A lot of marketing fluff and mambo jumbo jargon, but no solid science. A strong whiff of snake oil...
The Official 64 Audio Thread | apex & tia Technologies
A lot of marketing fluff and mambo jumbo jargon, but no solid science. A strong whiff of snake oil...
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All science aside, at the end of the day it's a very simple test: do a/b comparison of IEMs with different cables and see if you hear the difference
I get lost in reading about wire geometry myself, though I do pay attention to wire material.
Dionysus
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dude Lol To each his own, do you know anything about how cables work? I let my own ears tell me what sounds good. I won't even try and engage you in a cable discussion you can take that on the science forum.
I've listened to many cables and some highly regarded ones, on these very forums, that member rave about that color the sound from the source and cost hundreds of dollars more than these., cables shouldn't do that.
The single bore itself is meant to be an acoustic chamber for the Tia driver to resonate in. As you can see in @Dionysus's photos, the Tia high driver is placed near the end of the bore. Obviously a whole driver also wouldn't be able to fit inside a typical 1-2mm sound bore. I haven't seen pictures of the A3e, so I can't confirm how that single bore is implemented. It's possible for all three drivers to share a single bore if the drivers are attached to a scaffolding like in the A18. Alternatively, they could be implementing a horn bore. In a horn bore, the sound tubes of the IEM stop a few millimetres short of the opening of the bore, and the bore itself is shaped like the end of a trumpet or a trombone - expanding outwards. This results in better high-frequency extension, which is a common issue in low-driver-count IEMs like the A3e.
That's made possible by the fact that the drivers within the A18 are all tweeter-sized. Typically, these TWFK-esque transducers allow a faster response. Having more of them increases the resultant surface area of the diaphragm(s) and increases headroom for reduced distortion. A larger driver like ones from the ED or DTEC series would have indeed been too large for the A18, but they're present in the A12t for example.
KuroKitsu
Headphoneus Supremus
@Deezel177 Excellent explanation of the technical details. Now I just need to see where I can give u18t a listen to see if it's worth commiting. The largest number of drivers in IEMs are Quad Drivers and I found no different from the more balanced Triple Drivers other than too much bass to me. At 4k CAD, I really want to be sure that I can hear the difference.
Thanks! I always say that it's all in the way you tune/use the drivers - rather than how many - and that's true.
I'd like to use an analogy to illustrate that. Imagine you're trying to produce a secondary colour by using primary colours (say, purple from red and blue, green from blue and yellow, etc.). This final secondary colour will represent the in-ear's overall frequency response. Now, the amount and variety of drivers you use to craft that frequency response is equivalent to the amount and variety of primary colours you have at your disposal to make the mixture. The more primary colours you have, the more options you have in terms of what secondary colour you want to make and what shades or hues you want that mixture to be in. You can make different shades of green, a purple with a hint of yellow, etc. More drivers don't necessarily mean better sound quality, nor do they equate to a pre-determined signature. They simply give the manufacturer more choices as to what kinds of - and how many - peaks and dips they want to introduce into the frequency response. Taking that analogy further, you can equate the colour mixing process - and the equipment used to mix - to tuning the drivers with crossovers, dampers, etc.
I'd heavily recommend giving the U18t a listen before you buy. For anyone, it's a huge investment. However, if you find yourself unwilling to commit that amount of money to them and you don't mind a custom fit, the A6t is a fantastic substitute. I was able to audition them with a different set of tips as well as different cables, and I was immensely impressed by the A6t. They won't replace the U18t in any way, but they get you quite the way there. My fresh impressions will be posted here soon.
teknorob23
Member of the Trade: Network Acoustics
Really interested in the wire world cable, can you give anymore specific impressions on what it sounds like, perhaps compared about other cables you’ve used. Thanks
teknorob23
Member of the Trade: Network Acoustics
I agree it’s all bit jargony, but I have heard and been very impressed by wireworld speaker and interconnect cable’s in domestic hifi. They are among some of the most respected manufacturers of cable in traditional hifi, but as with most of their competitors they’ve been slow to come to head-fi, but I’ve seen very positive reviews but the ergonomics look less impressive. I’ve yet to hear any detailed feedback from and iem user
A few words on the new A6t, which turned out to be something I instantly liked. For starters, the A6t shares a strong 'house sound' with the A4t and A18t, which can can be described as a variation of neutral/natural. The sound is predominantly neutral, but 64 Audio mixes in a dash of warmth and brightness by means of an enhanced mid-bass and lower and upper treble, to make it a more musical variation of neutral. So, if you like the tone of the A18t, you will also like the tone of the A4t and A6t.
The A6t too has an enhanced mid-bass, with a lower treble peak around 7 KHz and bit of upper treble emphasis around 12 KHz I believe. But where it diverges from its siblings, is with a very pleasing midrange, stemming from a nice bump between 500 Hz to 2 Khz. This results in slightly forward, bodied, and sufficiently dense vocal presentation, with just the slightest touch of thickness from the bass. In sum, a very natural vocal reproduction - flinkenick approves. Its bottom extension is around average, but its mid-bass is more than sufficient in quantity, and remains nicely controlled. It's a punchy bass, that adds a musical element, and some extra body to the sound. The treble in turn has a clear tone, but is smoothly integrated within the signature. All in all, an easy-going and coherent signature which simply sounds very good to my ears.
When listening to the A6t, its performance does not feel lacking in a way that disappoints, simply because it is an enjoyable signature. Nevertheless, there is a steady increase in performance between the A4t, A6t, and U12t for instance. The U12t has a noticeably cleaner presentation, besting the A6t in terms of separation, transparency, and resolution, while having a significantly wider stage. The A6t does not quite reach top-tier in performance, but comes close enough. The U12t's performance on the other hand I find slightly above average in the top-tier range.
That being said, the U12t in turn has a very neutral tone - what I personally would describe as dead neutral, although its signature is also very coherent. Even with the M20 module, it has a neutral tone, although the mid-bass is more evenly balanced within the signature as a whole. The increase in performance between the models is partially due to the quantity of bass, with gradually decreases from the A4t, to A6t, and U12t, which affects the airiness, separation, and transparency - as well as the tone. For while the U12t is clearly technically superior, the A6t to me has the more beautiful tonality, and is overall very reminiscent of the EarSonics' EM10 at a cheaper price, or a less warm Phantom perhaps. For people that want to stay within the 64 product line, I think the A6t would be an excellent companion to more technical iems as the U12t, U18t, or Fourte, offering a more easy-going and natural signature for example vocal-based music.
The A6t too has an enhanced mid-bass, with a lower treble peak around 7 KHz and bit of upper treble emphasis around 12 KHz I believe. But where it diverges from its siblings, is with a very pleasing midrange, stemming from a nice bump between 500 Hz to 2 Khz. This results in slightly forward, bodied, and sufficiently dense vocal presentation, with just the slightest touch of thickness from the bass. In sum, a very natural vocal reproduction - flinkenick approves. Its bottom extension is around average, but its mid-bass is more than sufficient in quantity, and remains nicely controlled. It's a punchy bass, that adds a musical element, and some extra body to the sound. The treble in turn has a clear tone, but is smoothly integrated within the signature. All in all, an easy-going and coherent signature which simply sounds very good to my ears.
When listening to the A6t, its performance does not feel lacking in a way that disappoints, simply because it is an enjoyable signature. Nevertheless, there is a steady increase in performance between the A4t, A6t, and U12t for instance. The U12t has a noticeably cleaner presentation, besting the A6t in terms of separation, transparency, and resolution, while having a significantly wider stage. The A6t does not quite reach top-tier in performance, but comes close enough. The U12t's performance on the other hand I find slightly above average in the top-tier range.
That being said, the U12t in turn has a very neutral tone - what I personally would describe as dead neutral, although its signature is also very coherent. Even with the M20 module, it has a neutral tone, although the mid-bass is more evenly balanced within the signature as a whole. The increase in performance between the models is partially due to the quantity of bass, with gradually decreases from the A4t, to A6t, and U12t, which affects the airiness, separation, and transparency - as well as the tone. For while the U12t is clearly technically superior, the A6t to me has the more beautiful tonality, and is overall very reminiscent of the EarSonics' EM10 at a cheaper price, or a less warm Phantom perhaps. For people that want to stay within the 64 product line, I think the A6t would be an excellent companion to more technical iems as the U12t, U18t, or Fourte, offering a more easy-going and natural signature for example vocal-based music.
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John Culter
100+ Head-Fier
64Audio have quite simple way to distinguish models from each other
) .. too bad they don't share some measurements through their product range or more detailed comparisons at least.
me reading nic complement the iem i bought
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My A6t are being built at the moment. Currently on shells processed. I changed from teak, to redwood burl faceplates as they released the new wood options before mine had reached that phase
i love the new wood designs, i'm getting a reshell of my iems to get lion's mane woodMy A6t are being built at the moment. Currently on shells processed. I changed from teak, to redwood burl faceplates as they released the new wood options before mine had reached that phase
Dionysus
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flinkenick,Thank you for the quick summary, I have a question. I was thinking of getting an A4 or A6, was thinking universals, but from what I have read for your quick summary I am very encouraged.
If you had a set of A18T, and wanted a companion set that offered a different sound signature, still resolving and detailed. Would you say that the A6T would be your choice? and is the A4T very behind the A6 in terms of resolving and detailed?
the A8 ship on the 20th
To complement @flinkenick's impressions of 64Audio's brand new IEMs, here are some of my own! They're models I've previously explored at CanJam SG 2018, but a fresh set of ears, a perfectly-fitting set of ear tips, a balanced cable and a balanced DAP output have certainly added surprising elements to both listening experiences. Enjoy!
64Audio N8 & PWAudio Saladin
The 64Audio N8 was a product I absolutely loved at CanJam SG. Its analog, warm and tube-like tonality was instantly loveable paired with the Tia driver’s open and crystalline top-end. However, in balanced mode with the PWAudio cable, the N8 takes on a cleaner and more transparent character; stemming from a more controlled mid-bass and a cleaner upper-midrange. The N8’s previously warmer low-end has evened out towards the sub-bass. As a result, the N8 attains a cleaner stage, as well as a blacker background, but the N8's addictive bass emphasis/accentuation was certainly maintained. This shift in contrast also means the N8 sounds clearer and more dynamic; satisfyingly impactful yet expertly controlled from bottom to top. Vocals and instruments sound more vibrant, with greater airiness, openness and detail. This plus the Tia driver’s upper-treble peak creates an open stage almost the likes of the U12t, but infused with an immensely guttural low-end as the foundation. The timbre overall is now closer to neutral (especially in the upper-midrange; where it’s brighter), but no amount of fun or ease was lost here; punchy, smooth, clear and reservedly energetic throughout.
64Audio U6t & PWAudio Saladin
My initial impressions of the U6t were that they were too lean and crisp for my tastes; lacking mid-bass body. I don’t know whether it was the show floor, the tips that were used, the single-ended configuration or some combination of them all, but my recent demo of the U6t had me quite floored: It is an incredibly balanced and musical IEM with no leanness to be found at all. It still maintains a vibrant, airy and well-articulated treble, but a richer mid-bass fills out its presentation - leading to a weightier and denser sonic palate reminiscent of the old U6. In fact, it’s mid-bass is probably a touch above neutral; night-and-day compared to my initial impressions. Again, the Tia driver still complements that with an immensely open stage and an airy delivery. The N8 with the balanced Saladin still sounds cleaner and more transparent (as a result of mid-bass control and treble speed), but the U6t has a more present centre-midrange; around 1-2kHz. This hump creates a more musical atmosphere, filled with dense and engaging instruments from end to end. There is still a light leanness in the U6t’s upper-treble, but it’s delicately delivered at the same time; a silky and elegant sense of air, even if it is a touch of warmth away from full naturalness.
Han Sound Aegis
Additionally, I managed to audition the U6t with the Han Sound Audio Aegis cable. Although I didn’t spend much time with the pairing, my initial listen leads me to believe the Aegis is a cable with an emphasis on fun and dynamic energy. The U6t experienced a boost in sub-bass energy, leading to a more even distribution between sub- and mid-bass frequencies. Thankfully, the upper-midrange has risen as well; around 2-3kHz. This prevents vocals (female especially) from sounding too recessed and adds a beautiful melodic light to the U6t’s delivery. The 12kHz peak also seems to have received additional energy, but I couldn’t confirm in the time I had. Nevertheless, the Aegis is a great alternative to the Saladin; infusing a cleaner and more textured sense of energy without excess or fatigue.
64Audio N8 & PWAudio Saladin
The 64Audio N8 was a product I absolutely loved at CanJam SG. Its analog, warm and tube-like tonality was instantly loveable paired with the Tia driver’s open and crystalline top-end. However, in balanced mode with the PWAudio cable, the N8 takes on a cleaner and more transparent character; stemming from a more controlled mid-bass and a cleaner upper-midrange. The N8’s previously warmer low-end has evened out towards the sub-bass. As a result, the N8 attains a cleaner stage, as well as a blacker background, but the N8's addictive bass emphasis/accentuation was certainly maintained. This shift in contrast also means the N8 sounds clearer and more dynamic; satisfyingly impactful yet expertly controlled from bottom to top. Vocals and instruments sound more vibrant, with greater airiness, openness and detail. This plus the Tia driver’s upper-treble peak creates an open stage almost the likes of the U12t, but infused with an immensely guttural low-end as the foundation. The timbre overall is now closer to neutral (especially in the upper-midrange; where it’s brighter), but no amount of fun or ease was lost here; punchy, smooth, clear and reservedly energetic throughout.
64Audio U6t & PWAudio Saladin
My initial impressions of the U6t were that they were too lean and crisp for my tastes; lacking mid-bass body. I don’t know whether it was the show floor, the tips that were used, the single-ended configuration or some combination of them all, but my recent demo of the U6t had me quite floored: It is an incredibly balanced and musical IEM with no leanness to be found at all. It still maintains a vibrant, airy and well-articulated treble, but a richer mid-bass fills out its presentation - leading to a weightier and denser sonic palate reminiscent of the old U6. In fact, it’s mid-bass is probably a touch above neutral; night-and-day compared to my initial impressions. Again, the Tia driver still complements that with an immensely open stage and an airy delivery. The N8 with the balanced Saladin still sounds cleaner and more transparent (as a result of mid-bass control and treble speed), but the U6t has a more present centre-midrange; around 1-2kHz. This hump creates a more musical atmosphere, filled with dense and engaging instruments from end to end. There is still a light leanness in the U6t’s upper-treble, but it’s delicately delivered at the same time; a silky and elegant sense of air, even if it is a touch of warmth away from full naturalness.
Han Sound Aegis
Additionally, I managed to audition the U6t with the Han Sound Audio Aegis cable. Although I didn’t spend much time with the pairing, my initial listen leads me to believe the Aegis is a cable with an emphasis on fun and dynamic energy. The U6t experienced a boost in sub-bass energy, leading to a more even distribution between sub- and mid-bass frequencies. Thankfully, the upper-midrange has risen as well; around 2-3kHz. This prevents vocals (female especially) from sounding too recessed and adds a beautiful melodic light to the U6t’s delivery. The 12kHz peak also seems to have received additional energy, but I couldn’t confirm in the time I had. Nevertheless, the Aegis is a great alternative to the Saladin; infusing a cleaner and more textured sense of energy without excess or fatigue.
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