[indigogo]

I went over to Gearspace to get a more balanced professional view of the new NDH 30 and discovered that you had signed up there just to sing the praises of the Neumann. Curious.

I’m sure it’s a very good new studio headphone. I’m going to wait until the dust has settled and it’s no longer flavour of the month. Rave reviews of new products rarely live up to their promise a little further down the line......

I write because I am not indifferent to those who are looking for
Because earlier I was also looking for and receiving only distorted opinions that have nothing to do with the truth
And you can suspect and think otherwise

but in general, my advice is for those who are ready to perceive the information as it is and not give themselves up to fake advertising

 

[Mike F]

I write because I am not indifferent to those who are looking for
Because earlier I was also looking for and receiving only distorted opinions that have nothing to do with the truth
And you can suspect and think otherwise

but in general, my advice is for those who are ready to perceive the information as it is and not give themselves up to fake advertising

Well I certainly appreciate your enthusiasm for the Neumann, and I’m sure it’s great. But, usually, the latest and greatest is seen in a more sober light after a while. There was a very similar buzz and very similar reports of the NDH 20 when it first came out. Have you compare the two?

 

[indigogo]

Well I certainly appreciate your enthusiasm for the Neumann, and I’m sure it’s great. But, usually, the latest and greatest is seen in a more sober light after a while. There was a very similar buzz and very similar reports of the NDH 20 when it first came out. Have you compare the two?

Before getting NDH 30, I had NDH 20 and they were not bad, but raw.
And although they worked fine in some areas - I did not like them in a number of ways. I compared them directly - and believe me - they are two different worlds, like heaven (NDH 30) and earth (NDH 20)
Now they have released updated NDH 20 in black and with a new balanced cable, I suspect that Neumann reconfigured them. This needs to be figured out, I don't have anyone near the new black version.

 

[Opalius]

It doesn't matter if it's dark, light, bright, or whatever.
Right now Imany - Voodoo Cello - 2021 - 660s doesn't even half reveal the full potential of this incredibly professional and modern recorded and mixed album.

Just listened to the album. I don't think it's badly mixed, but I think it is a very easy album to pull off for most headphones.

I will agree that it is a album that will show tonality very well. But detail, speed, air, soundstage? Many not so much.

It's kinda like when a salesperson plays "Hotel California, unplugged". Most speakers, and headphones can play it somewhat well...

One of my favorite testsongs for detail and separation is Jillian - Within Temptation from the album Black Symphony.
https://deezer.page.link/hhz2g9gjmhnPxCRz8

Basstest: Interstellar - Mountains.
https://deezer.page.link/KPWAYVh4ZS7Ff2vs6

Soundstage test:
Robots in motion
https://deezer.page.link/dSTNsTsg6WQ2DeRv9

 

[indigogo]

Just listened to the album. I don't think it's badly mixed, but I think it is a very easy album to pull off for most headphones.

I will agree that it is a album that will show tonality very well. But detail, speed, air, soundstage? Many not so much.

It's kinda like when a salesperson plays "Hotel California, unplugged". Most speakers, and headphones can play it somewhat well...

One of my favorite testsongs for detail and separation is Jillian - Within Temptation from the album Black Symphony.
https://deezer.page.link/hhz2g9gjmhnPxCRz8

Basstest: Interstellar - Mountains.
https://deezer.page.link/KPWAYVh4ZS7Ff2vs6

Soundstage test:
Robots in motion
https://deezer.page.link/dSTNsTsg6WQ2DeRv9

It just seems to be simple.
In order to compare and evaluate something, you first need Audirvana + professional audio interface and source at least 16bit 44 kHz
According to your links, the sound is of very low quality, it is impossible to evaluate the quality of the headphones from it
But even if it were high quality, there is nothing inside in terms of sound to make it possible to evaluate the headphones

 

[Opalius]

It just seems to be simple.
In order to compare and evaluate something, you first need Audirvana + professional audio interface and source at least 16bit 44 kHz
According to your links, the sound is of very low quality, it is impossible to evaluate the quality of the headphones from it
But even if it were high quality, there is nothing inside in terms of sound to make it possible to evaluate the headphones

Okey... So I'm guessing 1 of 2 things right now.
1. You are trolling me?
2. Your just a tat to fast on the trigger...


Do you seriously think I'm listening to Hans Zimmer with Mountains on anything other then Flac 44.1kHz - 16 bit??? Like seriously?

The links were just to be sure you knew what songs, albums and soon... Please use you favourite streaming service...

In terms on what's on the songs to evaluate headphones... Well I'm guessing you did not notice that deep rumble and how deep the bass goes on that song... But that's all fine.

And regarding an audio interface. Well, let's just say you don't need that if we are talking a traditional audio interface you use for recording...( At this point I'm sure I'm being trolled, - but I'll play along ).

In general, - let's just say my audio-chain is okey for the headphones I have...

Anyways, happy your happy with your headphones.

 

[indigogo]

Okey... So I'm guessing 1 of 2 things right now.
1. You are trolling me?
2. Your just a tat to fast on the trigger...


Do you seriously think I'm listening to Hans Zimmer with Mountains on anything other then Flac 44.1kHz - 16 bit??? Like seriously?

The links were just to be sure you knew what songs, albums and soon... Please use you favourite streaming service...

In terms on what's on the songs to evaluate headphones... Well I'm guessing you did not notice that deep rumble and how deep the bass goes on that song... But that's all fine.

And regarding an audio interface. Well, let's just say you don't need that if we are talking a traditional audio interface you use for recording...( At this point I'm sure I'm being trolled, - but I'll play along ).

In general, - let's just say my audio-chain is okey for the headphones I have...

Anyways, happy your happy with your headphones.

I listened to this before and now I listened to some tracks in Hi-Res stereo PCM 24/96
And yes - it's not suitable for testing - because these tracks are made to be mono compatible. And they are quite sluggish in terms of the sound field, they have a lot of raw sound blocks, despite the volume drops

In the Mountains I hear literally every component very clearly and in the overall scene, the entire frequency range, etc. - but this is not a difficult track

The most complex sounds are well-recorded instruments and vocals, tuned reverbs and delays, combined into one mix, separated by stereo stage and distance, etc., and all this must be professionally assembled and mixed, in general, it takes a long time to write.

If you don't hear depth and quality, then your headphones don't pull it out

 

[Opalius]

I listened to this before and now I listened to some tracks in Hi-Res stereo PCM 24/44.1
And yes - it's not suitable for testing - because these tracks are made to be mono compatible. And they are quite sluggish in terms of the sound field, they have a lot of raw sound blocks, despite the volume drops

.... Can't really say I agree ( mostly ). I don't think neather Hans Zimmer nor the enginere who mixed the live album for Within Temptation was thinking about how their mixes would sound on a bluetooth speaker... because big suprise, they don't sound any good when played like that...

Philter, who does is own mixing, - more then likely.

 

[Opalius]

In the Mountains I hear literally every component very clearly and in the overall scene, the entire frequency range, etc. - but this is not a difficult track

What makes imo Mountains a good testtrack for headphones and speakers alike, is that it will push the diagrams hard, and in many cases bottom out dynamic drivers so you will hear distortion.

Also, it's easy to sense how deep/low a speaker will go with the track, as the bass is rolling in the background.

If I take my Grados then guess what? no bass..

But I will agree, it's not the most complex of songs.

As for "robots in motion", it´s mixed with a lot of panning in the beginning. When listening to how wide the soundstage is, this panning helps gauge the distance how far the sound is from your head.

As for Jilian.. well, the track is a mess there is alot going on, as it's recorded live with a bloody orchestra playing in the background. - and thats kinda the point. It makes it easy to compare how well different headphones distinguish the individual instruments, - violins especially.

So I hope that gives a insight into what I listen for on some of my test-tracks.

 

[indigogo]

.... Can't really say I agree ( mostly ). I don't think neather Hans Zimmer nor the enginere who mixed the live album for Within Temptation was thinking about how their mixes would sound on a bluetooth speaker... because big suprise, they don't sound any good when played like that...

Philter, who does is own mixing, - more then likely.

I hear nuances, there are a lot of details aside, but in general, almost all tracks have a centralized sound field. The bet is made more on the atmosphere, mixing distant sounds and small stereo inclusions.

 

[Luckyleo]

I write because I am not indifferent to those who are looking for
Because earlier I was also looking for and receiving only distorted opinions that have nothing to do with the truth
And you can suspect and think otherwise

but in general, my advice is for those who are ready to perceive the information as it is and not give themselves up to fake advertising

How do I know that you're tastes, biases, listening experiences, audio chain, music tastes, physical hearing abilities, etc., are exactly like mine? My guess is that they aren't identical. "Because earlier I was also looking for and receiving only distorted opinions that have nothing to do with the truth" Nothing to do with your truth perhaps? Perhaps, your truth has nothing to do with THE truth as I define it? Is that possible? Or is your truth the only truth in this this hobby, and I best get on board?

Leo

 

[SHAMuuu]

One thing b/w 580 and 660 I notice more and more is...

for me anyway, they sound better as pad wears in. Vs some people who seem to like new pads with their 600/650

I guess which is great for those who like flatter pad sound

Primarily for my ears, more intimate and slightly crisper treble with less bite (which I've had opposite with other drivers/brands). Staging on 580 FPBP w/ copper is slightly wider, though the 660 is less so. Very minimal changes on that end. Perhaps due to CC copper factoring in

YMMV

 

[indigogo]

How do I know that you're tastes, biases, listening experiences, audio chain, music tastes, physical hearing abilities, etc., are exactly like mine? My guess is that they aren't identical. "Because earlier I was also looking for and receiving only distorted opinions that have nothing to do with the truth" Nothing to do with your truth perhaps? Perhaps, your truth has nothing to do with THE truth as I define it? Is that possible? Or is your truth the only truth in this this hobby, and I best get on board?

Leo

In this case, I can only advise you to find an opportunity to test and compare the NDH 30 with other headphones - and your questions and doubts will disappear by themselves
It will be the most correct for such a case

 

[indigogo]

What makes imo Mountains a good testtrack for headphones and speakers alike, is that it will push the diagrams hard, and in many cases bottom out dynamic drivers so you will hear distortion.

Also, it's easy to sense how deep/low a speaker will go with the track, as the bass is rolling in the background.

If I take my Grados then guess what? no bass..

But I will agree, it's not the most complex of songs.

As for "robots in motion", it´s mixed with a lot of panning in the beginning. When listening to how wide the soundstage is, this panning helps gauge the distance how far the sound is from your head.

As for Jilian.. well, the track is a mess there is alot going on, as it's recorded live with a bloody orchestra playing in the background. - and thats kinda the point. It makes it easy to compare how well different headphones distinguish the individual instruments, - violins especially.

So I hope that gives a insight into what I listen for on some of my test-tracks.

I will only say one thing here - on all these tracks, the 660s sounds very limited compared to the NDH 30
It makes no sense to describe the details and nuances of comparison for a long time. NDH 30 is just another level and another dimension

 

[wantan]

One thing b/w 580 and 660 I notice more and more is...

for me anyway, they sound better as pad wears in. Vs some people who seem to like new pads with their 600/650

I guess which is great for those who like flatter pad sound

Primarily for my ears, more intimate and slightly crisper treble with less bite (which I've had opposite with other drivers/brands). Staging on 580 FPBP w/ copper is slightly wider, though the 660 is less so. Very minimal changes on that end. Perhaps due to CC copper factoring in

YMMV

You can get a HD650/600 then and put the used pads on the HD660s/58x and continue listening.
From my listening I'd agree with your assessment.

Just speculating:
Looking at the measurements the HD58x and HD660s and HD580 have a dip in the higher treble which makes the sound more zippy/clear. The HD650/600 are smother up there.