[purk]

Can you kindly explain what’s the meaning of the sound being off? Does it not sound like the cd3000 anymore?

While the CD3000 has too much treble, the Z1R has too much bass output making it way too much for some musical genres...YMMV. Both phones have big soundstage for closed type headphones, but the CD3000 still has slightly larger soundstage compared to the Z1R.

 

[elton7033]

Portable showdown on my visit to Jaben hong kong

 

[purk]

Do post your impression please!

 

[elton7033]

Do post your impression please!

Ok then. The launch of DMPZ1 from Sony for me was a shock, That is a must for me. because of my job nature I tend to travel a lot and don’t have much time to listen to a desk set up, although I have a 2 TOTL speaker and 3 Flagship headphone set up at home including 1 electrostatic system the kgsshv and the 009, but since I don’t have time may be only 3months a year I spend in my houses I tend to use my portable more.

Disclaimer: streaming is not a thing to me because I have a big library of hi res Japanese music and in most case due to data security purpose my office do not allow staff to have wifi access or plugging their device into computer (not even USB where USB port are all disabled)

In my situation the DMPZ1 was god send, a ture high end sound which I can take around the world with me, but after a few trip I find this heavy beast some how too heavy (2.5kg including headcase and charger) for hand carry.
So I start building a smaller platform from the design of the DMPZ1, H type frame where digital circuit and analog circuit must be separated, battery operated so clean power is not and issue, good wiring from internal, interconnection to headphone and an amp with enough power to drive planar, and last but not least a analog volume control.

The Sony DMPZ1 is absolutely gorgeous at noise isolation where the background is pitch black even can compare to my luxman d08 to P700u set up at home, however the major problem with that thing is it’s power. Where I have expect much more from it since even the Masskobo 404/424/428 amp does have better power and a much better design balance circuit which can do justice on my hd800/k1000/final d8000 and other planar where I have try......however for headphone somehow easy to drive like my R10, ATH L3000/L5000, Focal Utopia the DMPZ1 does almost everything right just not as good as the Dave that my friend own, however for something which you can bring with you on a business trip is more than you could ask for. The warm sound of the DMPZ1 does match the R10 really well I am not quite sure how this does but is a majical combo like the hugo2 with the Utopia. It’s even a better match than the MDRZ1R with the DMPZ1 (I don’t own Z1Rs)

So I have came up an idea early this month to spend another 1000000yen on building a portable system which I can listen not only stationary at hotel or office but also on the move like on train or airplane, since I believe on Sony quality I choose the WM1Z for transport since it have the best material OFC copper where Sony claim the circuit will ground on the case hence the background will be less noisy, however the WM1Z alone was even less power than the DMPZ1 and cannot drive any 2dynamic driver iem where I use on the go to its full potential then I turn my interest into the masskobo 404/424/428 these amp use AA battery so any single battery could keep on providing consistent 1.5V of power until the battery dies out ( I never use rechargeable battery because it only supply 1.2V of power and performance decrease when the battery discharges ) the masskobo are also famous of its clean clinical sound being very detail but no extra is add on to the sound of the source. The base sound of the WM1Z and the DMPZ1 is very similar, a warm musical tuning but not monitor sound(typical recent Sony tuning). Now the problem is interconnection, the DMPZ1 have Kimber cable from internal to headphones, however I am a cable guy where I can tell you that kimber cable use by Sony is one of the worst I seen from kimber cable and some People does rip off the Sonys kimber cable internally and rewire it with Nordest Valhalla.....so I choose to use first generation crystal cable since I believe on crystal cable idea on filling the gaps in between silver molecules on the higher grade silver core with gold to make the structure to be able to conduct better however the end result wasn’t that pleasing where a lot of noise picking up by the amp... this was then slice by adding a extra grounding cable to the combo and use a lot of furutech carbon plug where Japanese audio myth says carbon abort nosie and make the back ground darker. I am not a technical guy but when paying 1mil yen for a portable setup I beg every single audio myth are ture and should be deal with.

The showdown

The headphone/earphone to test
I bring the setup to Jaben hong kong to visit my friend there, for headphone I have with me my all time favorite bass light R10 crystal cable 2x 3pin XLR terminates (carbon shielding both on wire and connector) and then a 3pin XLR to 4.4 (still carbon) with my newly purchased Fitear Titan (same first generation crystal cable with furutech 4.4 carbon plugs) also Sony justear MH1 (crystal cable next terminated in 4.4 furutech carbon connector ) also (IERZ1R and MDRZ1R courtesy of Jaben)

For iems, specially easy to drive iems like my Sony MH1 i hear no differences on sound using the WM1Z + masskobo 424 or DMPZ1 the WM1Z on its own still very pleasing and I guess that’s good enough.
For the Fitear Titan and the new Sony IERZ1R with 2 dynamic driver and 1 BA the WM1Z lacks of power very much disappointed even with high gain, to unleash the full potential of this new generation 2DD iems I think using amps are the only way, again there is no which one is better on iem since the WM1Z with Masskobo or the DMPZ1 both be able to unleash everything they can do and it’s sounds surpior to many mid-entry high end big cans if you believe me or not.
The headphone is a triggy bit, the R10 warm sound happen to be a very good match to the DMPZ1, the warm sound is perfect for R10 and is very detail from low to high with the background being pitch black and response are good as well, for the MDRZ1R is somewhat disappointing the bass is too much with the DMPZ1 and the mids are muffs I rather it be plug in to the TAZH1ES where even the TAZH1ES sounds less muff than the DMPZ1. The R10 on the WM1Z +masskobo sounds much brighter then the DMPZ1 maybe because of the first generation crystal cable interconnection tend to be a brighter cable, detail is roughly the same but the masskobo have just tons more power than the DMPZ1 and have more punch afterall the masskobo is design to drive the aybss phi in mind. However sepation, positioning is better and background is darker on the DMPZ1.

Audio gear to this price is all down to preference and individual needs if you want something that you can move around with and can tolerate the size and weight of the DMPZ1 then is one of the best you can find which is portable, if you want it to be portable even on the move and can listen on the a the street then a Wm1z and a masskobo with a world class earphone like the Fitear Titan / Sony MH1 64T18 is a bit more handie or sometime you can even forget the amp and just use the 1z as dap for easy to drive ciem like my Sony mh1.

But if you are into the best sound or the whole performance vs price idea then none of these product above will satisfy you and you better off stay at home and get a STAX SR009 BHSE or Dave Utopia setup which Is roughy the same price or could be even cheaper.

Last but not least I can’t stop asking why Sony launch this new ierz1r which is so hard to drive, even it’s Flagship dap the WM1Z cannot drive its best potential, I have the concept of Sony eco system does helps on each other but may be not this time...

 

[protoss]

@elton7033

Maybe a better comparsion would of been Stax 009 + D10 vs this? You do know that the D10 runs the 009 beautifully right.

Its strange you mentioned this setup and than went to say the stax + bhse is better. Well obviously.

 

[elton7033]

@elton7033

Maybe a better comparsion would of been Stax 009 + D10 vs this? You do know that the D10 runs the 009 beautifully right.

Its strange you mentioned this setup and than went to say the stax + bhse is better. Well obviously.

I apologize for my bad English.
I mean the bhse with a 009 is similar price if not cheaper then a DMPZ1 or the Wm1z masskobo and Titan with the crystal cable s I mention above is a matter of price performance, the d10 is very good but is not my cup of tea and I prefer kgsshv to bhse

I guess you are right with the stax but to be honest I don’t bring open backs cans with me to travel no matter how good they are ...

 

[protoss]

So, you want a protable Carbon on the go.
Thats what you want it seems.

 

[elton7033]

So, you want a protable Carbon on the go.
Thats what you want it seems.

Yea I know is kind of stupid spending so much on carbon connector(8000yen per connector) but it’s eye pleasing for me and to be honest with you I doubt it’s useful at all, as long as I am happy with it that’s fine, isn’t self satisfaction that the most important thing about hobby? Like many people who like watch could satisfy with a Rolex but I don’t even satisfy with my patek2499... a Casio even do a better job on keeping time...lol

 

[urs]

Dear all,

This morning, I made an appointment at my favourite headphone retailer in Zürich,: www. K55.ch.
They just got a Focal STELLIA in, currently only for listening demos, probably the first unit in Switzerland .

Why do I mention this in this R-10 thread ?, Well I was accompanied by my trusty old friend: The somewhat aging “King R-10" ( he is my longest lasting headphone, I own and cherish it since 2007…!!)
I had waited for a long time to find a suitable CLOSED successor for the R-10, and to cut it short: the waiting goes on !

I guess , those of you have indeed done any kind of comparison between an R-10 and any of these recent closed potential competitors won’t be surprised:
Even today the King sits securely on his Throne.

Just a very brief and very incomplete attempt in comparing a few points:
What I did like on the STELLIA:
The STELLIA is very nicely built, quite comfortable and light to wear and at a first listen is also demonstrating exceptional good sound quality, particularly for a closed back.
VERY good isolation against outside noise (this would indeed be THE key factor, if I should ever opt to buy one)
Here I was rather critical, but some users - Pop & rock, or such) - may like this especially:
Very powerful bass, for me frankly too much boom, boom at times - I prefer a tight, but "light" bass

Where the R-10 simply excels:
These airy and transparent heights, similar to electrostatic phones, such as STAX, giving a more spacious sound stage.
Even more comfy to wear, with the soft ear pads (which in turn could be the reason for the rather mediocre noise isolation / immission control)
A soft connection cable, with minimal microphonic effect (The STELLIA has this rather modern quite stiff type of cable , at least the short connector with 3.5 mm mini-jack version as mounted on my demo unit; a longer one with balanced 4-pin XLR is provided, but I did not use it.)
I listen mainly to classical, acoustical music, jazz and the likes and VOICES are just wonderful with the R-10…only a STAX could surpass this.

In short:
MY King keeps accompanying me for another while.
If I might consider the STELLIA at a later stage, it would be for the fact of better noise / immission control and that it is better suited as a “Sonic Work-Horse”, e.g. for daily (mis-) use…


Just for the curiosity :
At home I’m typically using a full analogue & tube chain to feed both my STAX and also mostly the R-10 .
My HighEnd system since about 25 years consists of a variety of “growing” STAX phones and suitable amps, currently with the 009S – and BTW: The King has no need to hide behind those STAXES either.
In the K55 store, however, it was all full digital, from an A&K (or such) as music server and a Chord DAVE DAC & amp to feed the phones. This could be one remaining question: How would the evaluation end up in my home system ??


Regards

Urs

PS: This is the explanation, why I stopped the intended sale of my R-10…. --- will see, this may be re-evaluated ...

Well, just an afterthought;

The STELLIA is now at my home, being burned–in and will undergo a more compressive comparison with the R10 on one hand and my two STAX (007 & 009S) on the other hand.

Of course the “actual conquest” will be between the R10 and the STELLIA.

The STAXes, being open phones, are rather outside this competition.

I’ll report more in due course…

Regards

Urs

 

[urs]

As indicated above, a few words to this assessment, STELLIA vs R10.

R10 lovers may relax & enjoy: our “Old King” is still a most worthy contender !!

My listening music was: (among many others)
(The "Digital Exception") ... a sampler CD "The Art of Cecilia Bartoli", including a rarely heard version of "Libiamo ne'lieti calici" (Brindisi) by Cecilia Bartoli, with Luciano Pavarotti, Orchestra Sinfonica e Coro di Milano Giuseppe Verdi, Riccardo Chailly
Further on CD, as I don’t have the analogue original: Charly Antolini: Knock Out, a very drum & bass driven “test” track, where many reckless users bemoaned the loss of their speaker chassis….

Vinyl:

• Bach's Italian Concerto, version with harpsichord with Martha Schuster, a recording that reproduces the harpsichord in splendid tones ..
• “Age of Belcanto ", with Joan Sutherland, and others & Richard Bonynge; lovely young opera singers just at or before their prime !
  
• Moonlight Serenade, with Ray Brown, Bass & Laurindo Almeida, guitar.
  
• And to check out some “hard stuff”: P. I. Tchaikovsky’s 1812 Overture; just the Grand Finale, where real or imagined cannon shots are fired – you can virtually see the holes on the record surface - and yes:
  HERE: I’ve got give the STELLIA 100 points, while the R10 “ducks a bit”; but you can hear the echo and the bells ringing a bit more clearly with the R10…
  (btw: my cartridge is also “bullet prove”, it’s a KOETSU RSP)

New in my analogue collection:

• Dolce Duello: Cecilia Bartoli & Sol Gabetta
  
• Sol Gabetta - Il Progetto Vivaldi: The winter of the 4 seasons, played on the cello, is simply "magical"
  
• The Hot Sardines , for some real jazzy grove and the lovely voice of “Mz Elisabeth” Bougerol.

Now my very personal and subjective “Verdict”:

The R10 surely wins on all matters of acoustical music, voices, etc. but sometimes only by a margin. (Lacking better info, I guess my R10 is bass-light)
The STELLIA on the other hand is better suited for “bass & impact” and possibly Metal, Rock & Pop; but here I can’t comment.
Actually for my taste the bass of the STELLIA is at times even for orchestral music just this little but too dominant.

However, my usual reference TOTL phones are the STAX 009S, which are certainly Not bass-heavy – hence my musical taste & tuning may be rather special.

This "taste" may be also reinforced by my two HP amps: both are tube amps , as is my analogue front end. They are the German made MalValve HA 3, and the AudioValve Solaris; both have the capability to drive all types of head phone, incl. E-Stats, such as the STAX.

What I mean is: “a full tube sound” may not be the most ideal combination with the STELLIA . Listeners with high quality solid state HP amps, combined with "HighEnd" digital material may hence come to a different conclusion.

One point I should add: “Sound Emission / Immission control” is somewhat better with the STELLIA, especially “immissions ” are better absorbed; in terms of wearing comfort I give the STELLIA also very good marks; its light and comfy. From this perspective the STELLIA is a “slightly tighter Closed Phone” than the R10.

And lastly, I keep both the R10 and the STELLIA, as they are both just too damn good to flog them on the used gear market.

Regards

Urs

 

[urs]

Contradicting myself, I allow a "cross-Link" here, as I have decided to sell the R10 after all.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sony-mdr-r-10-or-just-another-„crazy-sale“.901791/

Regards
Urs

 

[purk]

My R10 sound utterly great out of my Sony DMP-Z1. I listened to the Stellia before but found it a tad bright and the soundstage width and depth are not as good as the R10. It is more dynamic sounding and can rock much harder with greater sense of resolution. The R10 is still top notch’s if you have top end gears and use it with very top end source and materials. Personally, I find the R10 is an acquired taste and not an all rounder headphones. Still for vocal and acoustic materials they are still the best.

 

[urs]

Purk,
"Still for vocal and acoustic materials they are still the best."
My words !

Urs

The reason for selling the R10: For "High-End" listening it’s my STAX 009S, and for my "working applications" (digitizing of older records, especially Shellacs, and also for occasional "Pop & Rock" stuff it’s now the Stellia)

 

[purk]

Purk,
"Still for vocal and acoustic materials they are still the best."
My words !

Urs

The reason for selling the R10: For "High-End" listening it’s my STAX 009S, and for my "working applications" (digitizing of older records, especially Shellacs, and also for occasional "Pop & Rock" stuff it’s now the Stellia)

I have been saying that for awhile now but glad that we do agree on that.

 

[elton7033]

I have been saying that for awhile now but glad that we do agree on that.

not much people can own a pair of R10 anyway lol