[James-uk]

As I understand it, the FR change is due to the mid-bass peak in the hd800's impedance curve.  Purrin's graphs (based on 0 ohm, 170 ohm and 680 ohm outputs - tghe last simulating a sansui), suggests that a 40 ohm difference should only shift mid-bass and deep bass up by around a db or so (say at 50hrz), and then there is also the impact on damping (bass tightness) to consider.  For the comparative graphs, google up: hd800 and 120 ohm IEC standard.  

I personally prefer my mainline's nominal 16 ohm (actual ~8 ohm) setting to its 32 ohm taps.  The latter has a little more bass, but the change in tightness is also audible.  But I have yet to hear a 0 or 1 ohm amp that I really like with hd800's.  All boils down to personal preferences and priorities.

Exactly . Personal preference and priority. My personal preference is accurate extended tight bass which is why I like 0 ohm amps. I can understand why many would prefer a boost in mid bass though . For that I use HD600.

 

[Mach3]

What would you say is the point of diminishing returns when it comes to DACs and amps with HD800?
As someone here said, I'm on a McDonald's budget(thanks for the insult) and I can't really afford anything high end.
Th

 
Sorry mate was just giving an example. Perhaps a re-wording, it like you bought a Ferrari you wouldn't run it on anything but the best fuel or it won't perform at it best.
 

   
Fraid not, in my opinion.  O2 is just not a great match with hd800 or hd650's for that matter.  I'm not an O2 hater either.  Built my own and later built and added agdr's cool booster board, which reduces offset and distortion, increases transient current, and, along with a dual lme49990 in the gain stage, gives you 10x the slew rate among other benefits, making it sort of a transportable "wire."  Sounds very good and clean with most low ohm phones, sensitive planars, and even dt880's, but it makes Senn's sound thin and a little lifeless  (to my ears, ymmv, yada yada).  Frankly, the unremarkable headphone out on my marantz htr is far more enjoyable to me with hd800's.
 
If a good tube amp is out of your reach for now, I'd take a look at purrin's list of recommended hd800 amps over on chang*.  (Google "best hd800 amps" and see second nonsponsored link).  He has quite a list and nice concise descriptions of what you might expect at various price points.  Vali and mstage are two cheap options that get lots of positive reviews, but I haven't heard either personally.  For a little more, and if you're willing to do some soldering yourself or buy used, the beezar torpedo would be what I would buy in your shoes.  It is a baby parafeed tube amp (like the mainline and L-2), designed by Doug at ECP  who really knows his stuff.  My 2c fwiw.   

 
My experience matches with your assertion of the O2. I was part of the diyaudio Aussie Group Buy when the O2 was pretty much just release. I built two O2, one stock direct parts from the BOM (bill of material). The other I built using boutique caps and resisters. Result from measurement by some of the member of the group buy show a slight improvement of the noise floor. Everything was rosie until I acquired a 4 Channel Balance Beta22 as there was a thread in the head fi forum and nwavguy blog outlining the O2 had slightly better measurement than the Beta22. Debate was raised, is the O2 better than Beta22?
 
I was keen on the Beta22 as I've read many reviews stating the widest sound stage of the SS amps. Something I've learnt to love about how speaker like the HD800 sounded. So I wanted to pair it with the best amp that bring out it's strength. This proved to be true when comparing with the O2 and even the highly recommended phonitor which I also own.
 
I even purchased a second pair HD800 to do a fair comparision between the various amps I own. This made me realised measurements doesn't tell you the whole picture of how a amp performs until you actually listen to the amp. Things like sound stage width, low and high extension and imaging aren't aren't shown in the measurements.

 

[knowhatimean]

 

Just something to keep in mind ; Everyone has a slightly different definition of what constitutes "Transparent" sounding !

I know that on several occasions I've found myself scratching my head wondering if the reason they're calling one amp more transparent than another is because they happen to believe that the "popular colorations" that any number or amps produce are valid
musical musical information than an amp that may actually be giving you more "dynamic" information & simply reproducing the
more truthful representation of musical transients.

For certain genres of music listening to the "transient emphasizing" amp are a bit more exciting, but the tables turn when you talk about reproduction of dynamically dense music as the transient "overhang" seriously impedes your ability to "hear" some of the inner micro-detail of the notes as they trail off. This leads to a "sonic" continuousness that doesn't respect the compositional writing enough to allow you the insight to the various adornments that make the passage unique.

That so called "transparency" is now preventing you from hearing some of the music that is not part of the "Main Theme" but is still
an important part at the correct "dynamic balance" (yes, you can still hear everything, but the balances of what you "could" be hearing
has been altered)

The bottom line however is that if an amp has a sound emphasis it's really not more transparent . Amplifiers are simply there to amplify
the signal that a DAC or player has created

I've had the HD800 for about 3 years now. It sounds like the HD800 on all the Amps and dacs I've tried it on. The biggest change in SQ I've had from the HD800 has been a result of either alcohol / mood/ health or occasionally how baked I am. ( the later really adds sound stage and depth that is beyond any headphone technology available ) to be fair when I got my hdvd800 it sounded amazing ! Then the honeymoon ended and I realised it was just another amp and the HD800 was responsible for the phenomenal sound I was hearing .

Well, I have to say that your impressions are certainly among the most unique that I've seen about these headphones !
 
If all it takes is some type of "serious mood modificaton" to appreciate how the HD800 are the greatest thing since "sliced bread"
everyone could sell all the nice components they're using with their 800s & stock up on "mood modification" items with those funds!
 
That sounds like a plan that those using those more "transparent" amps should try. I'm pretty happy with the equipment I'm specifically using with my HD800 (which I "fixed" from the silly voicing that Sennheiser gave them) so I'll pass on your techniques 
 
You certainly made some interesting comments though (& as I said "unique")

 

[RRod]

   
As I understand it, the FR change is due to the mid-bass peak in the hd800's impedance curve.  Purrin's graphs (based on 0 ohm, 170 ohm and 680 ohm outputs - tghe last simulating a sansui), suggests that a 40 ohm difference should only shift mid-bass and deep bass up by around a db or so (say at 50hrz), and then there is also the impact on damping (bass tightness) to consider.  For the comparative graphs, google up: hd800 and 120 ohm IEC standard.  
 
I personally prefer my mainline's nominal 16 ohm (actual ~8 ohm) setting to its 32 ohm taps.  The latter has a little more bass, but the change in tightness is also audible.  But I have yet to hear a 0 or 1 ohm amp that I really like with hd800's.  All boils down to personal preferences and priorities.

 
Thanks for the proper Google-fu. And yes, as the output impedance goes up the frequency shift should match the headphone's impedance curve; I just wondered the actual effect in dB. For just 1dB of oomph in the mid-bass I would think EQ could be used with negligible effects. Personally if I wanted such a boost, I'd keep my Magni (which is certainly powerful enough for the HD800) and put a dab of EQ rather than shell out $1200-1500 for an amp for a similar effect. But EQ is of course its own hairy subject around here.

 

[jhai]

Wow, that's twice as much I paid for mine (about couple of months used.)

AU$2949.00 purchased in Australia hurts more I believe.
(Edit: Was in reference to "$2700 US dollars in New Zealand").

 

[thecrow]

Is it ok to use pink noise to burn in the HD800?

I bought my hd800s a few months ago and I was surprised how good they sounded out of the box.

Who knows maybe they were a used pair that had been used for 2 months before they were returned and then I bought them. It did cross my mind but I doubt it - they did sound good.

I can't wait to see if they evolve further as some say here over my first 100 hours.

 

[thecrow]

Thanks for the proper Google-fu. And yes, as the output impedance goes up the frequency shift should match the headphone's impedance curve; I just wondered the actual effect in dB. For just 1dB of oomph in the mid-bass I would think EQ could be used with negligible effects. Personally if I wanted such a boost, I'd keep my Magni (which is certainly powerful enough for the HD800) and put a dab of EQ rather than shell out $1200-1500 for an amp for a similar effect. But EQ is of course its own hairy subject around here.

I was in fact listening to mine last night with simply an odac and O2 I recently picked up. Nothing wrong with a little eq at all.

Not going to say it would sound as silky or shiny or polished etc as a premium amp but certainly a fair little temporary, budget minded set up.

 

[White Lotus]

I use an EQ over my HD800, 100% of the time I use them. 
 
No shame in that! 

 

[johnjen]

Exactly . Personal preference and priority. My personal preference is accurate extended tight bass which is why I like 0 ohm amps. I can understand why many would prefer a boost in mid bass though . For that I use HD600.

+1
 
The Rok (0.03Ω) matches up with 800's really well. 
 
JJ

 

[Arnotts]

I made a comparison of how the HD800's sound on both of my rigs over in the Gustard H10 thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/735828/gustard-h10-high-current-discrete-class-a-output-stage-headphone-amplifier/915#post_11428019
 
M-Stage combo does really well for the price, but the Gustard combo is definitely an improvement for the HD800's .

 

[agooh]

why I'm still enjoying my T1 and Lcd 3f more than  Hd 800 ?
any mod or amp to increase bass, also the soundstage for me not real .

 

[Sorrodje]

  why I'm still enjoying my T1 and Lcd 3f more than  Hd 800 ?
any mod or amp to increase bass, also the soundstage for me not real .

 
Depends or your tastes and what you usually listen to.  I haven't met any perfect headphone yet. Enjoy your Beyer and your Audeze and sell the HD800. I find they are great headphones despite the fact I don't like them as you do.
 
A few weeks ago, I was after a complementary headphone for my HD800. Something more relax , darker and smoother. So I bought a Koss ESP 950 and a Stax amp. The Stax amp was sold with the SR-404 and I honestly thought I would sell the SR-404 to fund the Koss. Right now, I still have the SR404 and I sold the Koss. too smooth and warm for my tastes. I'm ****.d ! Looking for a warmer and darker headphone is a bad idea .
 
I'll ever sell the 404 to purchase a Lambda Signature . this ol' lambda offer even more ethereal clarity and a better wider soundstage.  Polar opposite of your beloved LCD3F .
 
Everything come down to personal preferences.

 

[punit]

  why I'm still enjoying my T1 and Lcd 3f more than  Hd 800 ?
any mod or amp to increase bass, also the soundstage for me not real .

what amp are you using ?
 
edit : saw the Schiit Rag in your profile. That's very good with HD 800. So its not the amp. Guess you just don't like the HD 800 sound. That's personal preference. I personally don't care much for the LCD 3 sound.

 

[agooh]

My ears are very sensitive , I can hear many things in one time, Very disappointed with Hd 800 something wrong with these, maybe the cups are too big and for that you get huge soundstage but no bass. also there is 5 holes under the drivers, what's that for ???
I'vs been using them for about 2 weeks with Rag and still no smoothness , spiky at the treble, very bright and soulless . it's not for music ,
but I'm happy cause they are perfect for gaming with my brother .

 

[Sorrodje]

heuu , you're dac is really the Hugo ?