[johnjen]

Ah, so you're taking resolution rather than volume? I misinterpreted what you said as saying the LCD-X had bass rolloff.
[COLOR=FF00AA]
Yes resolution and for me are the harmonic/intonation relationships 'correct', as in, are the over and undertones presented 'properly'.[/COLOR]

Definitely agree with the "planar softness", I never ended up getting the detail I needed from planars. Sometimes, the soft and smooth response of Audeze cans is just what I need, but I certainly couldn't live with soft headphone as my only can. More often than not I need to hear the detail and texture of everything. And to my knowledge, nothing is able to produce both quite like the HD800.
[COLOR=FF00AA]
I agree, and when the 800's are 'properly' EQ'd, especially in the very bottom end the results are most pleasing.[/COLOR]

Interesting to see the LCD-4 review. It seems the HD800S has made Tyll realize headphone manufacturers can (and should) do better in the high end open-back sector. He'll be knocking at least a few headphones in that area off the Wall of Fame in an attempt to raise the standards of summit-fi cans.

[COLOR=FF00AA]Some are charging crazy money for marginal improvements and for me some of these changes are mostly 'affect', which means they can be quite initially impressive, yet in the fullness of time are less compelling due to the 'affect' wearing off, so to speak.
It's great for sales, for a while, then the used market starts to fill up as people want to move on.

But I was VERY impressed with the flatness of the curve of the LCD-4 from 10Hz all the way up to 11-1200Hz.
That is a remarkable achievement by any standard.

But they still are heavy, and a bit awkward, and by comparison to less intrusive cans such as the 800's, impose their physical presence while using them.
This intrusion into the listening experience usually means I can only leave them on for a couple of hours before they need to come off and let my ears and head return to 'normal'.
Whereas the 800's can and have stayed on my head for 4-6 hours (or more) at a stretch and the need to take them off wasn't due to them but for other reasons (get more water, take a pee break etc.).

This is a testament to their comfort and minimal physical intrusion while listening, which is a factor I value but doesn't seem to be noticed nor mentioned much.

JJ[/COLOR]

 

[blacknile]

I have to disagree with the opinion below. My (late SN) HD800 works beautifully with my Violectric V200 - beautifully detailed, incredible microdynamics on well recorded acoustic music. The match is, to my ears, superior to the one achieved with the Schiit amp I had before (admittedly, one of their midfi lower range models) and about as good as with my other amp, the Meier Corda Classic. I warmly recommend the HD800/V200 combo for classical,acoustic, jazz.

I don't think the V200 should be considered with the HD800 at all. You loose a bit of top end detail, air, and the soundstage is a bit smaller. The tone is warmer overall, but I can't get over the lack of ultra fine detail that the V200 is missing. After using the Phonitor Mini and switching to the V200, I can tell a lot of smaller details are lost and the resolution of the amp is lacking. The sound is a bit more congested. Bass looses some tightness and definition as well as some of it's texturing.

 

[jibzilla]

I had a pair of LCD-x's here on my system and while they are like the other planars, in that the bass is (or can be) substantial, what I noticed (by comparison) was a slight lack of very bottom end resolution on all of the planars I've been able to use in my system.

And granted my system is also EQ'd and other tricks have been added as well, but between the subsonic 'softness' and harmonic differences of the entire bottom end I MUCH prefer the 800's.

In some cases the fast attack 'voices' can be so fast that it's over before I even have a chance to react.
This is akin to the autonomic blink response, where the 'stimulus' happens so fast, and is stopped so quickly, it's seems to be over before it even started.

The 800's can do a REALLY good job of this, and with authority, all the way down to well below 20Hz.

I never heard the planars match this degree of extension, nor with the resolution (micro detail) AND authority (Power).

But then I'm really focused upon those inner details and the ability to resolve the acoustic presentation, which is my bias.

JJ

 
I have to disagree but I do not eq. I think you are making a much bigger deal about this extension than it deserves. The genres that have the most bass is electronic and rap and well 95% is still just mid bass not sub bass. Out of 400 drum and bass mp3's I can only think of one that is mostly red (sub bass) on my serato sl-3. A loxy and ink song if I'm not mistaken. 
 
Maybe the hd800 would work better for that one track but that is one track out of 400 and well there isn't a genre that has more bass than drum and bass. Mid bass no question the lcd-x punches harder than the hd800 and to me the for sure better basshead option.

 

[johnjen]

   
I have to disagree but I do not eq. I think you are making a much bigger deal about this extension than it deserves. The genres that have the most bass is electronic and rap and well 95% is still just mid bass not sub bass. Out of 400 drum and bass mp3's I can only think of one that is mostly red (sub bass) on my serato sl-3. A loxy and ink song if I'm not mistaken. 
 
Maybe the hd800 would work better for that one track but that is one track out of 400 and well there isn't a genre that has more bass than drum and bass. Mid bass no question the lcd-x punches harder than the hd800 and to me the for sure better basshead option.

I understand.
But as you stated "I do not eq." so we're comparing apples to some other fruit in this case.
And I'm not using MP3's either.
This is either 192KB all the way down to at the minimum 44.1 CD's
 
Until you experience your head rattling or feel concussive effects in your chest when they haul off and whack that 6' drum in the firebird suite, or when the organist double pedals so the subharmonics rattle your body, then you'll know what I mean when I talk about bass.
 
And I have some EDM and other synthesized bass (Overwerk, Bela Fleck, Mike Oldfield, Thom Rotella Band, etc.) that is all to often frequency limited and often times compressed as well, while remaining very impressive.
 
But in Copland's Fanfare for the Common Man where they haul off an whack that big drum, it has concussive effects.
And nothing will ever beat the cannon shots used in the 1812 overture, especially when you hear the echos of the shot bounce off the foothills in the area.
Or when you hear the air handling system's low frequency lope, just before the symphony starts.
 
There are other results due to 'proper' EQ in addition to just punchy bass, but until the EQ is dialed in they will probably remain 'hidden'.
Of course this presupposes that the rest of the system can deliver the 'good stuff' so the 800's will actually deliver this level of acoustic power, in the first place.
 
But there is a surprising amount of very low freq music 'buried' or 'hidden' and until it is brought up to the same level as everything else, it may not even be suspected it even exists.
 
 
EDIT:
Let me clarify that I don't mean to point this AT you but to use your post as an example of what I mean by low frequency response, and more pointedly what is possible when things get tweaked.
 
JJ

 

[hekeli]

  The genres that have the most bass is electronic and rap and well 95% is still just mid bass not sub bass.

 
Would you clarify in hz what you consider midbass and subbass? Thanks.

 

[georgelai57]

What would be a decent value-for-money cable replacement for the HD800 below $150? Non-balanced.

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

the stock has always sounded fine to me.

 

[listen4joy]

 i see it in this way.
HD800S little better than HD800,
HD800+SD mod almost equal to HD800S, and the price diffrence didint jusifty to upgrade it, the diffrences is minor.
HD800+SD MOD with EQ better from HD800S.
HD800S with EQ not benefit so well.

 

[Taowolf51]

What would be a decent value-for-money cable replacement for the HD800 below $150? Non-balanced.

 
You're not going to find much at that price point. New, the only thing I can think of is a BestInTheVerse cable. If you go used, you might find one every so often.

 

[iDesign]

 
 i see it in this way.
HD800S little better than HD800,
HD800+SD mod almost equal to HD800S, and the price diffrence didint jusifty to upgrade it, the diffrences is minor.
HD800+SD MOD with EQ better from HD800S.
HD800S with EQ not benefit so well.

I see it in this way: 

Stock: HD 800 S is better than HD 800 
Stock + EQ: HD 800 is better than HD 800 S because there is no second harmonic bass distortion 
Modified + EQ: A SuperDuPont modified HD 800 is better than a stock HD800 S because there is no second harmonic bass distortion 
Modified: A stock HD 800 S is better than a SuperDuPont modified HD 800  

 

[jibzilla]

   
Would you clarify in hz what you consider midbass and subbass? Thanks.

 
Midbass to me is 100-500hz, subbass below 100hz. I respect people who modify and eq their headphones but you really take them out of any comparing to other headphones. Did johnjen modify his lcd-X? I don't know. Honestly I do not know of any mods for the lcd-X. Did he eq the lcd-X? Again I do not know. In stock form I find much more bass roll off in the hd800 than lcd-X. 
 
I thought allot of the bass I was listening to was subbass but as I ran song after song through serato it was crystal clear (399 out of 400 songs) that I was listening to midbass. If you notice johnjen does not mention any genre. Just a few songs/examples. He points out that he does not use mp3's. Well I have just as many records as mp3's and I have to say still the same midbass, not subbass.
 
I'm not saying there is not subbassy songs out there. As I mentioned I have a Loxy and Ink song that is pure red throughout on my serato. Nothing but subbass. But it is rare even among bass heavy genres like electronic and rap. 

 

[hekeli]

 
Midbass to me is 100-500hz, subbass below 100hz. I respect people who modify and eq their headphones but you really take them out of any comparing to other headphones. Did johnjen modify his lcd-X? I don't know. Honestly I do not know of any mods for the lcd-X. Did he eq the lcd-X? Again I do not know. In stock form I find much more bass roll off in the hd800 than lcd-X. 
 
I thought allot of the bass I was listening to was subbass but as I ran song after song through serato it was crystal clear (399 out of 400 songs) that I was listening to midbass. If you notice johnjen does not mention any genre. Just a few songs/examples. He points out that he does not use mp3's. Well I have just as many records as mp3's and I have to say still the same midbass, not subbass.
 
I'm not saying there is not subbassy songs out there. As I mentioned I have a Loxy and Ink song that is pure red throughout on my serato. Nothing but subbass. But it is rare even among bass heavy genres like electronic and rap. 

 
Well.. we could again refer to the "popular" chart: http://www.independentrecording.net/irn/resources/freqchart/images/main_chart.jpg
 
As you see even many instruments lie down in the 60hz area. Most electronic music bass is below 100hz anyway, so I have no idea what you are talking about?? Of course they might include upper harmonics.
 
Most of my electronish' music collection extends down to 40hz. 30hz is getting somewhat rare. Feel free to download any spectrogram tool out there to view the content of your own tracks, instead of "listening to serato".
 
Standard Daft Punk for you..

 

[Solarium]

Just bought a pristine HD800 with 1 year warranty left for $750 on ebay! The canadian to US conversion rate is superb right now I can finally return my amazon HD800 now 

 
For those who use the HD800 with iDSD, do you feel like a need for a separate amp like the iCAN to power the HD800?
 
Also, I'm a newb when it comes to EQ, but I hear that the HD800 can be EQ'ed very well. Any EQ programs and settings you guys recommend?
 
Finally "officially" joining the HD800 family 

 

 

[jibzilla]

   
Well.. we could again refer to the "popular" chart: http://www.independentrecording.net/irn/resources/freqchart/images/main_chart.jpg
 
As you see even many instruments lie down in the 60hz area. Most electronic music bass is below 100hz anyway, so I have no idea what you are talking about?? Of course they might include upper harmonics.
 
Most of my electronish' music collection extends down to 40hz. 30hz is getting somewhat rare. Feel free to download any spectrogram tool out there to view the content of your own tracks, instead of "listening to serato".
 
Standard Daft Punk for you..

 
I only see 3 instruments. Not many. I see many above 60hz. If you want to say electronic most electronic bass is below 100hz that is fine but I do not see it on my serato.

 

[Zombie_X]

I have to disagree with the opinion below. My (late SN) HD800 works beautifully with my Violectric V200 - beautifully detailed, incredible microdynamics on well recorded acoustic music. The match is, to my ears, superior to the one achieved with the Schiit amp I had before (admittedly, one of their midfi lower range models) and about as good as with my other amp, the Meier Corda Classic. I warmly recommend the HD800/V200 combo for classical,acoustic, jazz.

 
It's lacking far to much micro detail for me. Not a bad pairing, but compared to my ROC and Phonitor Mini, there is a lot of detail missing. The V200 smears some transients and detail and darkens the sound. Though with the DT990, the V200 makes such a good difference. I can't listen to the HD800 on my V200 because of the muddles bits and lack of transient attack.