[CreditingKarma]

the build on the formula s while little flash is very solid and well built

I agree it is built like a tank IMO. The ability to add the powerman is great as it improves the amp with a black background and improved dynamics to my ear. I would like to compare the HPA4 directly as some point in time. I don't require the additional features that the HPA4 has though as Bartok can do all that the HPA4 does. The benchmark is cheaper by a large amount compared to the formula s and powerman so there is that to consider as well. The formula s is full class a as well though.

 

[Roasty]

Those of you who have tried.. Does headphone amp single ended topology lose out in any way to a fully balanced path? Contemplating formula/powerman.

 

[CreditingKarma]

Those of you who have tried.. Does headphone amp single ended topology lose out in any way to a fully balanced path? Contemplating formula/powerman.

I have fully balanced with my liquid platinum and a se design with the formula s. I think that it all comes down to the way that the amp is designed. the true benefit in balanced is extra power sometimes and also if you are doing extremely long cable runs like with pro audio. There it is a plus due to superior noise rejection. I would suggest a formula s with RCA inputs. I ended up needing to use adapters with the one that I have as the way that the xlr inputs are wired doesn't want to play nicely with my Bartok. I plan to have the XLR switched to RCA after the current cover crisis is past us.

I highly recommend the formula s with the TC tough it is a great pairing.

 

[radnor]

Hey there I have a brand new susvara I am willing to trade for a Abyss AB-1266 Phi TC. Anyone interested let me know. I am in SF Bay area so we could swap in person if in Cali.

thanks

 

[DJJEZ]

I used my Phi TC when reviewing this amazing amp here:
https://www.headphone.guru/the-benchmark-hpa4-headphone-amplifier-the-leader-in-transparency/

Bought the amp after the review as I was so thoroughly impressed.

Those of you who have tried.. Does headphone amp single ended topology lose out in any way to a fully balanced path? Contemplating formula/powerman.

On a HPA4 i read single ended and balanced performance is identical. Cant speak for formula/powerman

 

[MacedonianHero]

On a HPA4 i single ended and balanced performance is identical. Cant speak for formula/powerman

Actually single-ended output is 1/2 the power of balanced. Inputs (like the GS-X mini) can be either...thankfully. The Formula/Powerman is a single-ended amp front to back. Both are outstanding choices for the Phi TC headphones.

 

[joseph69]

Actually single-ended output is 1/2 the power of balanced.

A few HF members where once at my place and we were discussing this, but were unsure if this was the case with all balanced amps.
Is this true for all balanced amps, or does it depends on the topology?

 

[astrostar59]

A few HF members where once at my place and we were discussing this, but were unsure if this was the case with all balanced amps.
Is this true for all balanced amps, or does it depends on the topology?

Yes balanced gives you 6v and SE generally 2v but sometimes 3v. But that doesn't always equate to better sound quality. Many of the high level amps are single ended with a transformer to 'make' balanced, and actually sound better SE.
The Violectric V281 was an unusual case in that it DID sound better on balanced, partly as it had 2 more amp boards it used on balanced.

 

[Roasty]

Yes balanced gives you 6v and SE generally 2v but sometimes 3v. But that doesn't always equate to better sound quality. Many of the high level amps are single ended with a transformer to 'make' balanced, and actually sound better SE.
The Violectric V281 was an unusual case in that it DID sound better on balanced, partly as it had 2 more amp boards it used on balanced.

Thanks for that info!

I'm doing a home demo for Stellia and using it on my HPA4. Tried the single ended cable and then the balanced xlr, and the balanced out does sound better. On the single ended, the highs are in your face and harsh/bright. But they're pulled back a bit and lesser in volume and harshness with the balanced cable. Also seems fuller in the bass section.

 

[joseph69]

Yes balanced gives you 6v and SE generally 2v but sometimes 3v. But that doesn't always equate to better sound quality. Many of the high level amps are single ended with a transformer to 'make' balanced, and actually sound better SE.
The Violectric V281 was an unusual case in that it DID sound better on balanced, partly as it had 2 more amp boards it used on balanced.

Yes, we were all aware that balanced doesn't necessarily sound better than SE, but we were unsure if all balanced amps use half their power SE vs balanced. I know my GS-X only uses half it power SE from a discussion I had with @MacedonianHero a while back, but as mentioned, we weren't too sure if this applies to all. Thanks.

 

[astrostar59]

It doesn't apply to all amps, in fact the majority of amps are NOT truly balanced. Why is that? Because you effectively have to make double the gain stage, double the costs. Most use a transformer or similar to crate a suedo balanced configuration.

IMO if an amp designer spent that money only on SE it would result in a better performance based on the extra funds available for the parts / construction costs.

Creating balanced with tubes IMO is also not so easy as (depending on the topology) you may need a perfect set of tubes to 'mirror' the circuit. Not easy.

 

[TheMiddleSky]

Yes, we were all aware that balanced doesn't necessarily sound better than SE, but we were unsure if all balanced amps use half their power SE vs balanced. I know my GS-X only uses half it power SE from a discussion I had with @MacedonianHero a while back, but as mentioned, we weren't too sure if this applies to all. Thanks.

True, it doesn't always half of power when single ended. It could be only quarter of power when single ended compare to balance output. However, afaik, it depends on the amp system and impedance of the headphones.

Questyle CMA 12
https://www.questyle.com/en/product/CMA-twelve

Compare to SE, Balance out produce (roughly) 4 times more power at high impedance headphone and (roughly) 2 times more power at low impedance headphone.

 

[MacedonianHero]

Yes, we were all aware that balanced doesn't necessarily sound better than SE, but we were unsure if all balanced amps use half their power SE vs balanced. I know my GS-X only uses half it power SE from a discussion I had with @MacedonianHero a while back, but as mentioned, we weren't too sure if this applies to all. Thanks.

Like most things in life...it depends.

I prefer the HPA4 balanced with every headphone (except the Hedd Audio Heddphones) balanced FWIW.

 

[jlbrach]

is the hpa4 double the power in balanced mode?

 

[F208Frank]

I do not believe so, but can not say for sure. I vaguely remember asking Benchmark team and I remembered answer to be "no."

Also Benchmark general thought is to "use balanced when possible" with all their components.

I'm not the most technical guy, but I go by manufacturer word and my own trial and error and though I feel XLR delivers more power than single ended on the HPA4, it is not double.