[frankrondaniel]

Fair point - currently, I'm using the Westone Star Tips (Orange). Best sleeves I've tried so far that isn't a custom.

Don't like Shure olives because of the muffle, and don't like the Comply tips because they're far too high maintenance.

For obvious reasons, tri flange tips won't help, and my experience with the Shure mushrooms have been that they're brighter than star tips.

With that said, I'm also a little sensitive to treble. My W4s and W40s didn't have that issue, but lots of people I've read didn't think the treble was sufficient on those. The last IEM that gave me pain was the W3s.


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You're definitely not the only one sensitive to treble.  I'm in the same boat.  I'm unable to tolerate the white filters for long - same with using my silver litz cable.  I end up using blue filters and cooper cable.  Definitely less fatiguing for me.

 

[phnx90]

Fair point - currently, I'm using the Westone Star Tips (Orange). Best sleeves I've tried so far that isn't a custom.

Don't like Shure olives because of the muffle, and don't like the Comply tips because they're far too high maintenance.

For obvious reasons, tri flange tips won't help, and my experience with the Shure mushrooms have been that they're brighter than star tips.

With that said, I'm also a little sensitive to treble. My W4s and W40s didn't have that issue, but lots of people I've read didn't think the treble was sufficient on those. The last IEM that gave me pain was the W3s.


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You're definitely not the only one sensitive to treble.  I'm in the same boat.  I'm unable to tolerate the white filters for long - same with using my silver litz cable.  I end up using blue filters and cooper cable.  Definitely less fatiguing for me.

Have you tried silver cables with the black filter? Would be interested in what that'd be like. Missed the opportunity when I went out and bought my copper cable. Surely it would alleviate issues with the toned-down mids that was preventing me from staying on the black filters...


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[MadGTI]

 I used to be an audiophile back in 80-90 with vinyl and cassette deck. and have not engaged in HIfi for 15 years.I am a newbie in this Digital sound.
I don't have your experience in this high gear stuff. I don't have any desk gear, I only have SE846 and AK120II.
I might get used to warm sound signature and are satisfied with the bass and mid and only limited amount of treble (no top end range). Your comment regarding the treble performance of SE846 is right.

 

[spook76]

I must be one of the few people who thinks the SE846 is intolerably / painfully sparkly on the balanced / blue filters and when listening to cymbal-heavy songs, so a copper cable works just fine for me.

Tried the black filters for a week, and while that alleviated the issue, the mid bass was a little too much, although fun at times. The black filters also dial back the mids as well, so I couldn't stay with them. Ideally, I would want something that dials down the treble a little bit that doesn't do too much for the mids and lows, and these cables do just that. I don't notice any significant difference in the mids and the lows, but my ears don't hurt when I listen to cymbal-heavy songs anymore.

FYI, the cables are Lab Kable Super Nova Mk III, which I purchased for HKD 2,280. Overpriced, I'd say, but I'm flying to London next week for a fortnight, so I don't have the luxury of time. Wish these cables were a little thinner though; there are surely plenty of 8 braid cables that don't look like it may have been made with the remnants of Rapunzel's ponytail.


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I hope you realize the filters ONLY change the treble response. The bass and midrange remain unaffected. Take a look at the frequency response chart of the three filters. What a filter change can do is change your perception of the sound but realize that it is only your perception not the actual frequency response.

 

[Chodi]

Due to the fact that the 846 is only 9 ohms and actually dips lower it is extremely sensitive to the output impedance of the source. It is also more sensitive to cable changes than earphones with higher impedance. All this will have a very noticeable effect on the frequency response.

 

[phnx90]

I must be one of the few people who thinks the SE846 is intolerably / painfully sparkly on the balanced / blue filters and when listening to cymbal-heavy songs, so a copper cable works just fine for me.

Tried the black filters for a week, and while that alleviated the issue, the mid bass was a little too much, although fun at times. The black filters also dial back the mids as well, so I couldn't stay with them. Ideally, I would want something that dials down the treble a little bit that doesn't do too much for the mids and lows, and these cables do just that. I don't notice any significant difference in the mids and the lows, but my ears don't hurt when I listen to cymbal-heavy songs anymore.

FYI, the cables are Lab Kable Super Nova Mk III, which I purchased for HKD 2,280. Overpriced, I'd say, but I'm flying to London next week for a fortnight, so I don't have the luxury of time. Wish these cables were a little thinner though; there are surely plenty of 8 braid cables that don't look like it may have been made with the remnants of Rapunzel's ponytail.


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I hope you realize the filters ONLY change the treble response. The bass and midrange remain unaffected. Take a look at the frequency response chart of the three filters. What a filter change can do is change your perception of the sound but realize that it is only your perception not the actual frequency response.

Didn't know that, thanks for the info!

In the absence of other factors that come into play from changing the filters, I guess it must really be perception, which is odd, since the bass and midrange is noticeably different when I change the filters. I say this because I admittedly did more research into the 846 AFTER I bought them and not before (managed to get 20% off so I was in a rush; can you blame me? :lol. Tried out all three filters and went with how they sounded to me, and this is the first time I've heard that they only change the treble response haha.

But then again, a frequency response chart doesn't take a few factors into account (changes brought about by different sleeves would be one, I imagine), so maybe there's a part of the filters that brings about that difference that can't or wasn't captured by the frequency chart of yours?


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[spook76]

Didn't know that, thanks for the info!

In the absence of other factors that come into play from changing the filters, I guess it must really be perception, which is odd, since the bass and midrange is noticeably different when I change the filters. I say this because I admittedly did more research into the 846 AFTER I bought them and not before (managed to get 20% off so I was in a rush; can you blame me? :lol. Tried out all three filters and went with how they sounded to me, and this is the first time I've heard that they only change the treble response haha.

But then again, a frequency response chart doesn't take a few factors into account (changes brought about by different sleeves would be one, I imagine), so maybe there's a part of the filters that brings about that difference that can't or wasn't captured by the frequency chart of yours?


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Also never forget that the SE846 might have the lowest input impedance at 9ohms of any IEM or headphone and therefore it is VERY source dependent. A 5ohm DAP, for example, would change the not just your perception of the sound but frequency response dramatically.

 

[Max Minimum]

Also never forget that the SE846 might have the lowest input impedance at 9ohms of any IEM or headphone and therefore it is VERY source dependent. A 5ohm DAP, for example, would change the not just your perception of the sound but frequency response dramatically.

Yes, I can attest to the effect that output impedance has on the sound of the 846.  On the CEntrance HiFi M8, it sounds substantially better when the impedance is switched over to 1 ohm than with the impedance set to 11 ohms.

 

[milford30]

I hope you realize the filters ONLY change the treble response. The bass and midrange remain unaffected. Take a look at the frequency response chart of the three filters. What a filter change can do is change your perception of the sound but realize that it is only your perception not the actual frequency response.

 
I have no idea where you got that graph from here's the headroom page for the se846:
 
http://www.headphone.com/products/shure-se846
 
Click HeadRoom Labs and you get this graph:
 
http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID%5B%5D=4223&graphID%5B%5D=4293&graphID%5B%5D=4203&scale=30
 
Matched at 1khz and 2-3 db difference in the bass... 
 
The graph you posted is clearly volume matched at the bass, of course it will "only change the treble responce" the standard is volume matching at 1khz

 

[MadGTI]

Quote 
 
  Originally posted  by Max Minimum
 
Quote:

Also never forget that the SE846 might have the lowest input impedance at 9ohms of any IEM or headphone and therefore it is VERY source dependent. A 5ohm DAP, for example, would change the not just your perception of the sound but frequency response dramatically.

Yes, I can attest to the effect that output impedance has on the sound of the 846.  On the CEntrance HiFi M8, it sounds substantially better when the impedance is switched over to 1 ohm than with the impedance set to 11 ohms.
 
  Unquote
 
Does it mean that if output impedance is higher than 1/8 of 9 ohm , bass will rolled off and treble will increase?

 

[spook76]

I have no idea where you got that graph from here's the headroom page for the se846:

http://www.headphone.com/products/shure-se846

Click HeadRoom Labs and you get this graph:

http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID%5B%5D=4223&graphID%5B%5D=4293&graphID%5B%5D=4203&scale=30

Matched at 1khz and 2-3 db difference in the bass... 

The graph you posted is clearly volume matched at the bass, of course it will "only change the treble responce" the standard is volume matching at 1khz

And if you go to Golden Ears you will see the filters only effect the treble response. How could a dampning material boost the bass?
http://en.goldenears.net/30016

 

[milford30]

And if you go to Golden Ears you will see the filters only effect the treble response. How could a dampning material boost the bass?
http://en.goldenears.net/30016

 
Different plastics can, and the graphs in my post shows a clear dampaning of the bass, the filter material can also dampen the bass. 

 

[spook76]

Different plastics can, and the graphs in my post shows a clear dampaning of the bass, the filter material can also dampen the bass. 

But the graphs in my post show no change in the bass which may mean one of the measurements was done incorrectly. Further, if you read the interview with Sean Sullivan at Shure the filters only shape the treble response. http://blog.shure.com/the-making-of-the-se846-an-interview-with-sean-sullivan/

 

[milford30]

But the graphs in my post show no change in the bass which may mean one of the measurements was done incorrectly. Further, if you read the interview with Sean Sullivan at Shure the filters only shape the treble response. http://blog.shure.com/the-making-of-the-se846-an-interview-with-sean-sullivan/

As i have stated, graphs MUST be volume matched at 1khz, matching the volume at the bass will simply show the bass is at the same volume, which is definitely wrong!
 
From the interview:
 
"The bright insert has a certain level of acoustic resistance that shapes the peaks in the presence range about 2.5 dB higher than the balanced insert. The warm insert, down about 2.5 dB from the balanced."
 
is the closest comment to the filters, does not mention " filters only shape the treble response" it may be the bass presence range or it may be a different way they measured the responces:
http://www.recordingeq.com/EQ/req0400/OctaveEQ.htm
 
Either way the graph you presented is definitely wrong for comparing different headphones/earphones.

 

[spook76]

As i have stated, graphs MUST be volume matched at 1khz, matching the volume at the bass will simply show the bass is at the same volume, which is definitely wrong!

From the interview:

"[COLOR=4B4B4B]The bright insert has a certain level of acoustic resistance that shapes the peaks in the presence range about 2.5 dB higher than the balanced insert. The warm insert, down about 2.5 dB from the balanced."[/COLOR]

[COLOR=4B4B4B]is the closest comment to the filters, does not mention "[/COLOR] filters only shape the treble response" it may be the bass presence range or it may be a different way they measured the responces:
http://www.recordingeq.com/EQ/req0400/OctaveEQ.htm

Either way the graph you presented is definitely wrong for comparing different headphones/earphones.

Take it up with Golden Ears. How are you so certain your graph is correct? It must be nice to be omniscient.

I have owned the SE846 since the first batch in August 2013 and have extensively listened to all the filters and I hear absolutely no difference in the bass or midrange response.