[brazy001]

Please do post feedback. I'm also interested. This is promising.

These look like the stock wf1000xm4, tips. If they are, I have tried them and was not a fan. Besides the fit, they sounded like the triple comfort and appear to be the same material.

 

[Vamp898]

These look like the stock wf1000xm4, tips. If they are, I have tried them and was not a fan. Besides the fit, they sounded like the triple comfort and appear to be the same material.

The WF-1000XM4 come pre-installed with these, yes.

The Tripple Comfort are silicone foam, the NI1000 are polyurethane foam, so they are made of different materials.

I don't dislike the sound of the tripple comfort, its just that i have the same air pressure issue the normal silicone have. My hope is that the NI1000 let some air through to allow for pressure compensation. Polyurethane is a breathable material (thats what it is made for) and so resolves the air pressure issue.

And, according to reviews, you don't have to squeeze them before inserting. It can help but several people said, that they can just insert them like normal silicone.

I am really looking forward to these, i ordered them yesterday and i am awaiting shipping^^

 

[Scubadevils]

I bought the XM4 recently, I must try the tips on IER-M9.

 

[surfgeorge]

You know, its very interesting that you mentioned that because the day after writing my impressions above i was so curious where IEM's have gone over the last few years, what heights they have reached should i say, that i decided to order some 64 audio U12T in ears, now i wouldn't have ordered them except i got them used at a much cheaper price than they are new, precisely half in fact at £1000 instead of £2000.

That really was too tempting, of course they are 12 drivers per ear but i TOTALLY understand what you mean when you say sony designed their own armature and it works... it very clearly works because they are absolutely wonderful, however not all multi driver in earphones are just a collection of knowles armatures in an enclosure and 64 audio uses proprietary technology of their own, namely the TIA design which is a variation on the tweeter making it more open and exposed.

anyway without rambling too much i will just say i have not received the U12T yet, when i do i will be sure to make a comparison, its likely to sway in the direction of the U12T but why wouldn't it at that price and with its reputation, heck maybe ill prefer the m9. What is going to be interesting is how its going to differ, why is it going to be better or in what way is the M9 going to be better (besides price ofcourse)... i dont think its going to be completely one sided honestly, sony clearly know how to design a crossover, being a 5 driver with a 5 way crossover has worked wonders and somehow its so damn cohesive i believe it may retain that strong point even over the 4 way U12T, i don't think it will be a walk over at all. I know the U12T uses 4 drivers for the bass, 2 of which are sonion's largest balanced armatures dedicated solely to sub frequencies, so it will be interesting to see how the single sony driver holds up, judging by other reviewers again it probably isnt going to be a walk over.

ill post some pictures and a side by side review in the coming days, probably towards the weekend, whichever i decide to keep i can say for certain even right now that the M9 is a wonderful product and i certainly wont be trashing it.

I‘m also very much looking forward to this comparison!
The U12T is intriguing because it comes up so frequently as one of the best IEMs. I am particularly curious if the U12T can keep up with the M9‘s lack of BA timbre.
This will be interesting!

 

[Vamp898]

I‘m also very much looking forward to this comparison!
The U12T is intriguing because it comes up so frequently as one of the best IEMs. I am particularly curious if the U12T can keep up with the M9‘s lack of BA timbre.
This will be interesting!

I think the reason for this is that they are made by 64 Audio. If they would have been made by Moondrop or FiiO, they wouldn't be as hyped.I have not heard them side by side, but i heard both and i can't see how the U12t is supposed to beat the IER-M9. Its been quite some time when i heard the U12t the last time, but i don't remember its bass response to be anywhere close to the IER-M9, nor is its treble as smooth/silky. The IER-M9 can beat most dynamic drivers while the U12t does have the typical, ultra soft BA bass that doesn't slam.

But again, not an side-by-side comparison, maybe my memory is off. But i remember it to be typical all-BA and that is something, the IER-M9 is not.

I still think they are hyped because they have been made by 64 Audio and priced accordingly and for no other reason. But thats just my personal opinion.

 

[jinx20001]

I think the reason for this is that they are made by 64 Audio. If they would have been made by Moondrop or FiiO, they wouldn't be as hyped.I have not heard them side by side, but i heard both and i can't see how the U12t is supposed to beat the IER-M9. Its been quite some time when i heard the U12t the last time, but i don't remember its bass response to be anywhere close to the IER-M9, nor is its treble as smooth/silky. The IER-M9 can beat most dynamic drivers while the U12t does have the typical, ultra soft BA bass that doesn't slam.

But again, not an side-by-side comparison, maybe my memory is off. But i remember it to be typical all-BA and that is something, the IER-M9 is not.

I still think they are hyped because they have been made by 64 Audio and priced accordingly and for no other reason. But thats just my personal opinion.

with all due respect it feels like you have that opinion due to the dedication you have to the sony brand and hardware, that's ok ofcourse but the love for the brand may very well sway your opinion, ill be coming at it very much from a neutral position, i will review them side by side with no bias one way or another and will just end up keeping whichever one produces the sound i like best. as it stands right now i only know what i have read about which is apparently the u12t has some of the best bass to come out of a balanced armature and that is primarily due to using two of sonion's biggest armature drivers designed for sub bass alone and 2 knowles armatures to handle mid bass, its unlikely to be soft and not slam, but again its only what i have read.

i personally believe the sony headphones will have an advantage in cohesion and the frequencies gelling together better because my impressions of the M9 are that sony really really know how to make a good crossover, again its speculation at this point, maybe the u12t will be just as cohesive.

as for 64 audio gaining the hype due to their name... maybe so, but there is a good reason for that, i was around for when 64 audio were 1964 audio and even back then they were making a name for themselves, in fact they were doing so well they were sued by jerry harvey (JH audio) when releasing their first 6 driver in ears i believe it was, why i don't know but maybe JH thought they had the rights to the design, im not sure of the details, the point being 1964 audio were making moves a while ago and scaring the likes of ultimate ears and others, they have the reputation because they earned the reputation, not everything they make gets that love however with some big stand outs that dont get the reviews you would expect, looking at the u18t for example which many say is worse than the 12t for £1000 more.

none of this is going to matter when i put them side by side, which should be tomorrow, then ill listen for a few hours minimum side by side before making an assessment on the good and bad. i hope i dont offend anybody, particularly on this thread which is a M9 impressions thread aswell as an appreciation thread as i can see, ill post my review just as an interesting read for you guys, nothing more and certainly not as an exercise in M9 bashing because i think its a great IEM regardless.

 

[Scubadevils]

The tips from XM4 work well, I'll need to a/b versus my default which are AET07 but there is no dreaded suction to note so far and very comfortable.

 

[dleblanc343]

You know, its very interesting that you mentioned that because the day after writing my impressions above i was so curious where IEM's have gone over the last few years, what heights they have reached should i say, that i decided to order some 64 audio U12T in ears, now i wouldn't have ordered them except i got them used at a much cheaper price than they are new, precisely half in fact at £1000 instead of £2000.


ill post some pictures and a side by side review in the coming days, probably towards the weekend, whichever i decide to keep i can say for certain even right now that the M9 is a wonderful product and i certainly wont be trashing it.

Looking forward to your impressions.

As someone who specifically traded the IER-M9 + $200 for a U12T with a friend, we both spent time A/B'ing and ultimately did the trade, but were both very hard pressed to pick a winner.

U12T is more 3D whereas M9 stage deep and wide, like speakers or watching a live music scene. U12T is more immersive, but M9 is more accurate

U12T has much more impact in its bass, and arguable better macro dynamics, but the Sony has the more effortless and articulate clarity in the midrange and treble. The U12T sounds too smooth to me, especially in the upper midrange, and comes across as a bit more smothered, whereas the Sony is more silky yet crisp.

Sony has the better timbre, really one of the best of any iem ever. U12T is not far behind and decent here, but sounds a bit artificial.

U12T has better resolution, but less detail.

Ultimately, I think if both priced the same, U12T is the more complete package, but it's definitely not worth a $500 premium to me.

The IER-M9 is a much nicer overall product in its build quality and package presentation, and exudes quality. U12T, not so much.

Ultimately, if I wanted to re-explore one of these, it would be the Sony. I had sold U12T in favor of getting UM MEST as my generalist. I also own Indigo, Z1R, IE900, KSE, JH Roxannes custom & EX1000.

This is high praise too, because I always had a strong disdain for Sony in audio over the years; but the IER series iem's are staples of the industry, and I'll be honest that its converted me

 

[Elite_Force]

none of this is going to matter when i put them side by side, which should be tomorrow, then ill listen for a few hours minimum side by side before making an assessment on the good and bad. i hope i dont offend anybody, particularly on this thread which is a M9 impressions thread aswell as an appreciation thread as i can see, ill post my review just as an interesting read for you guys, nothing more and certainly not as an exercise in M9 bashing because i think its a great IEM regardless.

as an avid M9 owner look forward to your comparison

 

[Elite_Force]

Ultimately, if I wanted to re-explore one of these, it would be the Sony. I had sold U12T in favor of getting UM MEST as my generalist. I also own Indigo, Z1R, IE900, KSE, JH Roxannes custom & EX1000.

This is high praise too, because I always had a strong disdain for Sony in audio over the years; but the IER series iem's are staples of the industry, and I'll be honest that its converted me

I hope you don’t mind to shortly compare M9 to your Indigo? In other words, what would be achieved in processing from M9 to Indigo?

I am looking for an overall upgrade to M9. Warm-neutral iems, with extremely smooth, non-fatiguing and non-offensive upper-mids and treble, with similar naturalness of treble and vocal representation.

Indigo may be a nice option here – as per graphs, it is mest mk2 with a little bit elevated lower end and significantly smoothed treble.

 

[gerelmx1986]

The tips from XM4 work well, I'll need to a/b versus my default which are AET07 but there is no dreaded suction to note so far and very comfortable.

Id bigger bore size this on XM4 tips or same as normal sony tips?

 

[SlothRock]

It's official: the spring tips are the end game tip for me. They're finally the tip I was looking for that provides the most even sound signature with an impact to the bass slam and, most importantly, I never get any pain while using them. I was on the verge of buying another IEM as I was getting a bit frustrated with the M9 to get the sound signature/comfort I was looking for but now that I have these tips, my wallet will be able to stay a bit bigger. They're a really good compliment to the ZMF VC's as my #1 over-ear headphone. VC's for pure enjoyment/sound signature and the IER M9's for the utmost clarity and resolution. Chefs kiss.

 

[Scubadevils]

Id bigger bore size this on XM4 tips or same as normal sony tips?

I'd say slightly bigger on XM4 -

 

[sm0rf]

It's official: the spring tips are the end game tip for me.

nice to hear, but ya know there's never a end game situation only a current state like with all that IEM, headphone or whatever stuff

 

[Vamp898]

twith all due respect it feels like you have that opinion due to the dedication you have to the sony brand and hardware, that's ok ofcourse but the love for the brand may very well sway your opinion, ill be coming at it very much from a neutral position, i will review them side by side with no bias one way or another and will just end up keeping whichever one produces the sound i like best. as it stands right now i only know what i have read about which is apparently the u12t has some of the best bass to come out of a balanced armature and that is primarily due to using two of sonion's biggest armature drivers designed for sub bass alone and 2 knowles armatures to handle mid bass, its unlikely to be soft and not slam, but again its only what i have read.

i personally believe the sony headphones will have an advantage in cohesion and the frequencies gelling together better because my impressions of the M9 are that sony really really know how to make a good crossover, again its speculation at this point, maybe the u12t will be just as cohesive.

as for 64 audio gaining the hype due to their name... maybe so, but there is a good reason for that, i was around for when 64 audio were 1964 audio and even back then they were making a name for themselves, in fact they were doing so well they were sued by jerry harvey (JH audio) when releasing their first 6 driver in ears i believe it was, why i don't know but maybe JH thought they had the rights to the design, im not sure of the details, the point being 1964 audio were making moves a while ago and scaring the likes of ultimate ears and others, they have the reputation because they earned the reputation, not everything they make gets that love however with some big stand outs that dont get the reviews you would expect, looking at the u18t for example which many say is worse than the 12t for £1000 more.

none of this is going to matter when i put them side by side, which should be tomorrow, then ill listen for a few hours minimum side by side before making an assessment on the good and bad. i hope i dont offend anybody, particularly on this thread which is a M9 impressions thread aswell as an appreciation thread as i can see, ill post my review just as an interesting read for you guys, nothing more and certainly not as an exercise in M9 bashing because i think its a great IEM regardless.

> its unlikely to be soft and not slam,

Weird, because this is not my statement, it comes directly from Knowles. There are Interviews with the developers from Knowles where they got asked "Do you think your BAs will ever be able to beat Dynamic Drivers" and the short answer is "No". And Sonion absolutely shares this opinion, and there is reason to that.

The topic is way more complicated. Sony is, by far, the company that invests most money into development of In-Ear Headphone technology, and they always have been. It is not easy to beat the company that invented the technology and is putting most money into it by buying off-the-shelves hardware and tucking them together. Its not impossible, but its a tough job to begin with. Maybe Audio 64 was able to do that, but there is nothing in the U12t that justifies that assumption so i highly doubt it.

Audio 64 is limited to what Sonion/Knowles can do, and Knowles/Sonion say they can't do it. So it is to be expected that it won't slam and will be soft.

I mean Knowles and Sonion could do it, technically, but they would make a loss with them because the earphone market is only a tiny fraction of their income and the development cost would be insane. Why develop/design a product that causes you a loss of money?

Knowles and Sonion modify existing BAs that they designed to be used in hearing aids and they modify them in an way, that they can be used in earphones. And not just that, they do it in an universal way, that every maker can use their drivers.

To this day, they are based on the hearing aid they design/develop and both companies live from hearing aids, that is what they make money with. They will never ever design/implement something that will hurt their hearing aid business, they can not live without that.

The big advantage in using the Knowles/Sonion BAs is that they are insanely cheap (the best high-end model sells for 10-25$ per unit) and universal. _Not_ the sound. That is something important here. They try to archive the best sound they can do given these limitations, but the limitations exist. Limitations that Sony does not have, but later more about that. The big disadvantage is, that they need dampers, soundpipes and lots of other hacks to make them usable.

And this is not my personal opinion, this is an statement from the people who design, build and develop the BAs at Knowles themselves. Knowles them self say that, in the way they design their BAs, they will never be able to beat any dynamic driver and that is why the recommend to use them in an hybrid setup.

Sony was investigating Knowles BAs when they developed the XBA series back in 2008 and decided against them due to exact these disadvantages which still exist to this day. That is why they decided to develop their own BA, because there was no (and still there is no) BA that was designed and developed to play music.

And they wanted an BA that sounded exactly how they wanted it to sound and implement it exactly they way they wanted it to implement. Using an device that does exactly what you want from it gives you a big advantage over an universal device that you can modify in its limits.

The best sold Headphones in Japan and most other industrial countries are the WH-1000X and WF-1000X Series, since years. Sony makes a crapload of money with them and use the income they make with these, to co-finance the very small and specific audiophile products.

Its the same with the Xperia smartphones. Sony makes mostly loss with them, but they develop them because they want to have them. The CEO says "I want that Sony builds smartphones, no matter what". That is something most companies can't due because they lack the money. So you have to admit, it is a very very hard job to beat a company like Sony which is able to do things that make no sense and cause the company a loss, just because they want to make them because they make enough money in other parts.

Sonys BAs have a lot of disadvantages, that is important to note here. First of all, they can not be used in hearing aids (something that is essential for Knowles/Sonion). Also they are not universal, you can not just put them in any earphone. You have to develop the earphone exactly for this driver.

Also Sonys BAs are designed to be used with Sonys film capacitors. Use different capacitors and they will sound different. So you're not just limited on how you implement them in general, you are also limited in what capacitors to use with them.

Again, it is an insane advantage if you're the company that develops the drivers, the housing, the capacitors and the circuit connecting everything. Sony is always reduced to developing their own BAs, but that is just not true.They are the only company that does all the jobs needed and that is why they succeed.

If a company would buy the drivers from Sony and want an earphone that can compete with the IER-M9, they would have to build an exact copy of the IER-M9, everything else will sound worse.

That is, from a driver development standpoint, an huge limitation. Why would anyone buy an driver that would limit you to mimic the earphone from that specific company? Nobody would ever buy that. Knowles/Sonion would never ever develop an BA that could only be used in one specific setup in one specific housing. That makes absolutely no sense for them and so they give up this big advantage for universal usage.

Knowles says, that their BAs can't slam like a DD, Sonion says the same. Its not me being a fanboy, its just the truth coming straight from the developers from the drivers.

Knowles/Sonion BAs are cheap alternatives to developing your own BAs, nothing more, nothing less. They have their limitations, Knowles knows that, Sonion knows that, its not a secret. If Audio 64 wants to beat Sony, they would have to develop their own BAs. They can't because they don't make enough money from their earphones so that will never happen. Case closed.

Listen to a good recorded Taiko drum with whatever all-BA earphone that is not from Sony you want, it will never sound authentic, never. Not with the U12t, not with the FA9, not with the S8, not with the Andromeda. Knowles/Sonion BAs can not reproduce an authentic Taiko Drum sound. Sony BAs can.

That doesn't mean the IER-M9 sounds better, that is still a matter of taste. A lot of people love this soft/fast BA sound, i did enjoyed the FA9 a _lot_. The HODVTEC had an insane bass response, especially with electronic music that made it sound unreal. But listen to a Taiko drum and it suc*s.

So not to confuse taste with performance. It is absolutely possible that a lot of people dislike the IER-M9, but that is unrelated to that the IER-M9 can do things no other all-BA can do.

Summary:
Advantages of Sonys BAs: Can sound exactly how Sony want them to sound
Disadvantages of Sonys BAs: Can only be used in Earphones (Not in Hearing Aids or other appliances). Need Sony Capacitors to sound exactly how they are supposed to. They to be implemented exactly how Sony says to sound how they are supposed to

Advantages of Knowles/Sonion BAs: Can be used in pretty much every appliance including Hearing Aids. Are Universal and can be fit in every earphone
Disadvantages of Knowles/Sonion BAs: Can not sound exactly how the maker wants them to sound due to limitations in their design

I don't buy Sony products because of the Brand Sony, i buy them because Sony puts the most effort into their Earphones and Headphones, its as simple as that. I don't specifically like the Brand Sony and that is why my Camera and Lenses, for example, are from SIGMA as my Stereo Speaker setup is not from Sony too. My Smartwatch is not from Sony, my Notebook is not a VAIO and so on.