbois that thinks it can punch above it's weight class when theres lower priced items that compete or better the SE846. I owned it before and enjoyed it while it was at the top of the mountain, but it's been surpassed by a lot of other products including 2 other products that shure sells over the past few years. Shure got complacent and should've kept updating it's lineup.

 

[etherlite]

It's my ears and wallets opinion. I think it's funny that all of a sudden there's SE846 fanbois that thinks it can punch above it's weight class when theres lower priced items that compete or better the SE846. I owned it before and enjoyed it while it was at the top of the mountain, but it's been surpassed by a lot of other products including 2 other products that shure sells over the past few years. Shure got complacent and should've kept updating it's lineup.

As you can see from his signature, he's trying to sell his SE846 (since April). No wonder he's trying to promote it again.

 

[Barra]

Hah...I agree this sounds ridiculous. Once you hear the U12/U18 for yourself, you'll realize that it is. I've heard the Beats, 846, U12, U18, bought the A18, and have read your posts and what you're looking for. You will not be disappointed by any "over the top" signature with either the 12 or 18.

The U12 and U18 are both cutting-edge, extremely technically proficient transducers. I also agree with fattymacgeek that it is somewhat a matter of preference whether you will prefer the 12 or 18, (or ultimately decide you'd like to own both.) In fact, some people find the U18 bass light. Again this is a matter of preference. For me, the neutrality and extremely equal representation of frequencies, astounding level of detail, and high-end extension of the U18 was more exciting than the sound signature of the 12. For others, the less neutral, bass-emphasized (but not "over the top") U12 is preferable.

You can't go wrong with 64A's loaner program. Just give them a shout and they'll be happy to hook you up.

If you want to knock yourself out with details, specifically on the U18, you can read my review at the top of the page, here:

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/64-audio-u18-tzar.22420/reviews#review-19760

I'll also note that the one con I mention (lack of warmth) was significantly improved in the A18 custom version.

Keep us posted on what you decide.

Just to clarify, IMO the bass on the 18 can hit extremely hard as well when powered correctly and scaled appropriately and quantity can be increased by using the M20 module. The value of the 12 is that it scales down better providing that quality/quantity bass even on an iPhone. To get that bass performance out of an iPhone on my 18, I have to add my C&C BH2 amp and then wow. The reason the 18 is often seen as bass light is only when underpowered or sourced on a system that favors a lighter touch. The 12 also has the LID tech advantage of sounding the same regardless of the source impedance. That being said, the 18/12 have the best quality/quantity BA-based bass that I have ever heard.

 

[FangJoker]

Just to clarify, IMO the bass on the 18 can hit extremely hard as well when powered correctly and scaled appropriately and quantity can be increased by using the M20 module. The value of the 12 is that it scales down better providing that quality/quantity bass even on an iPhone. To get that bass performance out of an iPhone on my 18, I have to add my C&C BH2 amp and then wow. The reason the 18 is often seen as bass light is only when underpowered or sourced on a system that favors a lighter touch. The 12 also has the LID tech advantage of sounding the same regardless of the source impedance. That being said, the 18/12 have the best quality/quantity BA-based bass that I have ever heard.

I'm waiting for impressions of your CIEMs out of the Hugo TT2 with M-Scaler.

 

[toaster]

To clarify Barra's point...

The 12 simply has more elevated bass response, where the 18 is just delightfully neutral across all frequencies. I never thought I would like this type of absolute neutrality, but the 18 wowed me.

All you need to understand is right here, off 64A's website:

 

[Audiowood]

Ordered A6T. Looking to replace Noble K10. The vacuum pressure in regular CIEM drives me nuts. I am hoping the APEX will not have any pressure.

 

[seedubchris]

Just to clarify, IMO the bass on the 18 can hit extremely hard as well when powered correctly and scaled appropriately and quantity can be increased by using the M20 module. The value of the 12 is that it scales down better providing that quality/quantity bass even on an iPhone. To get that bass performance out of an iPhone on my 18, I have to add my C&C BH2 amp and then wow. The reason the 18 is often seen as bass light is only when underpowered or sourced on a system that favors a lighter touch. The 12 also has the LID tech advantage of sounding the same regardless of the source impedance. That being said, the 18/12 have the best quality/quantity BA-based bass that I have ever heard.

Here here . Well put sir. I can’t imagine anyone thinking either u12 U18 is bass light . The bass is solid as a rock . It’s not hyped or fluffed out in any way it’s just clear,
intelligible and and integrated with the low mids seamlessly which is important.
I recently made the jump from last year’s UE18+ which is fantastic on its own but lacked in the extended highs I needed. I went on a quest with my trusty source (AK320>usb>chord Hugo 2) to demo as many venders as I could in one day at the RMAF CanJam two months ago . I knew my reference tracks well and trusted the fact that with the exact same source/power (which is ample with Hugo 2) I would get an apples to apples read on all the newest tec. I hit the JH stand and went straight for Layla (fantastic but..) empire ears flagship (killer but a little lacking in volume and slam (I monitor loud for short periods) then hit a few more less remarkable options and then sat down to the 64 counter and tried the “royal with cheese” ,I.e Tia Fourt’e. Damn ! Now we’re talkin . They figured out the extended highs with the TIA tec . As I have a mutant left ear canal I must use customs (can’t get a permanent seal with universals ) so I tried the u12 which is a blend of Tia (highs and high mids) and good ol balanced armatures for the mids and lows ,not as crazy good as the Fourt’e but still a lot better than what I was used to with my current flagship ciem. I tried the u18 and while i thought it was great I wasn’t gonna spent the extra dough for a small improvement. I have since rethought that and went for the A18t which I use daily in my pro recording studio referencing the mixes of the day . I love them . If you power them right you are in the fabled “cat bird seat” (movie raising Arizona) .
If you have the dough go all the way with the 18T . You won’t regret it but remember to have or start looking for a good amp and DAC to power them because they need and deserve good power . If you wanna get a great ear monitor and can’t find the dough for reference quality dac/amp , the 12 is damn close to the 18 imho and has the LID tec which has got to be a lifesaver with crap amplification (cellphones). Jump in! The water is warm .

 

[Audiowood]

Yeah, there is that... Let me get the 1Km burned in and live with it for a few weeks, then maybe after the new year I'll go to Audio46 in the city and do some listening tests... See what's what.

If you are looking at 846 similar tonal quality, Andromeda is not a 846 replacement as the bass qty is much less (but better quality). Vega is also not as its bass is just too much. I find the Noble K10 a better replacement as they are tonally similar but K10 is way better. You can massdrop it is at $899 now. The K10 has bass that is stronger, more detail, mid not as honky but still honky enough you will not miss the 846 mids and the treble extend higher. Soundstage blast the 846 away with a wider width and taller height.

Do take note the custom version of K10 bass is even stronger and treble slightly less vs the Aluminum version.

 

[szore]

it might not feel right...but it sounds so good.

C'mon, you already splurged on the M, just go all out and buy a TOTL iem to go with it.

I was just reading the review of the A18t and I have to say I am impressed with the write up. I think I may start saving for these, seems the way to go with something like the 1000M!