[RudeWolf]

 
johnjen
 
Does the Sonarworks plug-in boost the bass below 100Hz as per the Harman recommended headphone response?
 
Cheers and thanks
Frank

 
The flat one sees in the plug-in is not "microphone-flat", it's already compensated with our own curve which was developed to get a perceived tonal balance close to flat measuring speakers in a good studio. Not surprisingly our curve is fairly similar to what Harman has developed.
 
And yes - most headphones require boosting the sub-bass region.

 

[joespride]

I am using the parametric EQ built in on JRMC,  I am slowly taking different stabs at where to boost and subtract, It allows me to enter pretty much any freq. and either cut or boost at pretty much any level
 
Is there some standard out there one could take a look at and tweak from there ??  Links please if you know of any
 
 
Currently I have mine set at 
 
100hz + 0.5db
80 hz + 1 db
60 hz + 1.5 db
40 hz + 2 db
20 hz + 3 db
 
also 
5000hz -1db
6000hz -1db
7000hz -1db
 
I also have the anax mod, I chose the freq above based on my freq response graph, anyone have any suggestions ?
 

 

[MattTCG]

HD800 guys, Chord Mojo is out - anyone pair it together? From what I gather, it's a warm, intimate musical dac/amp. It should compliment the HD800 well, but there was a member who said it has a early rolloff and decay which would be a bust with the HD800. But not sure because I never heard it myself. Anyone pair it together?

 
I got an audition with the pair last week and in short, I was impressed. There was warmth and the sound was quite musical. It was a brief audition but I'll give it a thumbs up. 

 

[Youth]

For people who has heard both the HE-560 and HD800, which of the 2 has the smoothest/least sibilant treble would you say? If you have tried the Anaxilus mod with HD800 please state so.

 

[TMRaven]

Both are equally prone to sibilance, but in different ways.  Some tracks showcase sibilance more than others depending on the phone.  This is because the 560 has a hump around 4-5khz, while HD800 has a spike around 6khz.  However, the nature of the HD800's treble is that it's a bit smoother and more controlled than the 560's, even though there's more of it.  The Anax mod (at least the variant posted in IF) takes off about 3db of treble around 6khz, and helps quite a bit.
 
I haven't been able to compare 560 vs anax modded 800, though I'm guessing they're still quite close.
 
Also, all my impressions of the 560 are with Focus-A.  560 with regular Focus pads isn't too good IMO.

 

[AlanU]

  For people who has heard both the HE-560 and HD800, which of the 2 has the smoothest/least sibilant treble would you say? If you have tried the Anaxilus mod with HD800 please state so.

After performing "my" version of the Anaxilus mod  I doubt I can go back to stock form. The mod has tamed the headphones. 
 
Hearing the complaints of the HE-560 in the comfort department I have not even bothered to try "yet". The HD800 has been  extremely comfortable during chill sessions listening to the headphones. If the HE-560 is similar to the rest of the  Hifiman family this is not a HP on my wishlist.
 
The headphone mod is one thing but the rest of the headphone chain also plays a major roll. This is where simply doing the Anaxilus mod is one step in transforming the sound character  you "prefer".  

 

[Youth]

  Both are equally prone to sibilance, but in different ways.  Some tracks showcase sibilance more than others depending on the phone.  This is because the 560 has a hump around 4-5khz, while HD800 has a spike around 6khz.  However, the nature of the HD800's treble is that it's a bit smoother and more controlled than the 560's, even though there's more of it.  The Anax mod (at least the variant posted in IF) takes off about 3db of treble around 6khz, and helps quite a bit.
 
I haven't been able to compare 560 vs anax modded 800, though I'm guessing they're still quite close.
 
Also, all my impressions of the 560 are with Focus-A.  560 with regular Focus pads isn't too good IMO.

 
I see. So stock HE-560 without Focus-A pads are worse than stock HD800? I have tried T1/T1.2 and the treble was too much. I have the HE-560 home for testing without Focus-A pads and eventhough the treble is smoother than T1/T1.2 it is still bothering me a bit. I would guess that the HD800 with Anax mod would suit me fine. After all, Tyll doesn't like bright headphones but with the Anax mod the HD800 becomes one of his favourites. I guess I will have to try it sometime. How is the bass quantity on HD800 compared to HE-560? If it doesn't work out with HD800 I will have to put my faith in the new HE-X.
 
On another note, I hear Norne Draug 2 can help on the HD800 treble as well.  
 
I know HD800 are very picky with gear. I'm gonna use Audio-gd DAC 19 and Cavalli Audio Liquid Carbon. The headphones will have balanced Norne Audio Draug 2 cables. 

 

[Wildcatsare1]

I see. So stock HE-560 without Focus-A pads are worse than stock HD800? I have tried T1/T1.2 and the treble was too much. I have the HE-560 home for testing without Focus-A pads and eventhough the treble is smoother than T1/T1.2 it is still bothering me a bit. I would guess that the HD800 with Anax mod would suit me fine. After all, Tyll doesn't like bright headphones but with the Anax mod the HD800 becomes one of his favourites. I guess I will have to try it sometime. How is the bass quantity on HD800 compared to HE-560? If it doesn't work out with HD800 I will have to put my faith in the new HE-X.

On another note, I hear Norne Draug 2 can help on the HD800 treble as well.  

I know HD800 are very picky with gear. I'm gonna use Audio-gd DAC 19 and Cavalli Audio Liquid Carbon. The headphones will have balanced Norne Audio Draug 2 cables. 

I have both a modded 560 with Draug 2 Cable (though it will be shipping out today) and an HD800 with the Anax Mod. Really both are great headphones, if I was just building a headphone system, I would have no problem going with the 560s. Though the mods do improve the sound dramatically, my Buyer is getting a nicely finished product.

Your DAC19 and LC should be a great match with the HD800 or 560, really a great amp/DAC for about anything short of an HE6.

 

[Moonhead]

Youth.. 
 
Where are you located in DK? 

 

[TMRaven]

   
I see. So stock HE-560 without Focus-A pads are worse than stock HD800? I have tried T1/T1.2 and the treble was too much. I have the HE-560 home for testing without Focus-A pads and eventhough the treble is smoother than T1/T1.2 it is still bothering me a bit. I would guess that the HD800 with Anax mod would suit me fine. After all, Tyll doesn't like bright headphones but with the Anax mod the HD800 becomes one of his favourites. I guess I will have to try it sometime. How is the bass quantity on HD800 compared to HE-560? If it doesn't work out with HD800 I will have to put my faith in the new HE-X.
 
On another note, I hear Norne Draug 2 can help on the HD800 treble as well.  
 
I know HD800 are very picky with gear. I'm gonna use Audio-gd DAC 19 and Cavalli Audio Liquid Carbon. The headphones will have balanced Norne Audio Draug 2 cables. 

The bass is comparable.  The HD800 has a little more mid-bass, while the 560 has a little more low-bass.  If I were to scale them, 1 being an AD700, and 10 being an LCD-X, I'd put the HE-560 at a 7, and the HD-800 at a 5.5 maybe.

 

[devilboy]

When I auditioned the 560 and X, my conclusions matched TMRaven's. The X's bass just sounded too unrealistic. Just seemed like it was too much and it didn't sound as real and articulate as my 800s. From what I remember the 560 had deeper bass with more weight. Like I said in another post on another thread, other headphones will go deeper but there is a magic and a "rightness" to the 800.

 

[Taowolf51]

  I am using the parametric EQ built in on JRMC,  I am slowly taking different stabs at where to boost and subtract, It allows me to enter pretty much any freq. and either cut or boost at pretty much any level
 
Is there some standard out there one could take a look at and tweak from there ??  Links please if you know of any
 
 
Currently I have mine set at 
 
100hz + 0.5db
80 hz + 1 db
60 hz + 1.5 db
40 hz + 2 db
20 hz + 3 db
 
also 
5000hz -1db
6000hz -1db
7000hz -1db
 
I also have the anax mod, I chose the freq above based on my freq response graph, anyone have any suggestions ?
 

 
If you're using a parametric EQ, don't have a ton of different bands next to each other, instead just make one band with a lower Q value. A bunch of bands with thinner Q values will lead to  the EQ looking wavy or wiggly with bumps in the frequency response, but one band with a higher Q value will lead to a smoother slope. For instance, I have a single band at 10Hz with a Q value of 0.3, this leads to the smooth bass curve from 10-100Hz that you see in this image (that curve is the EQ compensation, not the final frequency response). This example is only 5 bands (and without them that green line would be perfectly flat).
 

 
The Q value is how sharp or wide you want the band to be, so you see the small dip at 6.5k is a higher Q value (3) leading to a sharper dip. Compare this to the bass boost (basically compensating for the bass rolloff of the HD800) which has a Q value of 0.3, and is much wider.
 
My advice would be to get some kind of way to visualize what changes you are making to the frequency response, it makes working with the EQ so much easier (I'm using Peace, which is for Equalizer APO). Also, look at your sennheiser graph, its frequencies are limited, so I would supplement it with Tyll's measurements which go down to 10Hz.
 
If you want, I can give you my values to give you a jumping off point.

 

[joespride]

   
If you're using a parametric EQ, don't have a ton of different bands next to each other, instead just make one band with a lower Q value. A bunch of bands with thinner Q values will lead to  the EQ looking wavy or wiggly with bumps in the frequency response, but one band with a higher Q value will lead to a smoother slope. For instance, I have a single band at 10Hz with a Q value of 0.3, this leads to the smooth bass curve from 10-100Hz that you see in this image (that curve is the EQ compensation, not the final frequency response). This example is only 5 bands (and without them that green line would be perfectly flat).
 

 
The Q value is how sharp or wide you want the band to be, so you see the small dip at 6.5k is a higher Q value (3) leading to a sharper dip. Compare this to the bass boost (basically compensating for the bass rolloff of the HD800) which has a Q value of 0.3, and is much wider.
 
My advice would be to get some kind of way to visualize what changes you are making to the frequency response, it makes working with the EQ so much easier (I'm using Peace, which is for Equalizer APO). Also, look at your sennheiser graph, its frequencies are limited, so I would supplement it with Tyll's measurements which go down to 10Hz.
 
If you want, I can give you my values to give you a jumping off point.

Yes that would be great to get a start point, Really appreciate the time you took to write the response I am still trying to absorb it

 

[Taowolf51]

  Yes that would be great to get a start point, Really appreciate the time you took to write the response I am still trying to absorb it

 
It's a bit strange at first, but once you get the basics, it's surprisingly logical. Getting a visual representation of your EQ is vital IMO to making the best EQ you can (my EQ had some issues until I got Peace, which has a visual element).
 
My EQ is:
 
Preamplification: -7db (preamplification is important because it allows you to raise and lower frequencies at will with the EQ, then globally reduce everything to prevent distortion or clipping (you technically never want to "boost" anything in the end, and the preamp compensates for any boosts you do make), I would always preamp at negative your greatest boost or negative your greatest boost +1. For example, my largest boost is +6db, so I preamplify at -7db to compensate).
 
1. 10Hz    +6db    0.3Q    (this band compensates for bass rolloff)
 
2. 1000Hz    +1.5db    0.3Q    (this band adds a slight rise up to 1kHz, which as discussed by Tyll and Bob Katz adds a lot to midrange and vocal presence, which I agree with, it's a small boost but it makes a big difference)
 
3. 2000Hz    +2db    1.41Q    (this band helps with that immediate dip from 1.5k to 4k. It doesn't fully compensate for it, but instead makes the dip smoother and less immediate, rolls pretty well into the 6.5k compensation)
 
4. 6500Hz    -2db    3Q    (this band reduces the well known 6.5k spike. This was made for an Anax modded HD800, so if yours is not modded, you may want to increase the strength of this band)
 
5. 15000Hz    -2db    1Q    (this band just smooths the upper treble a bit. It's nowhere near as early or as intense as the Harman curve, so the HD800 retains its great upper treble. I can still hear up to 19kHz with this EQ applied, so it's pretty mild)

 

[joespride]

I can see I have a bit to learn, input your EQ settings exactly and overall much smoother sounding still retains plenty of extension, Bass sounds much better
 
 
I really appreciate the help,  The 800 just took another step up