Sony Z1R....listening impressions only
Feb 23, 2024 at 10:47 PM Post #9,466 of 9,635
I really appreciate your reply, let me word it a little better this time. I guess...
My nwzx507 sounds better without the eqaulizer being anything other than flat really using my MDR-Z1R. I also swapped the pads to memory foam dekoni's.
I was using autoeq settings for my headphones plugged as best as possible into my sony digital audio player. I have a ten band 0.5 increment adjustment.

What I'm curious though is how you would approach from a base line and asjust knowing these common problems of these headphones I guess is where I'd like to be able to eq from. Though this is just my thought and maybe it would be best to start with autoeq's settings.

Also, kind of a big one but is there much of a following in this community against using eq? I think I saw that somewhere on this forum sometime ago. Almost like your adjusting against it's naturalness to make sound it doesn't work as well, but idk I'm just wondering where people do stand on that out of curioisty as I'm still trying to learn eq and am just wondering what there points might of been.
Using autoEQ filters on a 10-band EQ is not advised, because the autoEQ filters have settings to adjust how wide or narrow each filter is, which is not possible using a standard 10-band EQ like the one on the Walkman. So by trying to use the autoEQ settings, you're probably messing up the sound even more.

I think that's the main issue with EQ. There are lots of ways to mess up the sound, and not that many ways to make the sound better. And a lot of ways that seem to be "better" are really just different rather than strictly better, because you probably gave up something else to achieve those gains. It helps to have a baseline, like autoEQ tries to make each headphone match the Harman Target Curve, which is a decent baseline for neutral-ish sound. But if you aren't aiming for Harman, then EQing by graph is quite hard, because deviations from Harman can interact in unintuitive or unpredictable ways, so it's difficult to tell if any one change will be better or worse unless you understand how that change can combine with other changes in different parts of the spectrum. The other thing you can do is tune by ear, like I can hear the 3K peak, the 10K peak, the dip between them, and a weird notch just below 3K when I do a sine sweep, so I know that those are areas that I can work on with EQ. But the issue with sine sweeps is that some parts are supposed to be louder than others due to interactions between the headphone and your outer ear and your brain's perception of loudness at different frequencies, so you can't just hammer everything down to equal loudness in a sine sweep, because that would also be messing up the sound.

As for attitudes towards EQ, there are several hundred regular users, possibly thousands, on Head-Fi. People here are going to run the gamut from the "EQ will fix everything" crowd to the "never EQ" crowd. In general, there are more non-EQers here than on Reddit for example. Personally, I used to be more into heavy EQing. In the past year, I've basically stopped using it for the most part. I don't dislike it, and I usually EQ headphones that I have at least at first to get an understanding of its sound, but I find that EQ rarely improves things holistically. It gives you better X, but does so by reducing quality Y. Like the lower treble EQ that fills in the large dip there on the Z1R diminishes its spatial qualities. Plus, parametric EQ that allows you to correct for headphone issues is mostly limited to PC setups, and more people on this forum use streamers or other gear that doesn't allow for that level of EQ.
 
Feb 24, 2024 at 10:56 AM Post #9,467 of 9,635
I really appreciate your reply, let me word it a little better this time. I guess...
My nwzx507 sounds better without the eqaulizer being anything other than flat really using my MDR-Z1R. I also swapped the pads to memory foam dekoni's.
I was using autoeq settings for my headphones plugged as best as possible into my sony digital audio player. I have a ten band 0.5 increment adjustment.

What I'm curious though is how you would approach from a base line and asjust knowing these common problems of these headphones I guess is where I'd like to be able to eq from. Though this is just my thought and maybe it would be best to start with autoeq's settings.

Also, kind of a big one but is there much of a following in this community against using eq? I think I saw that somewhere on this forum sometime ago. Almost like your adjusting against it's naturalness to make sound it doesn't work as well, but idk I'm just wondering where people do stand on that out of curioisty as I'm still trying to learn eq and am just wondering what there points might of been.
The first thing you should do is replace the stock cable with an OCC or oxygen free copper cable. The stock cable is silver plated and makes the high end harsh and sucks out the mid-range.
 
Feb 24, 2024 at 5:18 PM Post #9,468 of 9,635
Using autoEQ filters on a 10-band EQ is not advised, because the autoEQ filters have settings to adjust how wide or narrow each filter is, which is not possible using a standard 10-band EQ like the one on the Walkman. So by trying to use the autoEQ settings, you're probably messing up the sound even more.

I think that's the main issue with EQ. There are lots of ways to mess up the sound, and not that many ways to make the sound better. And a lot of ways that seem to be "better" are really just different rather than strictly better, because you probably gave up something else to achieve those gains. It helps to have a baseline, like autoEQ tries to make each headphone match the Harman Target Curve, which is a decent baseline for neutral-ish sound. But if you aren't aiming for Harman, then EQing by graph is quite hard, because deviations from Harman can interact in unintuitive or unpredictable ways, so it's difficult to tell if any one change will be better or worse unless you understand how that change can combine with other changes in different parts of the spectrum. The other thing you can do is tune by ear, like I can hear the 3K peak, the 10K peak, the dip between them, and a weird notch just below 3K when I do a sine sweep, so I know that those are areas that I can work on with EQ. But the issue with sine sweeps is that some parts are supposed to be louder than others due to interactions between the headphone and your outer ear and your brain's perception of loudness at different frequencies, so you can't just hammer everything down to equal loudness in a sine sweep, because that would also be messing up the sound.

As for attitudes towards EQ, there are several hundred regular users, possibly thousands, on Head-Fi. People here are going to run the gamut from the "EQ will fix everything" crowd to the "never EQ" crowd. In general, there are more non-EQers here than on Reddit for example. Personally, I used to be more into heavy EQing. In the past year, I've basically stopped using it for the most part. I don't dislike it, and I usually EQ headphones that I have at least at first to get an understanding of its sound, but I find that EQ rarely improves things holistically. It gives you better X, but does so by reducing quality Y. Like the lower treble EQ that fills in the large dip there on the Z1R diminishes its spatial qualities. Plus, parametric EQ that allows you to correct for headphone issues is mostly limited to PC setups, and more people on this forum use streamers or other gear that doesn't allow for that level of EQ.
What is usually lost when you eq up a little
The first thing you should do is replace the stock cable with an OCC or oxygen free copper cable. The stock cable is silver plated and makes the high end harsh and sucks out the mid-range.
You won’t believe this, but I did upgrade the cable and I think it’s a better cable. It is a cheapo cable though. China’s finest eBay select your length / colour.

It actually does sound better than stock though which makes no sense.
 
Feb 24, 2024 at 7:11 PM Post #9,469 of 9,635
What is usually lost when you eq up a little

You won’t believe this, but I did upgrade the cable and I think it’s a better cable. It is a cheapo cable though. China’s finest eBay select your length / colour.

It actually does sound better than stock though which makes no sense.
These headphone deserve a quality cable to deliver what they are capable of.
 
Feb 25, 2024 at 3:20 PM Post #9,473 of 9,635
And this cable made them sound best your head them before?
Nope never heard them or read anything about them, I needed a longer cable so emailed Trevor Goldman of Norne Audio, he gave many suggestions all cheaper, but I thought this is a once in a lifetime purchase ( full money back guarantee if not happy). The guy is a sole trader/manufacturer, you have to wait a while as everything is hand built by himself. You get looked after very well. There is a Norne thread on here. @TigzStudio
 
Feb 26, 2024 at 3:22 PM Post #9,474 of 9,635
Just joined the club, was looking for a companion to my Empys. First impression: holy mother of bass! Immediately put on some old school rap cuz these headphones deserve them.

Question: Any suggestion for a compact enough hard shell carrying case? I was planning to keep them at work but now I want them at home too :dt880smile:
 
Feb 26, 2024 at 4:16 PM Post #9,475 of 9,635
Just joined the club, was looking for a companion to my Empys. First impression: holy mother of bass! Immediately put on some old school rap cuz these headphones deserve them.

Question: Any suggestion for a compact enough hard shell carrying case? I was planning to keep them at work but now I want them at home too :dt880smile:
Geekira
 
Feb 27, 2024 at 6:16 AM Post #9,477 of 9,635
I think tha peter srom DHC works very dirty. I cannot believe that's for the price so at dirty job, I use my Z1R cable with my DHC utopia adapter and right now is myZ1R with a bad crackling problem on the left side, the signs of oxidation. Vut thanks caig deoxit fixed the issue
 
Feb 27, 2024 at 10:00 AM Post #9,478 of 9,635
I think tha peter srom DHC works very dirty. I cannot believe that's for the price so at dirty job, I use my Z1R cable with my DHC utopia adapter and right now is myZ1R with a bad crackling problem on the left side, the signs of oxidation. Vut thanks caig deoxit fixed the issue
Are you sure it's not your environment? I've never had a problem with any of the 7 cables I've bought from him.
 
Feb 27, 2024 at 12:34 PM Post #9,479 of 9,635
Are you sure it's not your environment? I've never had a problem with any of the 7 cables I've bought from him.
Mayne i need to treat the adapters as well with deoxit to keep them a cleanup
 
Feb 29, 2024 at 5:52 PM Post #9,480 of 9,635
Would a cable designed for a Hifiman headphone (with the 3mm headphone cup attachments) fit and work on the MDR Z1R? Thank you.

EDIT: sorry, I meant to say 3.5mm, not 3mm.
 
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