[H20Fidelity]

 
Very nice!  And what headphones are you driving from that?

 
 
For this setup, I use 100ohm Etymotic ER4S. 

 

[goodyfresh]

   
 
For this setup, I use 100ohm Etymotic ER4S. 

Ooooh nice, Etymotic's reference-class IEM's!  How do they sound with that setup?

 

[H20Fidelity]

 
Ooooh nice, Etymotic's reference-class IEM's!  How do they sound with that setup?

 
X3II line out is quite capable, I've always believed this using portable amps or desktop amps. I actually prefer the line out over Pono Player line out fed to the Matrix M-Stage amp. Keep in mind its with this desktop amp in particular.

 

[jamesg11]

That's the thign.  We didn't evne have to try downsampling.  Since he had identically mastered, but CD-Quality rather than Hi-Res (i.e. ripped from CD) copies of some of those same songs, and those never made the dog flip-out   Hahahahaha.  So it really was ultrasonic frequencies.  Which is kind of hilarious.


But is it actually audible?  Every test ever done in actual controlled settings (meaning, of course, blind testing) has indicated that no, it is not, in fact, EVER audible.  In fact, 99.99% (if not 100%) of the time, the difference between 320kbs MP3 and Hi-Res FLAC isnt' audible, either.  Some of the most hardcore audiophiles in the world who claim time and again that they can TOTALLY tell the difference, have been tested under double-blind conditions and found to be completely unable to consistently identify high-quality Mp3 vs. Hi-Res FLAC or WAV versions of the same exact well-mastered version of a track.  Some of these tests have included folks who are able to pass tests similar to the Golden Ear Challenge, and even THEY can't consistently identify which version of a track is 320kbs MP3 and which version is Hi-Res Lossless.


I hereby challenge you to tell me any valid reason why "sonic superiority" makes any difference whatsoever when the differences involved are not actually audible to human ears/brains.

If you research the subject more, you'll find that the reason for higher sample rates is to have extra "room" within the recording for various audio processing methods and effects within the studio, not for anything actually audible.

Can you point us to this research re the "hardcore audiophiles"? I'm sceptical ... the only double-blind test I've seen referred to a bunch of years back copped a storm of criticism as to test methadology, etc ... as you'd expect, as always, etc. But, my understanding is that there's hardly been any 'scientific' testing of this sort.

 

[x RELIC x]

I thought this was an interesting read though : http://www.trustmeimascientist.com/2013/02/04/the-science-of-sample-rates-when-higher-is-better-and-when-it-isnt/

Thanks for posting this Paul. Very good read.

 

[oxyarts]

Hi Guys,
 
I have been listening my music from my Sansa Clip+ for around 3 years maybe. And now I am planing to upgrade my DAP to this Fiio X3II.
 
Can you give me some comparison between these two player? Will I hear a Significant Improvement of Sound Quality from Clip+ to X3?
 
Thank you in advance.
Oxy

 

[oldschool]

  Hi Guys,
 
I have been listening my music from my Sansa Clip+ for around 3 years maybe. And now I am planing to upgrade my DAP to this Fiio X3II.
 
Can you give me some comparison between these two player? Will I hear a Significant Improvement of Sound Quality from Clip+ to X3?
 
Thank you in advance.
Oxy

 
I moved from a Rockboxed Clip Zip + Fiio E6 combo to the X3ii. My initial impressions were not great - the X3ii sounded mellower, less punchy and less dynamic to me, as compared to the Zip + E6. At the same time, it was warmer and fuller.
 
With time, I've grown accustomed to the sound. Technically, the X3ii is much better and transparent. The high end in particular, cymbals and such, are much more defined on the Fiio DAP. I guess if I was to listen to the Zip again now, I would hate the sound.

 

[a1411832]

  If you want a better screen, et the X5ii which costs almost twice as much, or get a Sony Walkman Hi-Res or Astell and Kern player or something.

 
I too have faced this and when i wrote to FIIO and asked if X52ndgen is better in this regard, and their answer was 'No'.
 
Has anyone personally compared side by side? Please? I have my return window closing in 10 days.

 

[JaZZ]

But is it actually audible?  Every test ever done in actual controlled settings (meaning, of course, blind testing) has indicated that no, it is not, in fact, EVER audible.  In fact, 99.99% (if not 100%) of the time, the difference between 320kbs MP3 and Hi-Res FLAC isnt' audible, either.  Some of the most hardcore audiophiles in the world who claim time and again that they can TOTALLY tell the difference, have been tested under double-blind conditions and found to be completely unable to consistently identify high-quality Mp3 vs. Hi-Res FLAC or WAV versions of the same exact well-mastered version of a track.  Some of these tests have included folks who are able to pass tests similar to the Golden Ear Challenge, and even THEY can't consistently identify which version of a track is 320kbs MP3 and which version is Hi-Res Lossless.

I hereby challenge you to tell me any valid reason why "sonic superiority" makes any difference whatsoever when the differences involved are not actually audible to human ears/brains.

If you research the subject more, you'll find that the reason for higher sample rates is to have extra "room" within the recording for various audio processing methods and effects within the studio, not for anything actually audible.

 
I don't do blind tests (have just done it once with a headphone-cable comparison and scored passably well – 9/12). Moreover we don't discuss blind tests in this forum, and the rule exists for a reason.
 
I perceive a difference in favor of hi-res in most cases (more accurate and natural) – this is also the case with the DVD-As that come with a separate CD. It isn't always the case with hybrid SACDs – with those derived from a normal PCM recording the DSD layer usually sounds worse than the redbook layer.
 
However, equalizing is of higher value than hi-res quality for me when it comes to the sonic benefit, that's why 48 kHz is the highest sampling rate I use on my FiiO players. It's not really a bad thing, since that way they accomodate much more music.

 

[Headphone4Life]

I've always been one to say you can't tell the difference between 320 mp3 and flac until I started to really listen to a lot more flac files. Now some of them don't sound any different but there are some that I can totally tell the difference. I don't know why that is other than having something to do with the recording but you can hear a clear difference in some cases.

 

[bruce1967]

  I've always been one to say you can't tell the difference between 320 mp3 and flac until I started to really listen to a lot more flac files. Now some of them don't sound any different but there are some that I can totally tell the difference. I don't know why that is other than having something to do with the recording but you can hear a clear difference in some cases.

I've noticed the same thing. I always thought I couldn't hear the difference but like you I can for some recordings but not for others. I have Jackson Browne's Running On Empty in hi res and the difference between the itunes copy and the one I purchased from HD tracks is huge. Could also be the way it's mastered.

 

[originalsnuffy]

If the original x3 had a less colored sound signature it would be a highly desired item as it has hardware eq.

I really hope that the next x3 brings back that feature. And a display that can be seen in daylight.

 

[goodyfresh]

 
I've noticed the same thing. I always thought I couldn't hear the difference but like you I can for some recordings but not for others. I have Jackson Browne's Running On Empty in hi res and the difference between the itunes copy and the one I purchased from HD tracks is huge. Could also be the way it's mastered.

There does seem to be a consensus among many audiophiles that when one does hear such differences, they are due to the fact that the Mp3 files and the FLAC files are simply different MASTERS, as you said.

Here's the thing.  I've been doing a whole lot of A-B testing with this exact issue lately.  I've taken a whole bunch of my lossless FLAC (all at least 16/44.1, many much higher) files on my computer, and used dbPoweramp to convert them to 320kbs Mp3 files in separate folders, then done A-B testing between the FLAC and Mp3 versions.  No matter the genre, track, artist, whatever, I have yet to be able to hear any difference between the FLACs and the Mp3s.

Keep in mind that iTunes and HD Tracks do almost always tend to use different masters!

However, it's also entirely possible that my headphones are simply not resolving enough to make differences between the Mp3's and FLACs become audible!  Perhaps if I had a pair of Abyss or STAX SR-009, I'd be able to hear differences.  So I'm still up in the air on the issue of Mp3 vs. FLAC, and POSSIBLY on the issue of Hi-Res vs. 48Khz sample-rates, as well.  It remains to be seen whether my views will change as I continue to upgrade to better equipment.
 

If the original x3 had a less colored sound signature it would be a highly desired item as it has hardware eq.

I really hope that the next x3 brings back that feature. And a display that can be seen in daylight.

Oh my gosh yes, I so, so WISH we had a hardware analog bass-boost!  That would be a real nice feature

 

[bruce1967]

If the original x3 had a less colored sound signature it would be a highly desired item as it has hardware eq.

I really hope that the next x3 brings back that feature. And a display that can be seen in daylight.

I agree. I miss the hardware bass & treble. I wouldn't mind if they dropped the scroll wheel in favor or buttons again too but the form factor and build are just fine.

 

[goodyfresh]

Just wanted to let everyone know that I have edited an earlier post of mine by deleting the vast majority of what was in the post:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/743704/the-fiio-x3-2nd-gen-ex-x3k-x3ii-thread-192k-24b-cs4398-native-dsd-usb-dac-with-lo-and-inline-remote/5415#post_11860804

I realize now that the post, as it originally stood, basically amounted to baiting and an invitation to start a flame-war, and that I should not have done that.  I apologize if it seemed like I was antagonizing anyone.  As an owner of the device in the title-line of this thread, my main purpose in this thread should be to discuss the device in-question, not to try to spark debates which belong over in the Sound Science or Computer Audio forums.

However, I did not delete the cute meme of the doggy with glasses, since that part of the post was indisputably awesome

 
Anyway, to get back on-topic:  Yes, I'd prefer buttons over a scroll-wheel.  But, it's not that big a deal to me.