[TheoS53]

... I think that if most people were as honest as you they would have to say the same....

Being honest isn't necessarily the same thing as being right. You can be totally honest whilst still being untruthful. I don't doubt that the vast majority if people who say they hear a night and day difference between device X and device Y are being totally honest in their perception of the experience. But I agree that I too wish people would conduct more blind test for themselves in order to verify if their experiences have any basis in objective reality.

 

[Mike F]

I totally agree with you. I was just making the point, as I'm sure you realise, that most people would not be able to reliably distinguish between various amps (at a similar level) on a blind test, and I think the fact that Kammerat Rebekka is honest about that is commendable.

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

So you DO hear a difference between amps. I think you're just saying that you don't hear relatively subtle differences on a blind test, and I think that if most people were as honest as you they would have to say the same. However, one can learn to listen for and hear the subtle differences which exit between different pieces of audio gear. It's just a matter of ear training actually. Whether that's a good thing for the average person is questionable - people end up spending huge amounts of money chasing subtle improvements which in the end, at some level, are only small differences in presentation rather than anything that can be described as technically, let alone objectively, better. Your'e much better off just enjoying music from your HD650's plugged into your old Pioneer receiver. Enjoy the music!

Of course I hear differences between tubes and ss

You’re right in that people need to know where exactly to look for differences...plus they need to be playing the right kind of music in order to have the best shot at spotting the pidgeon.
I’ve attended quite a few blindtests plus had a couple of friends set up some in my apartment so as I was free to switch back n forth as much as I pleased.
All in the name of finding out how deep the rabbithole goes.

Personally I’ve found that all digital players and amps sound the same...though not if they’re bearing tubes

 

[Mike F]

Of course I hear differences between tubes and ss

You’re right in that people need to know where exactly to look for differences...plus they need to be playing the right kind of music in order to have the best shot at spotting the pidgeon.
I’ve attended quite a few blindtests plus had a couple of friends set up some in my apartment so as I was free to switch back n forth as much as I pleased.
All in the name of finding out how deep the rabbithole goes.

Personally I’ve found that all digital players and amps sound the same...though not if they’re bearing tubes

Good stuff! I wish more people did the same. And I agree with you about tubes....... not my thing either!

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

Hey me too! I wish that folks in general were more open to these matters.
The way audio is going at the moment is just madness imho in that it more than anything is based on hierarchy ie the more money you spend the more sq you get...which is plain wrong.
People throw money at shiny boxes with aweinspiring numbers attached to them yet completely neglect the fact that our ears haven’t been upgraded the last thousands of years. We don’t hear paper or measurements but music.

 

[Ichos]

@DavidA
The amp that I was using when I had the HD650 at my possession was the Valhalla 2.
I have also used them for a period of time with Burson Soloist , V200 , G109A , Dr.Dac 3 , Gustard H10 , Teac UD503.

The review of HD660s was mostly done with mjolnir 2 + Gumby , Fiio Q5 , Fiio X5 iii.
I think that they scale quite good especially with better dac and lesser with amps as you can very easily hit end game with amps.

 

[DavidA]

Hey me too! I wish that folks in general were more open to these matters.
The way audio is going at the moment is just madness imho in that it more than anything is based on hierarchy ie the more money you spend the more sq you get...which is plain wrong.
People throw money at shiny boxes with aweinspiring numbers attached to them yet completely neglect the fact that our ears haven’t been upgraded the last thousands of years. We don’t hear paper or measurements but music.

agree with you about the madness and escalating cost of audio gear and also the point that expensive doesn't always mean better. I'm not much for looking at graphs / measurements either since the only thing that matters is what I hear (and my GF since she loves music and has her own headphones: HD700, HD800S and Atticus, to her all the HD6 series are boring and lacking LOL).

@Ichos, I tried a friends Valhalla2 for a few months and its one of the few tube amps that didn't respond to tube rolling and it was a bit on the lean/dry side to me with the headphones I tried them with. I also felt that the output impedance of the Valhalla2 is too low for higher impedance headphones (300ohms and higher) but at the same time too high for low impedance headphones (most planars). I liked the G109, Gustard H10 and UD503, heard them all and they are quite good IMO. As for the HD660S, I and my friend who owns them didn't feel that they scale much in comparison to the HD650, amps tried: Elise, MicroZOTL2, EC ZDS, DarkStar, Icon HP-8 mk2, HA501 and MHA-100. Agree with you that the HD660S does sound great with lesser gear like phones (Galaxy S8, V30, and iPhone 6S) and cheaper DAPs (Fiio X1, Sandisk clip and old Sony mini-disk player).

 

[westsounds]

As for me, I believe I’ve finally found my “bassier 650”, in a different can entirely, so I’m happy... And I’m also keeping at least one 650 for the foreseeable future.

Please, what were they?

 

[Ichos]

@DavidA - I agree with you that the Valhalla 2 is on the lean - bright side and doesn't respond very well to tube rolling but with the plus
that it's technical abilities are on the ss camp which is good.
I like every lake people - vioelectric gear i have herd but i find them overpriced (well at least they are made in Germany) and didn't care about the Teac - 503.
I found the HD660s to sound great from the Fiio Q5 balanced and if i was let's say for a reason forced to sell all my gear i could very easily be happy with that combo!

 

[DavidA]

Most of the Teac gear (amps/DACs) that I've tried or own have been pretty solid performing, curious to know what you didn't like about the 503? If I was forced to sell all my gear and could only keep one headphone and one DAP then it would a hard choice between HD700 or Ypsilon R1 and a Fiio X3 DAP, none of the HD6 series would even be considered since I find them a bit limited for the wide range of genres that I listen to while the HD700 and Ypsilon R1 are really good "jack of all trades" IMO.

 

[Ichos]

Let's not elaborate a lot as this is as you know a matter of personal taste.
I found the Teac to be quite colored , slow , warmish without great detail , proper placement , imaging etc.
Not my cup of tea and surely not the perfect match for classical music which is the only genre I listen.

I have heard the HD700 only once with Fiio X7 at a meeting so I don't have an opinion.
What do you think about the much discussed treble problems?

 

[DavidA]

Let's not elaborate a lot as this is as you know a matter of personal taste.
I found the Teac to be quite colored , slow , warmish without great detail , proper placement , imaging etc.
Not my cup of tea and surely not the perfect match for classical music which is the only genre I listen.

I have heard the HD700 only once with Fiio X7 at a meeting so I don't have an opinion.
What do you think about the much discussed treble problems?

The HA501 was one of the few SS amps that I actually felt worked with my HD800, T1gen1 and HE560, all slightly bright headphones and I've found that most Teac gear is either neutral or slightly on the warm side and the 503 that I borrowed a few times from a friend was even warmer but for the three headphones above its a pretty good match IMO. I didn't notice it being slow lacking in details, imaging but it was a way too warm for the HD650 and SRH1840.

The HD700 is such a polarizing headphone but for me, my GF and most of our friends the treble peak is not an issue and for classical a much better choice over any of the HD6 series due to the better sound stage, imaging, cleaner deeper bass and more extended highs. To me the HD800 can sound weird at times with some tracks (mainly vocal centric ones), even some classical tracks since it hyper extend the sound stage too much IMO (like a quartet that sounds like they are 20ft apart rather than the few feet they actually are while the T1gen1 and HE560 are much more realistic to me in terms of sound stage.

 

[Ichos]

From the HD6 series I would obviously choose the HD660s for classical music.
I used to own T1 2nd gen but I sold it as it was too colored at the bass - midbass.
I would love to spend more time with an HD700!

 

[Sigmaaa]

David, the HD700 doesn't have deeper bass than the 6X series, it's an objective thing, not an opinion, and I haven't heard people saying it by now. What it has, though, it's a huge midbass hump, bigger than all of the HD6x series and amplified by the huge midrange dip. It sounds like listening to sticks banging on an empty wooden barrel. In fact, all I could hear with it on some tracks was midbass and lower treble. On some albums were decent, but those had very little midbass and lower treble, so the hd700 didn't have what to amplify.

 

[Kammerat Rebekka]

Deleted.
Brain fart...