[LugBug1]

  We should elaborate a data base of happy owners who live silently and happily for a long time with the HD800 and their dac/amp system .  The HD800 happiness database.

.
 
This would be useful for newcomers

I'm in that club bud
 
I see you now have the Caiman II, how does it stack against the BM II? With the HD800 of course  

 

[Sorrodje]

  I'm in that club bud
 
I see you now have the Caiman II, how does it stack against the BM II? With the HD800 of course  

 
 
I'll speak for my own system HD800 (unmodded) + DNA Sonett 2. Please consider the following statements as a personal opinion elaborated in my own context with my own ears. Consider what I say with a grain of salt. I obviously exaggerate subjectives impressions to make it understandable.
 
The fact is the Octave and the Caiman are surprinsingly close IMO. and It seems I could happily live with both in my HD800 system.   
 
The Beresford Caiman mkiI (CMII) is more suited to the HD800 than the Beresford Bushmaster mk ii (BMII). I've no doubt . Unfortunately my USB/SPDIF transport is Broken since last tuesday so I can't use the Metrum Octave and the Bushmaster right now. When I'll grab a replacement Usb transport I'll  give you more direct comparison.  So. I can only use the CMII these last days.
 
From memory, the BMII is impressive but its sound is a bit too thin and there's some treble etch I dislike a bit with the HD800. the BMII was perfectly fine wth the ED12 + O2 combo though .
 
The CMII is a whole different story. Still very resolving with a great soundstage ( Beresford home sound I guess ? ) but with an overall more natural and bodied sound.  I'm not sure yet but the CMII seems to hit the sweet spot for my tastes : enough overall body & bass slam to be enjoyable for Jazz and EDM and Orchestral music.  enough clarity and bite in the treble to make classical Music exciting and energetic (THks for Chailly's beethoven ring .. it's exactly what I'm looking for bud !! )  . Mids are undoubtly less meaty and full than the Octave but remains "right" .  I really loved the Metrum Octave but IME, with the metrum I listen more to EDM and less to classical which I found a bit boring (still with the Metrum) and the feeling of lack of Clarity never left me.
 
If I shoulds sum up and if someone would ask me some advice I'd answer that for pop/Metal/EDM/vocals , the octave is better. For Classical : Caiman mkII would be my pick.  for contemporary Jazz ( stuff like Joshua Redman, Chick Corea, ACT recordings)  : I enjoy both equally. Metrum sounds thicker and maybe a bit darker/warmer, Caiman sound more airy and neutral while staying musical . BMI is both detailed and musical too but with less meat on bones. Hope you see the point. 
 
IMO both Caiman and Bushmaster HO are crap. So I only use those DACs with external amp ( Objective 2 & DNA Sonett 2) 
 
I'll know a bit more after a few days without the Octave. My brain will be used to the Caiman mkII and reunification with the Octave will be insigthful.  Time will tell.

 

[Somphon]

Not necessarily. I still like my other cans for certain types of EDM music. But these HD800s are out of this world for the detail, imaging and soundstage, almost like listening to a good set of speakers. I can't wait to get a decent amp and DAC up the chain

agree, love my HD800 but hug my LCD-3f at night.

 

[LugBug1]

Great stuff thanks for sharing that bud

 

[zilch0md]

 
[snip]
 
Please consider the following statements as a personal opinion elaborated in my own context with my own ears. Consider what I say with a grain of salt. I obviously exaggerate subjective impressions to make it understandable.
 
[snip]
 

 
I need to be more diligent at prefacing my opinions with disclaimers such as this.  

 
Mike

 

[zilch0md]

 
 
 

Spoiler: Good comments

I'll speak for my own system HD800 (unmodded) + DNA Sonett 2. Please consider the following statements as a personal opinion elaborated in my own context with my own ears. Consider what I say with a grain of salt. I obviously exaggerate subjectives impressions to make it understandable.
 
The fact is the Octave and the Caiman are surprinsingly close IMO. and It seems I could happily live with both in my HD800 system.   
 
The Beresford Caiman mkiI (CMII) is more suited to the HD800 than the Beresford Bushmaster mk ii (BMII). I've no doubt . Unfortunately my USB/SPDIF transport is Broken since last tuesday so I can't use the Metrum Octave and the Bushmaster right now. When I'll grab a replacement Usb transport I'll  give you more direct comparison.  So. I can only use the CMII these last days.
 
From memory, the BMII is impressive but its sound is a bit too thin and there's some treble etch I dislike a bit with the HD800. the BMII was perfectly fine wth the ED12 + O2 combo though .
 
The CMII is a whole different story. Still very resolving with a great soundstage ( Beresford home sound I guess ? ) but with an overall more natural and bodied sound.  I'm not sure yet but the CMII seems to hit the sweet spot for my tastes : enough overall body & bass slam to be enjoyable for Jazz and EDM and Orchestral music.  enough clarity and bite in the treble to make classical Music exciting and energetic (THks for Chailly's beethoven ring .. it's exactly what I'm looking for bud !! )  . Mids are undoubtly less meaty and full than the Octave but remains "right" .  I really loved the Metrum Octave but IME, with the metrum I listen more to EDM and less to classical which I found a bit boring (still with the Metrum) and the feeling of lack of Clarity never left me.
 
If I shoulds sum up and if someone would ask me some advice I'd answer that for pop/Metal/EDM/vocals , the octave is better. For Classical : Caiman mkII would be my pick.  for contemporary Jazz ( stuff like Joshua Redman, Chick Corea, ACT recordings)  : I enjoy both equally. Metrum sounds thicker and maybe a bit darker/warmer, Caiman sound more airy and neutral while staying musical . BMI is both detailed and musical too but with less meat on bones. Hope you see the point. 
 
IMO both Caiman and Bushmaster HO are crap. So I only use those DACs with external amp ( Objective 2 & DNA Sonett 2) 
 
I'll know a bit more after a few days without the Octave. My brain will be used to the Caiman mkII and reunification with the Octave will be insigthful.  Time will tell.

 

 
Everything you said about the Bushmaster MkII and the Metrum Octave rings true with my personal experience, adding though that I the headphone out of the Bushmaster MkII is superb with some phones other than the HD800.  It almost has enough power to bring out the best in the HD650, and I found that pairing to be wonderful, just the same.  If you like the  OPPO PM-1 or PM-2 signature, they are also well-suited to the headphone out of the Bushmaster MkII.  But there's just not enough power for the HD800, not to mention, the lack of fullness that you're finding with the Caiman MkII, which I've not yet heard.
 
I was really startled at first with your likening the Caiman MkII to the Metrum Octave, but you qualified it later on in a way that I find very credible.  Going by the distinctions you've provided, I think I'd prefer the less neutral, less transparent Octave MkII over a Caiman MkII for the HD800 (again, not having heard the Caiman MkII).
 
Thanks!  I feel like you've given me a really good handle on the Caiman MkII, which I'll skip for now...   

 
Mike

 

[Sorrodje]

 

Spoiler: Good comments

 

 
Everything you said about the Bushmaster MkII and the Metrum Octave rings true with my personal experience, adding though that I the headphone out of the Bushmaster MkII is superb with some phones other than the HD800.  It almost has enough power to bring out the best in the HD650, and I found that pairing to be wonderful, just the same.  If you like the  OPPO PM-1 or PM-2 signature, they are also well-suited to the headphone out of the Bushmaster MkII.  But there's just not enough power for the HD800, not to mention, the lack of fullness that you're finding with the Caiman MkII, which I've not yet heard.
 
I was really startled at first with your likening the Caiman MkII to the Metrum Octave, but you qualified it later on in a way that I find very credible.  Going by the distinctions you've provided, I think I'd prefer the less neutral, less transparent Octave MkII over a Caiman MkII for the HD800 (again, not having heard the Caiman MkII).
 
Thanks!  I feel like you've given me a really good handle on the Caiman MkII, which I'll skip for now...   

 
Mike

 
For Beresford DAC's Headphone output : Yes I only speak for the HD800. A friend of mine had good results ( with his own ears , in own system blablabla ) with some grado and AKG on its Bushmaster If I remember well.
 
I'll try with my Takstar and the new Ultrasone performance serie I'll have for reviewing purpose next week.  

 

[LugBug1]

I'd agree that the hp out of the beresford's is not ideal for the HD800. However, as far as 'added' hp outs on dacs go it is really quite good with lower impedance cans. It has a very refined sound and a nice bottom end, very smooth. The BM and AKG's is a good match imo. Far too thin sounding with the HD800 though... It just ain't got the juice man!! 
 
In regards to the Caiman, I'm defo interested in the mark II. I've owned the mark I for a number of years and still have no want to get rid. I trust Sorrodje's ears and so I'll see how he gets on with it

 

 

[Sorrodje]

In regards to the Caiman, I'm defo interested in the mark II. I've owned the mark I for a number of years and still have no want to get rid. I trust Sorrodje's ears and so I'll see how he gets on with it

 

 
UK and french postal services seem to work good together. When the metrum will be back in my system, I'll be able to loan you my Caïman mkII if you want  make your own opinion before any purchase

 

[LugBug1]

   
UK and french postal services seem to work good together. When the metrum will be back in my system, I'll be able to loan you my Caïman mkII if you want  make your own opinion before any purchase

Its a purchase that I'm probably going to make anyway but thanks for the offer bud- appreciate it Even if it is a minor improvement then I know it will be good!   

 

[Maxx134]

And I hadn't even gotten to the good part!

Yes I agree 100% on that cable is a huge reason why I canceled my hd800 sale and decided to keep it.
difference was huge improvement almost unreal.

The HD-800s were great with the Phoenix, so if the Master 9 is 5 or so years of improvements on that, then it doesn't surprise me that it is a good match.

Damping update: The imaging is now so insanely precise after putting felt on the inner ring that listening is almost scary.

here is how I would do the anax mod..
Mod it partially(not whole mod) to keep the Soundstage :

Putting anything more than over the metal ring affects soundstaging in the bass area producing a disjointed image (IMHO) and the carpet liner works best WITHOUT the stock black felt over it...

Also I posted elsewhere what may be subjective and at odds with others findings, but was my experience and what I believe with certainty so here they are..

My key points:
Tips to achieve end game sound out of the h800..

1- Do the anax2.0 mod but leave out all creatology foam except for the ring around the driver...
This is because we want to keep the signature without loosing soundstage and just tame the ringing..

2-Use a true balanced amp with balanced XLR output of at least 2watts max...
The hd800 love voltage over current but need reserve power to give true bass weight...

3-Use newest cable designs that have the most surface to conductor ratio...
That means a litz type braided cable..

Stock cable is garbage and a contributor to problems as the hd800 is the most sensitive headphones to cable change that I ever tried.

There you have the "clues" to maximum performance..

Now all you need to do is find the match of components that gives you the right "flavor" and synergy you desire,
which is another story altogether and will take you on a road of your choice of SS or tube route..

 

[icebear]

  The HD800s are the friend you go to when you need a straight answer with no sugar-coating. You come away feeling a bit shaken, but you know it's what you needed to hear. I find that thinking of them as "technical" cans pre-biases me towards dissecting sounds rather than listening to music. ...

 
+1 Great analogy !
And ... well, not everyone appreciates such an honest opinion.
Consequently there is a lot of complaining and nit picking on the HD800

.

 

[Sorrodje]

4 DACs , 2 Amps , Serious comparison to do .
 
 


 
 
I had the vali a few month ago and was not so convinced. I had the possibility to trade my Odac/O2 against this little Schitt Stack so  I splunged beacause I was interested to make my own opinion on the Vali/Modi
 
My new Vali have much less ringings than my first one !

 

[whirlwind]

  These cans really really make a meal of bad recordings and the lower bit rate stuff don't they? It's so unforgiveing I'm having to skip quite a few songs while random.
 
Now the real question, a V200 or a tube amp for these?

They sure do!
 
I feel so fortunate that i have been collecting really nice remasters for years now.....man is it ever paying off now.....I listen to pretty much nothing except flac files, and these cans love it!  

 

[Nudel]

  I lived as you with my selected playlist during a long time. the size of the playlist varied according to dac & amp changes. When the Sonett and Metrum has arrived , I found my promise land and can barely listen to everything except really crappy recordings.  and we know some genre suffer more than other from crappy recordings.
 
I'm currently using the Beresford Caiman MKII instead of the Metrum and fortunately its seems I'm not back in the middle on nowhere , looking after salvation.
 
That been said, I still think HD800 is not the best headphone for everything. With some recordings/Music , it offers stunning listens. with others it's OK but there're maybe better options elsewhere. Fortunately , for what I listen to, the HD800 covers 90 % of my bases (mostly Classical, Modern Jazz and electro) . For example, I had an Ultrasone Edition 12 during September. Very enjoayble headphone with a kind of euphony and fun i've really appreciated a lot. so I thought to buy one when mine wold go to its next owner.  But obviously ,I don't miss it so much since I'm back to the HD800 as my unique headphone . My Brain is used to the Senn After all so , even if it's not perfect when I want to listen Daft Punk, Jamie Cullum or Jamiroquai, I really can fully enjoy my music .
 
But after all, I wouldn"t advice the HD800 for everyone and every tastes.

Yes that is prefectly right. HD 800 cannot fit every tastes but... I think they fit best with jazz, classic and some good rock recordings. They maybe not are the demons in terms of speed (especially lower bass) but kick bass and kick drums are really decent sounding on this cans. Trance and techno music is also not the strongest point. I think that this cans really deserve a fine quality recordings otherwise it will be not a pleasure at all to listen to especially new recordings wich are mostly ****ty in my opinion
cheers