[guitarplayer]

Quote:

You seem to be getting very defensive about someone else having these tests done other then you
 

Nope, not at all, if someone wants to get any of the wire I sell tested, by all means, do so.  As long as they are willing to disclose the contact details of the respected company did the assay, the method used, the name of the metallurgist, and an unaltered copy of the assay report.  That way, one can verify with the company that the document and company are legit.
 
If you remember, this all started over you testing the wire with an acid kit from eBay.  You then sent me an email, that is posted earlier in the thread (post #72), claiming that you had tested both v1 and v2, and the results indicated both as having a high copper content, here is a snippet:
 

 I also tested a sterling >>> silver ring and the test again showed it to be what it was and also >>> got the correct result with some silver plated copper wire. >>> I then tested some TWag V2 wire and the results showed that the wire >>> has a high copper content and has a maximum of 80% silver in it.

 
When I stopped communicating with you, as I felt our communications were going nowhere and something was getting lost in the meaning of my responses to your queries, you took it upon yourself to post the contents of emails between us, thus opening up our conversation to public scrutiny.  You also posted a barrage of posts, of which a number have been somehow deleted.  Perhaps there is a bug in the HF forum software that deleted and put ... in many of your emails where text used to be?
 
The public scrutiny of our email chain is fine, as I said the same things in the emails, that I have been saying since in the forum, ie:
 
I don't know how accurate an "eBay test" is
I will investigate it
I will have a lab test it
If there is a problem, I will have legal look into it
If anyone has a problem, talk to Craig, and he will rectify it
 
At that point, because you had stated that v2 was also testing high in copper content, I only sent v2 to the metallurgist for assay. 
 
Well...so far, we know that your "eBay test" was clearly wrong on v2. 
 
Once more information came to light that it seemed that the v1 is the wire that is turning green, I had Craig overnight me some samples of v1 that had turned color, and submitted it to AuRIC (www.auriclabs.com) as well as a sample of the v1 I had left on hand, which had not turned color.
 
Perhaps your "eBay test" it will be right on v1, that is yet to be seen.  I will have the fire assay results and ICP-OES results very soon, and will post them.
 
So, just to be clear with you, "parrots", if you choose to have the wire assayed, I look forward to the results.  As long as the contact info of the company is clearly posted, what method is used is specified, the name of the metallurgist, and the full certified assay report.  If the information is reliable, it will help with the ongoing investigation.
 
So, just to be clear, here are where things stand:
 
I am still investigating
TWag v2 is mint grade silver, as proven by a fire assay.  Soon I will have an ICP-OES test as well.  Feel free to buy TWag v2!
I am awaiting a fire assay test, and an ICP-OES test on TWag v1
Anyone who has had a problem with v1 turning color, has either been taken care of by Craig, is in the process of being take of by Craig, or is welcome to contact Craig to be taken care of
 
Why v1 is turning green is still a mystery at this point, until I receive the assay reports, and make sure the purity is where it is supposed to be, I am in a holding pattern.  If v1 comes back as pure silver, I will need to talk with some plastic experts.
 
None of the above changes the fact that I have been saying from the beginning that I am concerned, and for those of you that have v1 that is turning, please contact Craig for rectification.  Craig is the point man for all customer concerns, as he is/was the retailer of the cables made from this wire. 
 
I have made arrangements with Craig to be able to take care of any who report a color change of v1 to him.  He will be in charge of this going forward, once I get the second set of assay results back and posted.  After I get the second set of assay's back, and post them, I don't intend to spend any more time here at Head-Fi.  So, lean on Craig as the point man for any color issues with v1.  He is capable, and equipped to handle any problems, I have only been in this thread as my integrity was called into question, and Craig needed me to answer questions, and investigate things of a more technical nature.
 
Being accused of being a fraud, the mean spirited posts by those not even involved, and the "guilty until proven innocent" mentality that seems pervasive here does not sit well with me.  I have been in business a very long time, and am well known for my integrity, caring, and honesty.  The emotional toll of having my integrity called into question by posters cloaked in anonymity, coupled with the demands of taking care of a terminally ill wife, have quenched my desire to "be a part of the community" here at Head-Fi.  I am going to have Jude pull my forum down (which I never post in anyways...), and only visit if a customer specifically asks me to.
 
I will post the assay results on v1 (fire assay and ICP-OES), and v2 and Eclipse (fire assay above, ICP-OES forthcoming) as soon as I get them back.  All the important questions/issues at that point should be answered and addresses:
 
The purity of v2
The purity of Eclipse
The purity of v1
 
And, arrangements have been made so that any issues with v1 will be addressed by Craig.
 
Peace,
 
Lee
 
EDIT--fixed AuRIC link.
 

 

[guitarplayer]

Quote:

Lee thanks for working to gett to the bottom of this, hopefully it is just a spool that was bad or something else weird.
 
Folks Lee and Craig are doing thier best to resolve the situation, please don't take thier words out of context. Both guys are small shops and thier reputation is all they have, I've met both Lee and Craig and my impression is they are both hardworking businessmen. They've offered to replace any wire that is discolored and soon well be able to see the results of the V1 wire as well.

Thank you.
 
Peace,
 
Lee

 

[Steve Eddy]

 
Agreed.
 
Although we haven't met in person, I know Lee and have dealt with him on a number of occasions and consider him among the good people out there.
 
se
 
 

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

I will post the details of the place I'm using along with the results when I have them and only then and it's up to everyone else to make up their minds regarding the results, I have not even sent the wire yet if I'm honest but I will do this week and it's just takes them a day from receiving the wire to test it and have the results so I will have the results by the end of the week, I have also cut up some V2 wire and both are now packed and ready to send.
You seem to be getting very defensive about someone else having these tests done other then you and I have never accused you or craig of trying to rip people off yet you seem to keep making that assumption and suggesting that's what I'm saying when that has not been the case.

Anyway, il post my results this week for sure, I'm going away Wednesday so il ask them to email me and if they sent a letter with the results then I have a friend looking after my place and il get him to post that here and at that point I will also post the link to the company that was used.

As for the wire turning green I think that's quite obvious to people now why that would happen.

You're the only one I see getting defensive here.  Lee has done everything possible to try to clarify and rectify the situation and you keep baiting him.  Either post your metallurgical tests, or be quiet.  You seem to be doing everything you can to try to tarnish his reputation.  I've known him for years and met him personally and he has never been anything but kind and helpful, and he would never knowingly sell wire he didn't think was what he was advertising.  He has said time and time again he and Craig will replace any wire that has turned green with wire he has now shown to be pure silver, so I don't know why you insist on tormenting him.  You seem to be the one with the hidden agenda.
 

 

[guitarplayer]

Ha, indeed. 

 
Anyone interested enough can call the metallurgist who performed the tests on my wire and speak with him, if they wish though! 
 
Peace,
 
Lee
 
Quote:

Yeah, right.
 
Ask Barack Obama how well THAT worked out for him and his birth certificate.

 
se
 
 

 

 

[guitarplayer]

Right back at you!
 
Peace,
 
Lee
 
Quote:

 
Agreed.
 
Although we haven't met in person, I know Lee and have dealt with him on a number of occasions and consider him among the good people out there.
 
se
 
 

 

 

[guitarplayer]

Thanks Phil!  And, Phil even says this after I have denied him on more than one occasion use of the my TWag to use as internal wire, as I promised Craig an exclusive, and I stand by my word. 
 
Peace,
 
Lee
 
Quote:

You're the only one I see getting defensive here.  Lee has done everything possible to try to clarify and rectify the situation and you keep baiting him.  Either post your metallurgical tests, or be quiet.  You seem to be doing everything you can to try to tarnish his reputation.  I've known him for years and met him personally and he has never been anything but kind and helpful, and he would never knowingly sell wire he didn't think was what he was advertising.  He has said time and time again he and Craig will replace any wire that has turned green with wire he has now shown to be pure silver, so I don't know why you insist on tormenting him.  You seem to be the one with the hidden agenda.
 

 

 

[SACD-Man]

Yes we are working on this issue and of course I will replace anyone's cable that has turned green.
 
I do need to follow a process, so please email me at csanborn@whiplashaudio.com for further details.
Plus we will have more details once they are available. 
 
Thanks guys,
Craig

 

[sridhar3]

Quote:

Me getting defensive, what reason exactly would be the reason for that and what exact hidden agenda could I possibly have?
Yes I've been offered replacement and I don't want it because I want to find out what the $300 a piece Iem I was buying are made of and if you call that a hidden agenda then so be it.
As far as I can see, all the posts Lee has mentioned me he has been trying to discredit me one way or the other when all I'm doing here is trying to find out what my hard earned cash went towards.

@Lee yes the first test I carried out with a kit from eBay showed both had some copper but the V2 test was not so clear so I bought another test and that showed only the V1 to have copper content this is why I never posted the results here after I done the tests as there were not 200% certain and I don't like posting stuff I'm not sure of, I only posted the results after you had posted results carried out a similar way.
I have nothing to gain by doing this and am actually loosing alot of money doing it as I've had to cut up 2 cables already.
I have also returned mist of my V1 cables and one V2 but kept hold of the green ones.

When I get my results whenever that might be il post post my results and that will be my last post regarding this issue and whatever else won't be mentioned here by me.

You guys can take notice of the results or not as I could not care less as this is being done for my benefit.

You really need to squash this beef man.  Get your replacement and just let it go.  You're one guy standing in the middle of a crowd shouting at the top of your lungs, and I'm pretty sure everybody's sick of hearing it.

 

[563]

just wondering - parrots, are you the same person who does the youtube videos - such as the one here?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ndPJIbNyvs  - that person is a parrot fan as well.
 
also, forgive me if i'm mistaken, but did you ever use a different name (or names) on head-fi in the past?
 
 

 

[b0ck3n]

Quote:

Already passed with other cables with someone else switching for me. In fact I went to freinds house and noted something was off about his system. He had changed his speaker cable. Just haven't heard the twag.

 
You've yet to share the details of the test you mention. I find this statement to be signifant as if true, and up to ABX standards, even if you're the only participant, it's the first known instance where someone has passed a non sighted test. I know I'm not supposed to discuss it here, so moderators feel free to delete it, but the post I've quoted is as off base, completely unsubstantiated, potentially misleading, and should be removed as well.
 
 

 

[guitarplayer]

See below.  My responses are in red, except for "Results are in".
 
Quote:

Results are in
 
Let me first say here that i have no hidden motives as been suggested by Lee from Cryo Parts in an attempt to discredit me, all i have wanted to do here was find out what me and many others having been paying our money for and if we were getting what was payed for but Lee seems to have been going out of his way to try and make me look like the bad guy here.
 
Not at all my intent, I just wanted to know who I am dealing with, and what is/was your agenda, if any.  I still do not know who you are, as you are hiding behind a moniker on a forum and have not posted your real name.
 
 
I contacted him awhile ago regarding TWag wires turning green and after tests i carried out first with an acid test kit showed Both the V1 and the V2 to have a hight copper content i then purchased a better test ket and this time round only the V1 showed to have a high copper content and the V2 to be pure silver so i decided to get this professionally tested at a lab.
 
On contacting Lee this is just one of the replies i got from him
 
[size=small] I need to have the wire tested by an independent accredited facility, most likely being tested by a GCMS.[/size]
[size=small]However, all of the above is not really necessary, as I am willing to replace any wire that is turning green.[/size]
 
 
[size=small]Y[/size]Once again, you are taking my words out of context.  I was simply stating that I would be happy to have Craig replace any wire that is turning green--which he has been doing.  Go re-read the emails and please comprehend the meanings.
 
 
Why would he after being told that this wire has a high copper content still say that testing of the wire is not necessay? I belive he knew exactly what this wire was made of and did not want anyone testing it and it becoming public, why would someone who has sold possibly hundreds of thousands of dallars worth of this wire not actually want to know what its made of, they were made aware of this wire turning green about a year ago and still done nothing about it and continued to sell it, i cant see why someone who genuinely did not know what the wire was made of would not have got the wire tested after the first report.
 
Just to make sure, you are accusing me of fraud?  Clearly, the above is libelous, as I have explained many times before in the thread what I was doing, what was happening, and how I was going about it.  yet, you still continue to accuse me of fraud, defame my character, and post libelous statements about me and my intentions. 
 
Can you read my mind?  Now you know what I was thinking?  I would never stake my reputation by stating something I did not believe was true at the time.  I have said this many times above, but  yet, you still accuse me of malfeasance and fraud, and post libelous statements about me above.
 
Hundreds of thousands of dollars of wire?  Wow, you have the wrong impression of this industry...
 
Apparantly this is very rare yet i have had both my V1 cables turning green, this was then blamed on a batch by Lee saying he gets every batch tested and missed one batch, how convenient, yet the 2 cables i bought were bought 4 months apart.
My email conversation with him has all been posted earlier in the thread so please go and read it.
 
I never said I get *every* batch tested.  I said that when I first started doing business with this vendor, I did my due diligence.  After a while trust is built, and you accept that they are providing what was ordered and spec'd.  From now on, I will most certainly have every batch tested.  Once again, you twist my words. 
 
Read the emails above, comprehend the meaning.
 
We need to ask ourselves also why after it was the V1 that was reported to have been turning green and said to be the wire with the high copper content Lee "Cryo Parts" goes and only gets the V2 cables tested, little strange aint it and again i belive this is because he knows what those results would show which is why he never had them tested so any claims of him not knowing what the contents are is total rubbish in my opinion.
 
As I stated above, I did not have any v1 on hand that had turned green.  Since you originally stated that the v2 also tested as having a high copper content, I sent it in as I had it readily available.  Once it came to light that it was only the v1 that was problematic, I then got some samples from Craig that had turned green, and submitted those with some samples that had not turned.  I am still awaiting on the results.  Again, go read my posts above, it is all explained there.
 
My wire was tested the same day it was received and the results available yet Lee said quite some time ago now that he is getting the V1 tested and since then he has not posted any results, why is that?
 
Don't have them back yet.  Am still awaiting results, as I am getting both fire assay and ICP-OES testing done on v1 and v2.  As soon as I get the results, I will post them.  I posted the contact information of my lab, email them, or call them to ask if they have revelaed the results of the tests to me yet, if you don't believe me.
 
I belive every single V1 cable out there is not pure silver and this was known by Lee at cryo parts before he offered it for sale, if you read his emails to me you will see at one point he even threatens me with his legal councel, trying to scare me off taking this further and as usual there have been a few posts kissing a##.
 
Again, you defame my character, and make libelous statements about me. 
 
Wow.  I really don't know what to say at this point.
 
I never threatened you with legal counsel, I wished to cut off communications with you, as they were going nowhere, and asked if you wished to discuss this further, I would be happy to make my legal counsel available to you, and you can communicate with him.  I did say that legal would become involved if the wire was not as promised, but the legal action would be me against my vendor...if needed.  Again, this is all stated above, please reread the posts...
 
Here are the results showing the V1 to be not made of pure silver and i suggest that everyone who owned the V1 cable, Green or not contact Cryo Parts or Whiplash Audio and demand a refund or to have there cables replaced with the V2 but dont be too sure the wire used in the V2 wont be changed at a later date.
 
As stated above, anyone who has a problem is being taken care of.  Please reread and comprehend the posts above.
 
Unfortunately i dont know how to uplaod a screen shot so i printed out the results sent to me and took pictures of them, the tests were carried out by "The Laboratory At The Birmingham Assay Office" who are the biggest testing lab in the Uk so feel free to check their credentials online. 
 
If anyone wants to didpute these results then feel free to contact me and we can meet up and take the wire down to a lab together and get it tested while we wait.
 
 
 
 
Thank you for posting these.  It will be good to compare these results with the ones I receive, once I get them and post them.
 
To reiterate, if the results of the assays I am having performed some back the same as above, as I said above, I would rectify the situation--I have taken steps with Craig to make sure this happens in the even that the tests came back on v1 stating that it had a high copper content.  Already, Craig has been working to resolve any issues with customers who wish to have their v1 wire replaced.  If you have some v1, and want it replaced, contact Craig, he will take care of you.
 
The position of Whiplash and myself is clear, we will replace any v1 that a customer wants replaced, and have been doing so up until now.
 
And, as I have stated numerous times, if there turned out to be a problem with v1, myself and Craig would make it right, and we have been.  Sometimes vendors pull fast ones, it seems.  This mistake will not be made again, every batch of TWag from now on will be assayed before release, as I said above.
 
If the assays I am having performed on v1 turn out to be similar, then I apologize.  I was duped by a trusted vendor, it will never happen again. 
 
I promised we would make this right, and we have been, and will continue to do so.

 
 

 

[guitarplayer]

Please keep libeling me and making defamatory statements.  Please keep reading things into what I wrote, and do not pay attention to what was actually written.
 
I think that any reasonable person, who reads the entire thread will understand that there was no ill will on my part, no intent to deceive, and that I am taking responsibility for a vendor not providing me what they claimed they were.  At least that appears to be the case, as evidenced by your assay report.  As soon as I get mine, I will post it, and then comparisons can be made.
 
Again--Anyone that is not happy with their v1 can get it replaced.  Craig has been doing so, and will continue to do so.  I have made arrangements with him, that will allow him to do this.
 
If one reads the thread, I think I have been up front, kept things transparent, and have been honest about the situation.  Once my assays are back, and if the results are similar to yours for the v1, then I know I have been duped by a vendor.  All I can say is that this is a lesson learned, and that it won't happen again, as every batch from now on will be tested before release--even if the wire is from a trusted, respected, and well known source.  But, if an error, or if I was misled, happened, it happened.  Nothing I can do about that now, except offer an apology and continue on with my promise that anyone who is not happy with their v1 can get it replaced.
 
If I admit there was a mistake made, offer to make it right to those affected, and then follow through on that promise, what else can I do? 
 

 
Quote:

You knew about the wire turning green over a year ago yet did nothing, when I also bought this to you're attention you said testing was not required. Why after someone says this could have copper in it would you say that and why did you not have the wire tested when this was first bought to you're attention.
My name is Matt Ali, or did you miss that in my emails, why would I need to hide what my name is? If you wanted that info you could contact Craig as he must keep some records of who he sells cables to.
You been cought and that's all there is to it as far as I'm concerned, pure silver does not turn green and everyone knows that and the results I have posted clearly show why the cable has been turning green, because you are getting cables made of cheap silver and adding copper to it for a different sound.
You sell even the V2 at 7N purity which would obviously be much much more expensive to buy but flog 3N silver instead lining you're pockets.
Anyway, talking to you is a waste of time, you gave been cought out and thats all there is to it.

 

 

[guitarplayer]

Quote:

Note: I have no affiliation with Whiplash Audio or Cryo Parts.

That's for sure. 
 
Please also stop spamming every forum with posts about v1 being eligible to be replaced.  Between you spamming many of the different forum sections, coupled with your libelous and defamatory statements about me in the main thread, is not helping what you view as a cause celebre'. which in reality is not.
 
EDIT--added comma.

 

[tonsofquestions]

So ... what's happening to all the V1 models that are getting returned?
I'd totally be interested in buying one - but at a significantly discounted price.