[snapandslide]

FWIW I agree. The WF-XM4 are so good wrt ANC so I decided to sell my WH-XM3. Of course it depends on the seal you can obtain. I have come back to my comply foams true grip, they are superb for isolation, whereas the CP360 are better for SQ.

The cp360 ain’t bad for isolation - certainly better than the spiral dots which were useless in that regards. I’ve decided the cp360s are the best compromise.

 

[Devodonaldson]

This morning did a comparison between Galaxy Buds Pro, Sony wf-xm4, and Noble Falcon Pro. Falcon Pro has most treble extension, and xm4 had the warmest overall presentation. The Buds pro hold up well overall. If what you are looking for is to hear as much treble sparkle as possible, the Falcon Pro are good for that, and the mid bass punch is good. HOWEVER, listening back to back, the xm4 gives the most emotional presentation by far. Listening to the same tracks the xm4 brings you into the music on an emotional level,, where the Falcon Pro feels more clinical. Very happy with my xm4, but now feel like I have a $320 workout iem, at best with the Falcon Pro.

 

[neil74]

There has been a lot written about how people don’t like that they have to go into developer settings each time to set LDAC to highest bit rate from adaptive. I used to also be annoyed by this but now I realize that helps keep a more stable connection. If the connection can be kept at high bit rate the player and earphones will keep the connection speed up. But if there are transmission losses it will compensate. I wonder if some of the problems folks are having is due to forcing the higher bit rate…? Anyway, even with the setting at adaptive I am getting some cutouts, but I also have the same issue with other earphones, and not just with LDAC codec but also aptX, so I suspect that my ancient LG v30 is more to blame than the TWS sets…

I honestly think LDAC is snake oil, you never know without the manual develop options fun to change to 990 mode you never know what you it getting as it scales, I am not even convinced that chosing the 660 or 990 option over best effort is fixed or not either?

Personally I think APTX-HD is the best current codec but YMMV

 

[dmac6419]

I honestly think LDAC is snake oil, you never know without the manual develop options fun to change to 990 mode you never know what you it getting as it scales, I am not even convinced that chosing the 660 or 990 option over best effort is fixed or not either?

Personally I think APTX-HD is the best current codec but YMMV

You're not gonna get 990 stable,just ain't gonna happen set it(adaptive) and forget it,why over complicate it.

 

[clerkpalmer]

I honestly think LDAC is snake oil, you never know without the manual develop options fun to change to 990 mode you never know what you it getting as it scales, I am not even convinced that chosing the 660 or 990 option over best effort is fixed or not either?

Personally I think APTX-HD is the best current codec but YMMV

Barring any major faults in the system, I don’t think anyone could tell the difference between AptxHD and LDAC in any event.

 

[neil74]

You're not gonna get 990 stable,just ain't gonna happen set it(adaptive) and forget it,why over complicate it.

Exactly and on best effort you are likely getting sub 660. The fact that 990 does not work well points to it's limitations, having said that though I did use it on a Huawei P30 and P40 pro and it was rock solid

Barring any major faults in the system, I don’t think anyone could tell the difference between AptxHD and LDAC in any event.

Agreed, the next standard (that will likely be wifi based rather than BT) will be where we start to see meaningful differences.

 

[clerkpalmer]

Exactly and on best effort you are likely getting sub 660. The fact that 990 does not work well points to it's limitations, having said that though I did use it on a Huawei P30 and P40 pro and it was rock solid

Agreed, the next standard (that will likely be wifi based rather than BT) will be where we start to see meaningful differences.

For this purpose, WiFi based would be perfectly fine. I’d take it if it got me to wired levels of sq.

 

[emilsoft]

* WF1000XM4 out of an iPhone 11 sound like trash - treble is dirty and sound is murky/messy, it's a tiring listen.
* Out of a Sony ZX507 LDAC sound quite good, but there still a touch of congestion and slight dirt in the treble if I listen for it. It can't be mistaken for a good wired IEM.
* Out of a Fiio M11 Plus they sound exceptional - essentially a different IEM; clean, wide, smooth and resolving, without any treble artefacts at all. I've never imagined bluetooth can be a replacement for proper wired sound, but there you go.. I'm assuming it's not just high bitrate LDAC, but also good clean re-clocked signal (the m11 plus has very good clocks). Just so you have baseline, I'm just as happy picking the XM4 instead of my Sony IERM7 or JVC FDX1 for an enjoyable listening session.

WF1000xm4 has the ability to scale massively with good sources.. most will never hear what it can do on an iPhone or Android phones

 

[clerkpalmer]

* WF1000XM4 out of an iPhone 11 sound like trash - treble is dirty and sound is murky/messy, it's a tiring listen.
* Out of a Sony ZX507 LDAC sound quite good, but there still a touch of congestion and slight dirt in the treble if I listen for it. It can't be mistaken for a good wired IEM.
* Out of a Fiio M11 Plus they sound exceptional - essentially a different IEM; clean, wide, smooth and resolving, without any treble artefacts at all. I've never imagined bluetooth can be a replacement for proper wired sound, but there you go.. I'm assuming it's not just high bitrate LDAC, but also good clean re-clocked signal (the m11 plus has very good clocks). Just so you have baseline, I'm just as happy picking the XM4 instead of my Sony IERM7 or JVC FDX1 for an enjoyable listening session.

WF1000xm4 has the ability to scale massively with good sources.. most will never hear what it can do on an iPhone or Android phones

While I don’t doubt what you are hearing, I am really struggling to understand how this is possible. There should not be that much variance in a bluetooth signal. The hardware is in the buds themselves. Can you explain what you mean by clocks and how it could result in a cleaner Bluetooth signal that you can actually tell? I’ve been using Bluetooth devices since the beginning and I’ve never heard that differences in the audio transmission source could make a meaningful difference in audio quality. Genuinely interested. The vast majority of the work occurs in the headphones.

 

[emilsoft]

While I don’t doubt what you are hearing, I am really struggling to understand how this is possible. There should not be that much variance in a bluetooth signal. The hardware is in the buds themselves. Can you explain what you mean by clocks and how it could result in a cleaner Bluetooth signal that you can actually tell? I’ve been using Bluetooth devices since the beginning and I’ve never heard that differences in the audio transmission source could make a meaningful difference in audio quality. Genuinely interested. The vast majority of the work occurs in the headphones.

I think it's similar to using a good USB to SPDIF converter (like the ifi iusb micro), or a good cd transport feeding a dac - they reclock the signal which helps the DAC do it's job better - don't ask my about the details exactly, all I can say I've heard it works with bunch of sources fairly obviously to my ears. The Wf1000xm4 probably doesn't reclock or if it does it's system obvious isn't as sophisticated considering the constraints.

 

[SilverEars]

* WF1000XM4 out of an iPhone 11 sound like trash - treble is dirty and sound is murky/messy, it's a tiring listen.

It just sounds like that. Some codec or LDAC is not going to miraculously fix it.

 

[howdy]

It just sounds like that. Some codec or LDAC is not going to miraculously fix it.

I think your ears are ruined, these sound great not sure what wrong. Everyone had there own opinion and I do respect that but these are good. To say they are trash I just don't understand what you are thinking!!

 

[clerkpalmer]

It just sounds like that. Some codec or LDAC is not going to miraculously fix it.

This wasn’t the OPs point. He said they sound excellent from the right source.

 

[DigDub]

I also do find different source has slightly different sound reproduction from the same tws buds and song. My Samsung s21u sounds a tad warmer while a Sony Xperia 5ii sounds brighter. I believe phone manufacturers add their own EQ software which colours the sound a bit even when the EQ is flat. So the sound is not a direct output, it goes through some shaping from the phone's EQ software before being transmitted to the buds.

 

[nc8000]

* WF1000XM4 out of an iPhone 11 sound like trash - treble is dirty and sound is murky/messy, it's a tiring listen.
* Out of a Sony ZX507 LDAC sound quite good, but there still a touch of congestion and slight dirt in the treble if I listen for it. It can't be mistaken for a good wired IEM.
* Out of a Fiio M11 Plus they sound exceptional - essentially a different IEM; clean, wide, smooth and resolving, without any treble artefacts at all. I've never imagined bluetooth can be a replacement for proper wired sound, but there you go.. I'm assuming it's not just high bitrate LDAC, but also good clean re-clocked signal (the m11 plus has very good clocks). Just so you have baseline, I'm just as happy picking the XM4 instead of my Sony IERM7 or JVC FDX1 for an enjoyable listening session.

WF1000xm4 has the ability to scale massively with good sources.. most will never hear what it can do on an iPhone or Android phones

To me they certainly don’t sound like trash from my iPhone11 Pro, I’m perfectly happy with them for many hours during commuting, but they do sound better over ldac from the Sony A55