ExtraNice
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In other words, they think it costs more than the declared price and want to tax you more?
The Audio-gd Compass (Was: Designing an alternative to the Zero DAC/amp)
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Olev
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Yeah, little countries have the staff to go thru most of goods declared as $50 and ask the importer for real market value, nice to see Estonia not being the only EU country with unbelievable bureaucracy when importing stuff
I've been to all sorts of trouble with value but this CE marking thing is new.
squall343
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From what i see, not many china audio products have those CE stickers
since they normally do not go through the certification process which cost extra money
| Originally Posted by Olev /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is usual for customs in Estonia too. I have had to show PayPal invoices many times. But now I have even bigger troubles - the customs have not even got to the price point, because the Compass has no CE sticker they say it is not allowed to be imported to the European Union. |
From what i see, not many china audio products have those CE stickers
since they normally do not go through the certification process which cost extra money
Drosera
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Seems rather pointless too. I'm willing to bet that most manufacturers just put that CE marking on there, without bothering at all with anything like the "declaration of conformity" that's required.
| Originally Posted by Olev /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, little countries have the staff to go thru most of goods declared as $50 and ask the importer for real market value, nice to see Estonia not being the only EU country with unbelievable bureaucracy when importing stuff
|
Seems rather pointless too. I'm willing to bet that most manufacturers just put that CE marking on there, without bothering at all with anything like the "declaration of conformity" that's required.
Olev
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Basically their argument was that it has no CE marking, I doubt they check some conformity lists. Because it has no CE sticker it stands out in the crowd automatically. That's why I suggested a few post before that Kingwa should just put the stickers on, in my case it probably would have helped.
| Originally Posted by Drosera /img/forum/go_quote.gif Seems rather pointless too. I'm willing to bet that most manufacturers just put that CE marking on there, without bothering at all with anything like the "declaration of conformity" that's required. |
Basically their argument was that it has no CE marking, I doubt they check some conformity lists. Because it has no CE sticker it stands out in the crowd automatically. That's why I suggested a few post before that Kingwa should just put the stickers on, in my case it probably would have helped.
Muji
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You could claim that you payed with Western Union and didn't save the reciept. Worked for me with the swedish customs.
| Originally Posted by Zhirc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, my Compass finally arrived last week via EMS... to the Finnish customs. Got yesterday note of arrrival -letter and they're requesting invoice, clearance of the contents and ID. I sent yesterday them via e-mail and got today message (translated roughly from Finnish) "Hi. Unfortunately customs doesn't trust to the Chinese invoices. Do you have some else like pay pal or bank statement etc." Argh. Wouldn't really need ~107€ price up for it... |
You could claim that you payed with Western Union and didn't save the reciept. Worked for me with the swedish customs.
Drosera
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Yeah, it sounds sensible. He could even only put those stickers on the equipment that is destined for countries known to make a fuss about this. Have you asked Kingwa how he thinks about it?
| Originally Posted by Olev /img/forum/go_quote.gif Basically their argument was that it has no CE marking, I doubt they check some conformity lists. Because it has no CE sticker it stands out in the crowd automatically. That's why I suggested a few post before that Kingwa should just put the stickers on, in my case it probably would have helped. |
Yeah, it sounds sensible. He could even only put those stickers on the equipment that is destined for countries known to make a fuss about this. Have you asked Kingwa how he thinks about it?
sandchak
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Yes it does sound sensible Dro, but here is the story.. few years ago Kingwa heard he could get the CE certification for between USD10K- 15K, and in any case he does not think he can get the CE license for Compass, btw last month a Compass was shipped to Estonia and the buyer got it without any fuss from the customs..
Well I hope you understand by Kingwa's language that he isnt willing to just put stickers ( nothing that I did not expect)..
| Originally Posted by Drosera /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, it sounds sensible. He could even only put those stickers on the equipment that is destined for countries known to make a fuss about this. Have you asked Kingwa how he thinks about it? |
Yes it does sound sensible Dro, but here is the story.. few years ago Kingwa heard he could get the CE certification for between USD10K- 15K, and in any case he does not think he can get the CE license for Compass, btw last month a Compass was shipped to Estonia and the buyer got it without any fuss from the customs..
Well I hope you understand by Kingwa's language that he isnt willing to just put stickers ( nothing that I did not expect)..
Olev
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From what I heard that guys unit is still being held by customs. I don't know the guy, only saw that he was shipped a Compass a week earlier than me. Is he even a member here? I talked to the Technical Surveillance Authority yesterday and they told me they are currently holding 2 Compasses.
| Originally Posted by sandchak /img/forum/go_quote.gif btw last month a Compass was shipped to Estonia and the buyer got it without any fuss from the customs... |
From what I heard that guys unit is still being held by customs. I don't know the guy, only saw that he was shipped a Compass a week earlier than me. Is he even a member here? I talked to the Technical Surveillance Authority yesterday and they told me they are currently holding 2 Compasses.
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They are not likely to hassle you about a missing CE mark, though.
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They've seen too many bogus Chinese invoices to believe everything. The last thing I received from China came with a fake invoice, even though I asked the sender to declare correct value.
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Is the customs fraud worth it?
| Originally Posted by Zhirc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, my Compass finally arrived last week via EMS... to the Finnish customs. |
They are not likely to hassle you about a missing CE mark, though.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by Zhirc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Got yesterday note of arrrival -letter and they're requesting invoice, clearance of the contents and ID. I sent yesterday them via e-mail and got today message (translated roughly from Finnish) "Hi. Unfortunately customs doesn't trust to the Chinese invoices. Do you have some else like pay pal or bank statement etc." |
They've seen too many bogus Chinese invoices to believe everything. The last thing I received from China came with a fake invoice, even though I asked the sender to declare correct value.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by Zhirc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Argh. Wouldn't really need ~107€ price up for it... |
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| Originally Posted by Muji /img/forum/go_quote.gif You could claim that you payed with Western Union and didn't save the reciept. Worked for me with the swedish customs. |
Is the customs fraud worth it?
Drosera
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I understand, but I sure hope this situation is not going to spread. Kingwa might lose most of Europe as a potential customer base then. Okay, I know, doom-and-gloom scenario, but still...
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I agree, be careful with what you tell customs. Not being honest might end up 'hurting more' than simply paying the taxes would.
| Originally Posted by sandchak /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes it does sound sensible Dro, but here is the story.. few years ago Kingwa heard he could get the CE certification for between USD10K- 15K, and in any case he does not think he can get the CE license for Compass, btw last month a Compass was shipped to Estonia and the buyer got it without any fuss from the customs.. Well I hope you understand by Kingwa's language that he isnt willing to just put stickers ( nothing that I did not expect).. |
I understand, but I sure hope this situation is not going to spread. Kingwa might lose most of Europe as a potential customer base then. Okay, I know, doom-and-gloom scenario, but still...
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| Originally Posted by Oskari /img/forum/go_quote.gif Is the customs fraud worth it? |
I agree, be careful with what you tell customs. Not being honest might end up 'hurting more' than simply paying the taxes would.
sandchak
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I agree with both points you have mentioned.
1) I think at the moment it seems like a rare case to Kingwa, because he has shipped quite a lot (not talking about Compass) previously to Europe itself and hasn't faced such a problem, I guess as a business man he will weigh in the pros and cons before he decides, but one thing for sure, I don't think he will fake the stickers as many Chinese manufacturers do.
2) Yes again, its better to come clean with these guys..
| Originally Posted by Drosera /img/forum/go_quote.gif I understand, but I sure hope this situation is not going to spread. Kingwa might lose most of Europe as a potential customer base then. Okay, I know, doom-and-gloom scenario, but still... I agree, be careful with what you tell customs. Not being honest might end up 'hurting more' than simply paying the taxes would. |
I agree with both points you have mentioned.
1) I think at the moment it seems like a rare case to Kingwa, because he has shipped quite a lot (not talking about Compass) previously to Europe itself and hasn't faced such a problem, I guess as a business man he will weigh in the pros and cons before he decides, but one thing for sure, I don't think he will fake the stickers as many Chinese manufacturers do.
2) Yes again, its better to come clean with these guys..
squall343
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imagine how many compass he would have need to sell in order to recoup back the 10-15k
but this CE stuff does not happen to all European countries..do they?
| Originally Posted by sandchak /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes it does sound sensible Dro, but here is the story.. few years ago Kingwa heard he could get the CE certification for between USD10K- 15K, and in any case he does not think he can get the CE license for Compass, btw last month a Compass was shipped to Estonia and the buyer got it without any fuss from the customs.. Well I hope you understand by Kingwa's language that he isnt willing to just put stickers ( nothing that I did not expect).. |
imagine how many compass he would have need to sell in order to recoup back the 10-15k
but this CE stuff does not happen to all European countries..do they?
Olev
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Well technically the CE law is the same in the whole European Union. Seems that Estonia is very eager to enforce it and is the first one to do so for Compass. But in the future who knows, when the bigger EU countries start enforcing the same law ....
| Originally Posted by squall343 /img/forum/go_quote.gif but this CE stuff does not happen to all European countries..do they? |
Well technically the CE law is the same in the whole European Union. Seems that Estonia is very eager to enforce it and is the first one to do so for Compass. But in the future who knows, when the bigger EU countries start enforcing the same law ....
Drosera
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Probably restricted to those countries belonging to the European Union. (Possibly including candidate members as well.)
But I think Olev was right when he said that now it will mainly happen in countries where the customs people have the time and the workforce to pay attention to these details. However, I could well imagine that the EU government will decide at some point in the future that this CE business is actually really important (probably actually as a means to curb imports from China and protect the European market). We'll have to see how it develops.
| Originally Posted by squall343 /img/forum/go_quote.gif but this CE stuff does not happen to all European countries..do they? |
Probably restricted to those countries belonging to the European Union. (Possibly including candidate members as well.)
But I think Olev was right when he said that now it will mainly happen in countries where the customs people have the time and the workforce to pay attention to these details. However, I could well imagine that the EU government will decide at some point in the future that this CE business is actually really important (probably actually as a means to curb imports from China and protect the European market). We'll have to see how it develops.
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