[bhaycraft]

Hello all,
 
Proud to say I have read all pages of this thread and after only reading about I would say 6 different pages randomly I pulled out my card for both the cans and the ATH leather (or something) earpads. Well I got the cans today when I got home from a trip and have been burning them since 9PM with the bass link in the second post of this thread. My plan is to leave them burning till I leave on Tuesday morning for another 4 day trip and plan to take them with me. I will be pairing them with my Leckerton UHA-6S MKII and my trusty iRiver iHP-120 Rockboxed and will try comparing them to the only other thing I have which is a set of Ety ER4P/S iems. Later, I hope to compare them to a pair of LFF Paradox. Hope to send my T50RP off soon to get the conversion but have been waiting on the special pads from Singapore.
 
Looking forward to some great sound !!! Put me in the Happy To Be Hear Club !!!

 

[analogsurviver]

Quote:

 
Right. Many discerning listeners will notice some clipping--as well as the accompanying increases in THD that some amps would generate--at a volume level before that point is reached. 
 
 
 
True, with an ideally designed speaker under almost equally ideal conditions. Your assumption is that the tweeter is equally designed to handle the amount of power given it as the other drivers in a speaker configuration, and that's not always true with store bought speakers. Then factor in the choice of source media (genre or recording) that may have more highs, and/or some kind of EQ (tone controls that have been adjusted by the user or room EQ wizard) that has attenuated the tweeter higher; only takes a few db of that to push tweeters too hard when the other drivers may not be protesting much yet.  

Right. I keep forgetting users may well use EQ for some reasons and with trebly musical content and EQ levels dangerous for tweeters are possible with the use of unclipped power too.
 
It is cruel to attach an oscilloscope to the output of the power amplifier and watch for clipping; you might be in for a shock to learn that unclipped/undistorted level achievable with your present amp is way below your normal listening level - you are actually forced to use amp clipped at least some percentage of time in order to achieve satisfactory volume level. Reason? For a few dBs increase in volume you may be required to change your 100 W amp to something like 400 - 1000 W amp, burning a (too great?) hole in the pocket. Since 100 or so W is the limit for the trully great sounding amps, more powerful brethern might not cut it sonically at all normal levels, which is about 95 % of the time using "normal" music. Those more powerful amps that do cut it sonically are scarce, generally not available or cost in the five figure range. Tradeoffs - as usual. 
 
One correction - I DO NOT assume tweeters in any given loudspeaker to have the same power rating as other drivers. The lion's share in acoustical power generated is in the bass -  while recording Mahler's 2nd symphony ( enlarged orchestra, tubular bells, gong, organ, 100+ member mixed choir, soloist singers ) all that is needed to adjust the recording level proved to be the whack on tympany in the finale - with everyone else producing as much noise as they possibly can do still in articulated manner at the same time ! So, the bass drivers might be 300 W, midrange ( if present ) say 50-80 W and tweeters 30 W - or somethhing in that general ballpark. These are continous ratings, not instantaneous ones that can reach as high as 1000 W for a tweeter for very short periods of time.

 

[waynes world]

Quote:

Yes you are correct. Any wider bigger pads will actually help the sound of the HA-S500 it seems. I know you just got the ATH velours but I will mention it here again. The perfect pads for these HA-S500 are the ATH leathers. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ear-Pads-Audio-Technica-ATH-SJ5-DJ-Style-Headphones-Black-/251154378718?_trksid=p4340.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D11%26meid%3D2185040323540790785%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D1005%26rk%3D3%26sd%3D261074733570%26
I can safely say without a doubt in my mind this is the best sound coming from the HA-S500. If you transplant the drivers to the HA-M750 then that would negate the need for other pads obviously but for guys that plan on not doing a transplant. These ATH leather pads are it.. It is what should have come with the headphones.

 
Dsnuts, thanks for the link and the enthusiasm. Make that $15 more hard earned Canadian cash spent tonight! Time to log out of this thread I think!

 

[cel4145]

Quote:

One correction - I DO NOT assume tweeters in any given loudspeaker to have the same power rating as other drivers. 

 
Sorry. You misunderstood. You described an ideal speaker design where the tweeter and other driver(s) would start to stress at the same time. I imagine that speaker manufacturers don't work that hard to make that true. So for example, if we push pink noise or a random selection of music at a speaker and slowly increase the volume, either the tweeter or the one of the drivers might reach its limits first because one is the "weaker link" in the design. Similarly, as a car engine is pushed towards its limits, in some engine designs, one aspect of the engine is going to go first when the other components are not quite near their tolerances.  The engine may throw a rod when the rest of the engine would have withstood even faster speeds and more torque. 

 

[analogsurviver]

Quote:

I'm sorry Analog. I have no idea how you got them pads on there. You said they are just pressed on there? It is way too big for the HA-S500..The ATH leathers are 1/4 inch wider diameter wise over stock. This may seem little but actually makes them mostly over my ears now. Comfort wise they are not the velours but they are more comfy over the stock pads by much. I don't have issue with listening with them for several hours. INow that Analog mentions having a bigger circumaural pad..A bigger pad that will fit a smaller 40mm driver housing makes sense to me..But try out the ATH leathers for certain. I think guys will be very impressed.  

I didn't - can not be done, they are too large. They are being held in place by the clamp force of the headband and nothing else.  They can not seal between the pads and earcup properly, yet the sound produced is the best yet achived with HA-S500. It can be done by a single person, if you have the possibility to enlist one ( or ideally two ) hottie(s) to help you positioning the earpads correctly - good for you ! 
 
Joking aside, please try it. After hearing this combo, it should be clear why getting any on ear earpads would be a step backwards. This is merely "technology demonstrator" and not permanent or practical solution to the problem. Real deal is transplanting HA-S500 drivers in a suitable circumaural headset - it has been done with HA-S600 and some Philips by now, after I do comparisons of HA-S500 to AKG K1K and Stax Lambda I will transplant mine into JVC HA-M750.
 
I will be getting ATH leather pads - the seller also has nice cases and I will throw these pads in the next order ( Any excuse is a good one, even if brought on a tail of a dog - just one of our sayings.)
 
As always, enjoy your music !

 

[Dsnuts]

Quote:

 
Dsnuts, thanks for the link and the enthusiasm. Make that $15 more hard earned Canadian cash spent tonight! Time to log out of this thread I think!

Good choice to get the pads. I am telling everyone on this thread. If you guys think the stock pads will give you 100% of the Carbon Nanotube sound. You guys are getting something like 90%. Not the full deal. These pads let you have the full deal. There is no more want or curiosity for better after these pads. The genius is the fact that they are closed and not free breathing like the velours yet has a much wider sound hole.
Quote:

I didn't - can not be done, they are too large. They are being held in place by the clamp force of the headband and nothing else.  They can not seal between the pads and earcup properly, yet the sound produced is the best yet achived with HA-S500. It can be done by a single person, if you have the possibility to enlist one ( or ideally two ) hottie(s) to help you positioning the earpads correctly - good for you ! 
 
Joking aside, please try it. After hearing this combo, it should be clear why getting any on ear earpads would be a step backwards. This is merely "technology demonstrator" and not permanent or practical solution to the problem. Real deal is transplanting HA-S500 drivers in a suitable circumaural headset - it has been done with HA-S600 and some Philips by now, after I do comparisons of HA-S500 to AKG K1K and Stax Lambda I will transplant mine into JVC HA-M750.
 
I will be getting ATH leather pads - the seller also has nice cases and I will throw these pads in the next order ( Any excuse is a good one, even if brought on a tail of a dog - just one of our sayings.)
 
As always, enjoy your music !

Before you transplant. Try out the pads first and see what you think. You might not even bother after you hear your HA-S500 using the leather pads.. Cute strikes again with one of the best and easiest mods you can do with your already great sounding HA-S500. The pads do make a difference and I am all too happy to report for the much better too. More comfort with better sound all for $14. People spend $100s on amps for lesser results. 
 
Don't consider it guys. Just do it. You won't regret it. I eagerly await what the guys that got them will think once you get them.. You guys thought your HA-S500 sound good now. Wait till you all realize just what the ATH leathers do for them. Then you all will understand.

 

[Achmedisdead]

First things first for me....I have HD25 velours on the way. I'm going to give them some time before I try anything else. 

 

[analogsurviver]

Quote:

 
Sorry. You misunderstood. You described an ideal speaker design where the tweeter and other driver(s) would start to stress at the same time. I imagine that speaker manufacturers don't work that hard to make that true. So for example, if we push pink noise or a random selection of music at a speaker and slowly increase the volume, either the tweeter or the one of the drivers might reach its limits first because one is the "weaker link" in the design. Similarly, as a car engine is pushed towards its limits, in some engine designs, one aspect of the engine is going to go first when the other components are not quite near their tolerances.  The engine may throw a rod when the rest of the engine would have withstood even faster speeds and more torque. 

OK, I do not want to pursue this ad nauseum... I am an old school guy, accustomed to the standards for measurements set by the Instituto del' Alta Fedelta in Rome, Italy - it was their measurements that set the standards globally and were published in the Italian magazines Suono and  Stereoplay starting in late seventies and spanning through present time published in many publications in the intervening years. They did measure the maximum SPL achievable for certain level of distortion across the audible range - and yes, these measurements confirm you saying that manufacturers should work harder in order to get that SPL capability more uniform across the entire range. American magazine Audio ( now defunct ) did pick up the theme, introducing another useable and very rarely published data - that for linearity of output loudness vs input signal. This way, the compression that is inevitable in dynamic speakers ( more power heats up the coil, resistance gets higher, current gets lower, force gets lower, SPL gets lower = compression ) could be measured - but I bet this was not popular with speaker manufacturers ...! In contrast, well designed and properly driven electrostatics show no such compression of the dynamic range - provided you are satisfied with the achievable SPLs in the first place.
 
What I find so alluring in HA-S500 is the (near?) complete freedom from dynamic aberation - as far as dynamic range is concerned, it runs rings around both AKG K 1000 and Stax Lambda Pro.
It can go completely clean to extremely loud levels - some percussion recordings I thought I knew completely scared the **** out of me, as whatever went on before was unable to reproduce these peaks correctly. It is equally capable at the other, quiet part o the dynamic range, bringing up whisper details that so far went unnoticed. I only wish it was not so poor in the soundstage department...

 

[Doc-holliday]

OK, I do not want to pursue this ad nauseum...

Too late.....

 

[analogsurviver]

Quote:

Good choice to get the pads. I am telling everyone on this thread. If you guys think the stock pads will give you 100% of the Carbon Nanotube sound. You guys are getting something like 90%. Not the full deal. These pads let you have the full deal. There is no more want or curiosity for better after these pads. The genius is the fact that they are closed and not free breathing like the velours yet has a much wider sound hole.
Before you transplant. Try out the pads first and see what you think. You might not even bother after you hear your HA-S500 using the leather pads.. Cute strikes again with one of the best and easiest mods you can do with your already great sounding HA-S500. The pads do make a difference and I am all too happy to report for the much better too. More comfort with better sound all for $14. People spend $100s on amps for lesser results. 
 
Don't consider it guys. Just do it. You won't regret it. I eagerly await what the guys that got them will think once you get them.. You guys thought your HA-S500 sound good now. Wait till you all realize just what the ATH leathers do for them. Then you all will understand.

OK. You persuaded me to get ATH leathers first. It will add at least two weeks delay to everything due to shipping etc. I completely agree with your reasoning regarding pricing for everything we do in order to get the best sound possible.
 
My main purpose was to find something/anything that could be used to monitor the live recording in the same acoustic space with the musicians. HA-S500 proved to be hopelessly inadequate in sound isolation for this purpose - with any pads. HA-M750 is WAY better in this regard. Who knows, I might end up buying another HA-S500 or HA-S400, but decision to transplant the HA-S500 drivers to HA-M 750 stands firmly.
 
As does my decision to do whatever it takes to get at least decent soundstage from HA-S500 drivers.

 

[marcusgratus]

okay quick question to all you 500 owners who use it with portable players. are these battery guzzlers?

 

[Achmedisdead]

Quote:

okay quick question to all you 500 owners who use it with portable players. are these battery guzzlers?

Not at all.

 

[Doc-holliday]

okay quick question to all you 500 owners who use it with portable players. are these battery guzzlers?

When I have used mine direct from my ipod touch, I barely have the volume above half to consider it loud to my ears. So yes he's right the answer is no.

 

[marcusgratus]

ok thanks to both of you now most of my questions are finished and i wish i could go to the customs office to get my stuff from them.. the wait is killing me

 

[psycho2097]

So as doc posted my query on this thread a few pages pages back, based n his reco, I ordered myself one of these last nite, n a set of ATH leathers today. So now I have those 2 and an ipod nano 5th gen coming in (I like my galaxy nexus well enuf, but running out of space, what with all the 1-2gig games n all) for my birthday(10/10). Definitely gonna b one of my best self-birthday-gifts yet!!!