[pearljam50000]

So... Is that a "no"?
Lol
Ok , message received.

No, there is no point. The molecules that make up the HD800 transducers are locked in a vacuum devoid of space/time. Only the ceremonial sacrifice of 666 virgins precisely at the 300 hour mark can free those particles to even make sound. If you want them to sound like Summit-Fi headphones - you then need to high five an albino, after copulating with a pink unicorn. Hope this helps!

 

[bearFNF]

I think the message is, just enjoy the music and stop over analyzing it.

At least that is what I got out of it, that and a good laugh.

 

[mikemercer]

The HP out on my sprout sounds like complete and total donkey balls.

I have no idea what the heck you're listening to. My little leckerton, heck, even the Fiio E12 sounds better.

I would send it back. You never know.
I enjoy it very much.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Quote:

  I'd guess @mikemercer has a crapload of Nordost power noise filtering stuff behind his desk still (correct me if I'm wrong). I've had a few components with only basic power supplies that were transformed in their performance by noise filters and regenerators, which did the work the PSU of the devices couldn't. For that reason, whenever I evaluate inexpensive gear, I remove all the extra stuff for the most part, as I want to hear how it will sound if someone who only had a pair of stock headphones, a desk and a computer would experience it. HD-800 impressions IMO are especially susceptible to this. 

 
I do have a Nordost QRT power system behind my main desk (a QB8 + Qv2 and a couple plug-ins) - but - I do the same thing Amos does when it comes to inexpensive gear (I have all my reference stuff plugged into the Nordost QRT all the time) I actually have another spot for power that's totally un-treated too. 

 

[scottiebabie]

No, there is no point. The molecules that make up the HD800 transducers are locked in a vacuum devoid of space/time. Only the ceremonial sacrifice of 666 virgins precisely at the 300 hour mark can free those particles to even make sound. If you want them to sound like Summit-Fi headphones - you then need to high five an albino, after copulating with a pink unicorn. Hope this helps!

 
Oooo Noooo i screw'd the pooch instead of a unicorn! now i know why i cant reach orgasm summit!! ROTFL
 
guess the take is dont take it too seriously & just enjoy. music is supposed to be fun whether summit, amost summit, mid or even coolie-fi 

 

[subtle]

Is there any point using the HD800 before the 300 hours burn in?

 
Since when did the HD800 become a headphone that necessitated a 300 hour burn in?
 
When did I miss this nonsense?  That's almost as amusing as the good ol' days when Acix would insist the K701 needed like 600+hours to burn in.

 

[pearljam50000]

So how many hours are needed? And what are the major changes in sound?

 

[subtle]

So how many hours are needed? And what are the major changes in sound?

 
From my personal experience none.  I bought my first HD800 the first week it was released years ago, serial number 360, and sold it within a year.  Not sure exactly why but at that time the sound wasn't working for my ears.  Fast forward to a few years down the line I decided to give the HD800 another whirl, primarily based on that thread that implies that later production units sound different from older units.  Now I can not either confirm nor deny whether that is true or not, but my current HD800 (which is somewhere in the 26XXX serial number range) definitely sounds improved over the early unit and has been my most used "go to" headphone since acquiring it about a year ago.  To note where the latter was improved on sound, it's just nowhere near as strident and bright as the early production model and has a much more balanced sound output across the entire spectrum.
 
As far as burn in is concerned it had zero effect on both pairs I have purchased.  The old one never did change with burn in hence me ending up selling it.  My current pair has sounded amazing straight out of the box and it too has not changed a single bit with burn in.  YMMV. 

 

[kapanak]

  As far as burn in is concerned it had zero effect on both pairs I have purchased.  The old one never did change with burn in hence me ending up selling it.  My current pair has sounded amazing straight out of the box and it too has not changed a single bit with burn in.  YMMV. 

 
I agree with this. I owned a 2XXX serial number, and then a 97XX serial number, both sold, and I re-purchased one after a year or so, 34XXX serial number. It certainly sounded more balanced, with plenty of low frequencies and high frequencies (which the HD800 never lacks haha), and the same amazing mids as before. And it sounded wonderful right out of the box.
 
Most HD800 go through plenty of testing and in-factory burn-in already. I have found that burn-in has never actually had an effect on the HD800. Changes in the source and amplification has some effects, and changes in cables, none.

 

[scottiebabie]

So how many hours are needed? And what are the major changes in sound?

if it were me (& i have intense need to know), i would do a semi critical listen & note the down my impressions. put the Senns on the cooker when im working or out&abouts & note the times spent on burn it. take it out at intervals & note impressions. for a more scientific study, make the listening intervals time specific but the main crux is diligent record keeping.
 
if i do hear differences at diifferent time intervals, then to me, burn in is real & screw what anyone else says. there is very good science that dynamic transducers do loosen up with playtime (ie burn-in) & its logical to assume that may & can affect changes in the reproduction of sound. 
 
just my 2c take on the voodoo of burn-in 

 

[pearljam50000]

That's interesting, thanks.
Should i ask the seller for a unit that has a serial number of 30XXX and later?
Quote:

   
From my personal experience none.  I bought my first HD800 the first week it was released years ago, serial number 360, and sold it within a year.  Not sure exactly why but at that time the sound wasn't working for my ears.  Fast forward to a few years down the line I decided to give the HD800 another whirl, primarily based on that thread that implies that later production units sound different from older units.  Now I can not either confirm nor deny whether that is true or not, but my current HD800 (which is somewhere in the 26XXX serial number range) definitely sounds improved over the early unit and has been my most used "go to" headphone since acquiring it about a year ago.  To note where the latter was improved on sound, it's just nowhere near as strident and bright as the early production model and has a much more balanced sound output across the entire spectrum.
 
As far as burn in is concerned it had zero effect on both pairs I have purchased.  The old one never did change with burn in hence me ending up selling it.  My current pair has sounded amazing straight out of the box and it too has not changed a single bit with burn in.  YMMV. 

 

[kapanak]

  Have you heard every amp under $3000? 

 
Obviously not. But I have heard many options that people here and elsewhere consider great and recommend.
There are plenty of mediocre expensive amps.
 

  Lets not be ridiculous with technicality here lol. I am sure kapanak meant of the ones he heard.
 
Thanks for the great suggestion. The bass boost looks like a bounce with the HD800. I will look into it...

 
Thank you. I hope any choice you make works out well for you
 

  Both the iFi Micro iDSD & Valhalla 2 I'm sure are great product and would scale well with the HD800. But to compare them to $3000k amps??
Kapanak can you name maybe one or two of these so call 3k amps you have heard. I would love to hear a comparison. Who knows, I might even agree with you.

 
For weeks, I had been reading and posting and asking and everything possible. In the end, I decided a comparison by myself was the only way to find an answer.
 
Plenty of people claim dubious BS here all the time. In my case, I actually made that conclusion after extensive listening in the last two weeks on 12 different amps and 3 different sources, though some of the amps also had built-in DACs or were DACs with built-in amps, and while I am busy this week, look forward to that comparison
 
The amps were Schiit Ragnarok, Auralic Taurus MKII, Sennheiser HDVA600, DNA Sonnett 2, DNA Stratus, Bottlehead Crack, Schiit Valhalla 2, Lehmann Black Cube Linear, Resonessence Labs Concero HP, Marantz HD-DAC1, HeadAmp GS-X, and Violectric V181.
 
Other than the Concero HP and the Marantz, which were DAC/Amps, the rest were fed by first the Resonessence Labs Concero HD, then by the iFi Micro iDSD, and at last, by an Auralic Vega DAC.
 
No, I don't know one person who owns all of that of course, but I was able to track down enough people to make sure I have heard those all. Some were loaned out from CableCo and shipped to Seattle, which I subsequently picked up and brought to Vancouver, and others were sourced from local shops and enthusiasts.
 
And all the listening was done through my HD800. And no, I didn't do A/B testing or blind testing, because it would not be statistically correct no matter how I set it up.
 
And of course, my conclusions only hold for me, and my ears and my musical tastes and expectations. I play several instruments from a young age, and was told to have a near perfect pitch as a child, and able to play music by ear only. So for me, I have a pretty good idea of what I hear from the HD800 and the changes in source. Still, YMMV
 
Based on my own ears, I found the iFi Micro iDSD and the Valhalla 2 pairing, which costs a total of $1000 in Canada, to be ~90% there in terms of sound quality to the best combination for me, which was the Vega and Ragnarok ($5500 total in Canada). Of course, the Valhalla 2 sounded even better with the Vega than the iFi Micro iDSD. Auralic's own Taurus MKII sounded amazing as well, and would probably be my second option if not the Ragnarok. The Taurus MKII was more user friendly than the Ragnarok though.
 

Just a two cent opinion on a 3000 bucks amp.

How does one quantify a $3000 amp's ability ?
How does one arrive at this $3000 figure ?

Can a $400 or $500 amp that can bridge or even near that gap of quality? Why not ?

The internal parts are dirt cheap (from manufacturers pov, they buy in bulk). It is the r&d, branding and other overhead costs that made up the main bulk of $3000.

If the manufacturer and r&d team knows what they are doing, they can certainly come out with something like Schiit.

Unless you have plenty of cash to burn, by all means spend what you like. For folks like us with certain amount of budget to play around, a brand like Schiit is a god send. Aesthetic, functionality, quality and price range - Win, Win, Win and Win.

 
Exactly. Anybody can just put a price tag and people will flock to buy it because it's expensive.
 
A nice example in the camera world today are the fancy-fied Hasselblad cameras, which are just Sony cameras with a new shell. Or even Leica cameras other than the M-series and S-series 
 
... or Vertu phones.

 

[zerodeefex]

I would send it back. You never know.
I enjoy it very much.
 

I do have a Nordost QRT power system behind my main desk (a QB8 + Qv2 and a couple plug-ins) - but - I do the same thing Amos does when it comes to inexpensive gear (I have all my reference stuff plugged into the Nordost QRT all the time) I actually have another spot for power that's totally un-treated too. 

 
I have a 250A breaker and isolated, dedicated circuits for my audio setup in the office. I also have a bit of upstream power conditioning gear.
 
The truth of the matter is that the cheapy headamp implementation in the Sprout combined with the bass emphasis/wonky sound signature on it produces mediocre sound on headphones and, while okay, is nowhere near good enough for really high end gear. The "powers anything" statement for speakers is untrue as it audibly distorts once you cross the 20wpc threshold (which I can hit on < 85dB @ 1w @ 1m speakers).
 
The Sprout is a good product for what it is: a small, all-in-one unit that comes with a heap of compromises. If you're using the HD800, though, it's a terrible pairing. It pairs best with modest speakers (Dennis Murphy Affordable Accuracy/modded BS22s) and modest headphones (HD600, K7XX). 

 

[mikemercer]

   
I have a 250A breaker and isolated, dedicated circuits for my audio setup in the office. I also have a bit of upstream power conditioning gear.
 
The truth of the matter is that the cheapy headamp implementation in the Sprout combined with the bass emphasis/wonky sound signature on it produces mediocre sound on headphones and, while okay, is nowhere near good enough for really high end gear. The "powers anything" statement for speakers is untrue as it audibly distorts once you cross the 20wpc threshold (which I can hit on < 85dB @ 1w @ 1m speakers).
 
The Sprout is a good product for what it is: a small, all-in-one unit that comes with a heap of compromises. If you're using the HD800, though, it's a terrible pairing. It pairs best with modest speakers (Dennis Murphy Affordable Accuracy/modded BS22s) and modest headphones (HD600, K7XX). 

Yeah I see the Sprout as great for a college student. And it plays well w/ my lil' CEntrance Masterclass desktop coaxial speakers (not difficult to drive at all) and I hated the signature w/ the HD800s w/ the stock cable and this other wire (cant remember at the moment) - but something about the Nordost Heimdall leaned it out for me and I actually enjoyed the combo during that listening sesh - all comes down to taste I think. Plus - I was coming to the end of a 72-hour-straight work binge!! I got a nasty post-CES flu and was playing catch-up.
 
But - of course I didn't use 800s or anything close when I wrote about the Sprout - mostly used my 50x, Monster DNA Pros, and HD-25 1-IIs.
 
That was experimentation time!! I'll do it again to check if I was past the "over-tired" state and into the tripping-I-should-be-asleep state when I did that!!!!
As soon as I have some time. You got me curious. 
 
And yeah - I'm VERY grateful to have two friends that are electricians up here  - when we moved out the first time years ago they gave me an isolated 250a breaker as well.
My buddy J did the same thing here I believe - I just asked him to mimic what he did at our old house. It's crazy because I swear, even with the SAME SYSTEM, all variables (like when I move my WA7 between my home office and up-front) that it sounds different. Alexandra heard it too - and it's not over-the-top, but detail retrieval and especially bass control are different. I actually did an A/B test like that to show a buddy he had problems in his AC line when we set his stereo up. He installed some conditioning and was able to remedy it without spending much $$. This is our first house (that we own) so the investment was worth it!

 

[nw130d]

Think I narrowed it down to Schiit Valhalla 2 (Hi Lo gain for different headphones, carry the tubes in a small hard case) and by the sounds of it might even sound better than my WA2.

 

[WilCox]

  Think I narrowed it down to Schiit Valhalla 2 (Hi Lo gain for different headphones, carry the tubes in a small hard case) and by the sounds of it might even sound better than my WA2.

 
Excellent choice.  I have both the WA2 and the Valhalla 2 and both are excellent, but different.  Lately, I've been preferring the Valhalla 2 which keeps just the right amount of "tubeocity" without going over the top.