[donlin]

Absolutely, it's all about the taste and preference and value for the money on individual basis. I don't have to defend Tyll, but he always does a great job stating his taste and preference. He didn't say HD660S is bad but the scale-ability/resolution didn't meet their predecessors - so he covered the value for the money as well in my opinion?

People can and will disagree with Tyll's opinions which is only natural and healthy, but negative personal attacks just because he doesn't like their shiny new toy? Saying things like he's old, his ears are old, etc. That's the reason I stated I like him because I actually believe there is a great value in having a reviewer like him who says what he really thinks. Speaking of industry - some companies want nothing but to rip you off. Some companies doesn't even have a qualified engineer but everything is OEM. Some companies merely put a revised part by OEM and paint in a new color and claim as if they did years of R&D. Most progress/R&D in the audio industry is not made by those brands we know, but actually by OEM companies most of us never heard of. But, when one of the industry's leading company puts out a successor to one of the most iconic line up which was adored so much by the community for years, but if their efforts seems half baked. I'm glad we have a reviewer like Tyll who does not side up with the manufacturer who puts money on his table - but rather speak frankly and loudly of what he really thinks.

Very nicely said.

 

[Rob80b]

I am a little puzzled that Tyll calls hd700 bright and screechy, while he used to recommend hd800 (non s model).

I've also been totally perplexed by this comment and Tyll does keep making reference to “characteristic smoothness” which he notes the 660 is lacking, so yes if ones has a penchant smmmoooothhhnesss I can see maybe not appreciating the developments implemented and developed by Sennheiser in the HD700 and I guess somewhat the 660s (which I’m still waiting on).

But on the other hand to quote myself...

Was listening to Kathleen Battle's album "Grace" this morning on with HD700s and if there was to be any grain to be heard in the treble this recording would have revealed it, but the the extension and purity of her voice hitting those high extended notes was just silky smooth and sublime.

I’ve been in this hobby for long time and yes I have my own personal preferences but as I posted many times before the HD700 was and is IMHO a much-needed refreshing advancement in personal headphone listening and after a few years use I can never recall them ever being “bright and screechy”… they wouldn’t have lasted a day in my roster if so.

All this is fine but it almost comes across as if he regretted ever having listened to the 700s and some of that appears to have rubbed off onto the 660s, all of which the minions are happy to oblige…

The reality... contrary to perceived popular opinion is that the positive reviews on the HD700 way out number the negative and so far this also appears to follow suite with the 660s.

So yes the overall review is a bit perplexing but Tyll does say “not a bad headphone by any stretch” ….just not a legend.

So ...the king is dead long live the king….? : )


Ps…What if I don’t like the 660s when they arrive : (


Re: HD700 review "Nice addition to the Senn line up." (scroll down)

https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/sennheiser-hd-700-headphone.13803/reviews?page=2

 

[pietcux]

Absolutely, it's all about the taste and preference and value for the money on individual basis. I don't have to defend Tyll, but he always does a great job stating his taste and preference. He didn't say HD660S is bad but the scale-ability/resolution didn't meet their predecessors - so he covered the value for the money as well in my opinion?

People can and will disagree with Tyll's opinions which is only natural and healthy, but negative personal attacks just because he doesn't like their shiny new toy? Saying things like he's old, his ears are old, etc. That's the reason I stated I like him because I actually believe there is a great value in having a reviewer like him who says what he really thinks. Speaking of industry - some companies want nothing but to rip you off. Some companies doesn't even have a qualified engineer but everything is OEM. Some companies merely put a revised part by OEM and paint in a new color and claim as if they did years of R&D. Most progress/R&D in the audio industry is not made by those brands we know, but actually by OEM companies most of us never heard of. But, when one of the industry's leading company puts out a successor to one of the most iconic line up which was adored so much by the community for years, but if their efforts seem half baked. I'm glad we have a reviewer like Tyll who does not side up with the manufacturer who puts money on his table - but rather speak frankly and loudly of what he really thinks.

Yes, that is ok for me.

 

[Audioholic123]

I must admit, i'm not a fan of Tyll Hertsens. I do believe that he tries to sway people towards certain headphones/brands.
Also, in the video that someone posted earlier in this thread, I thought Tyll was really struggling to convey his thoughts..
I think he needs to take a break from this hobby.

 

[Odin412]

I am yet to hear a bad hp from a quality manufacturer.

That would depend on your preferences. For example, I can't stand the HD800, which most reviewers seem to adore. To me, listening to the HD800 is like being poked in the ears with white-hot metal rods. Of course, if you like bright-sounding equipment you'll love the HD800. I respect Tyll for his opinions on the HD 660S - it's not easy to call someone's baby ugly. I plan to listen to it at the earliest opportunity to make up my own mind. YMMV, as always.

 

[Rob80b]

............To me, listening to the HD800 is like being poked in the ears with white-hot metal rods. Of course, if you like bright-sounding equipment you'll love the HD800..........

Maybe a bit OT but these comments kill me...lol....but I'm sure you jest...at least I hope so...if not could you please point me into the direction of some music that pokes like "white-hot metal rods" into thy ears...especially on the HD800s.

 

[amartignano]

That would depend on your preferences. For example, I can't stand the HD800, which most reviewers seem to adore. To me, listening to the HD800 is like being poked in the ears with white-hot metal rods. Of course, if you like bright-sounding equipment you'll love the HD800. I respect Tyll for his opinions on the HD 660S - it's not easy to call someone's baby ugly. I plan to listen to it at the earliest opportunity to make up my own mind. YMMV, as always.

Hd800 is a very airy and open headphone for sure, but I begin to have a theory about this excessive bright and light sound perceived, that has links with the cups height and sealing on the head. The bass perception in the hd800 and 800s changes sensibly in my opinion.

 

[pietcux]

Hd800 is a very airy and open headphone for sure, but I begin to have a theory about this excessive bright and light sound perceived, that has links with the cups height and sealing on the head. The bass perception in the hd800 and 800s changes sensibly in my opinion.

Don't try to understand what's not existing. I had both the HD700 and the HD800 for some months. It must be music related.

 

[Odin412]

Maybe a bit OT but these comments kill me...lol....but I'm sure you jest...at least I hope so...if not could you please point me into the direction of some music that pokes like "white-hot metal rods" into thy ears...especially on the HD800s.

You mean I'm exaggerating? At Head-Fi? Impossible! Here's the thing: When I listen to the HD800 using well-recorded classical and jazz tracks (typical audiophile demo tracks, in other words) it sounds outstanding: Open, airy, transparent with a huge soundstage. However, I happen to like a lot of music that is only available in let's say less-than-perfect recordings, and that's being kind. If I try to listen to for example Florence and the Machine on the HD800 I find the treble almost physically painful to listen to. Granted, I'm very treble-sensitive so most other folks will probably have a less extreme reaction, but my main point is that the HD800 is quite un-forgiving of poor recordings, which to my ears is an unacceptable flaw.

Hd800 is a very airy and open headphone for sure, but I begin to have a theory about this excessive bright and light sound perceived, that has links with the cups height and sealing on the head. The bass perception in the hd800 and 800s changes sensibly in my opinion.

This is an interesting observation - I'll have to try at the next CanJam. The HD800 is one of the most comfortable headphones that I've ever tried.

 

[amartignano]

Don't try to understand what's not existing. I had both the HD700 and the HD800 for some months. It must be music related.

Edited, misunderstanding for erroneous quoting of my post.

 

[amartignano]

You mean I'm exaggerating? At Head-Fi? Impossible! Here's the thing: When I listen to the HD800 using well-recorded classical and jazz tracks (typical audiophile demo tracks, in other words) it sounds outstanding: Open, airy, transparent with a huge soundstage. However, I happen to like a lot of music that is only available in let's say less-than-perfect recordings, and that's being kind. If I try to listen to for example Florence and the Machine on the HD800 I find the treble almost physically painful to listen to. Granted, I'm very treble-sensitive so most other folks will probably have a less extreme reaction, but my main point is that the HD800 is quite un-forgiving of poor recordings, which to my ears is an unacceptable flaw.



This is an interesting observation - I'll have to try at the next CanJam. The HD800 is one of the most comfortable headphones that I've ever tried.

It seems to me that bass extends and rumbles more but with cups properly positioned, as I probably put them too low for perceived more comfort and better positioned headstage.

 

[Rob80b]

You mean I'm exaggerating? At Head-Fi? Impossible! .......
If I try to listen to for example Florence and the Machine on the HD800 I find the treble almost physically painful to listen to. Granted, I'm very treble-sensitive so most other folks will probably have a less extreme reaction, but my main point is that the HD800 is quite un-forgiving of poor recordings, which to my ears is an unacceptable flaw.

That's an explanation I can comprehend....thank you.... funny I was thinking more in the line of something like Rammstein which for me sounded great on the 700s..... yes the 800 and the 700 for that matter are not kind to poor recordings, like many headphone except of course the 600/650s. : )

ps. I'll give Florence and the Machine a spin...err I mean a stream!

edit:
Just a quick couple of tunes off Spotify but with more than a few decades of recording under my belt I can tell right off that her voice would definitely be problematic if improperly recorded…not too sure what they’re using for a mic on some of the recordings for voice but it’s not working…plus the EQ is way off, too much in the high-end, may be mediocre dacs in the recording stream, could be a combination of many things....I'd have to talk to the cook but even for “me” some tracks were… pain-full to listen to. : (

Now this was off my iphone with the Sennheiser ie800s but I’m not too sure any head-set, outside the 650 could salvage this… so in this regard I can totally see your point.

I’ve only taken a pedestrian listen… quite often the blame gets applied incorrectly…in this case I would definitely blame the medium….can’t say the 660s would fair any better.


Just to quote a few comments from a quick search on the same…and just from one site....

“I was looking forward to this release, but what a letdown ...
The mastering engineers slaughtered this great release.”

“Hopefully the vinyl will sound better. The vinyl of Lungs was still a bit much, but a bit easier on the ears IMO.”

“Disappointed to read about the sound quality”

 

[amartignano]

About bass variation with cup position: Senn Hd800S seems to be able to give variations up to 10 dB on the bass:

While hd660s seems less depending:

 

[franz12]

That's an explanation I can comprehend....thank you.... funny I was thinking more in the line of something like Rammstein which for me sounded great on the 700s..... yes the 800 and the 700 for that matter are not kind to poor recordings, like many headphone except of course the 600/650s. : )

ps. I'll give Florence and the Machine a spin...err I mean a stream!

edit:
Just a quick couple of tunes off Spotify but with more than a few decades of recording under my belt I can tell right off that her voice would definitely be problematic if improperly recorded…not too sure what they’re using for a mic on some of the recordings for voice but it’s not working…plus the EQ is way off, too much in the high-end, may be mediocre dacs in the recording stream, could be a combination of many things....I'd have to talk to the cook but even for “me” some tracks were… pain-full to listen to. : (

Now this was off my iphone with the Sennheiser ie800s but I’m not too sure any head-set, outside the 650 could salvage this… so in this regard I can totally see your point.

I’ve only taken a pedestrian listen… quite often the blame gets applied incorrectly…in this case I would definitely blame the medium….can’t say the 660s would fair any better.


Just to quote a few comments from a quick search on the same…and just from one site....

“I was looking forward to this release, but what a letdown ...
The mastering engineers slaughtered this great release.”

“Hopefully the vinyl will sound better. The vinyl of Lungs was still a bit much, but a bit easier on the ears IMO.”

“Disappointed to read about the sound quality”

I agree with this. Hd800s outperforms on classical, which in general well mastered. But I happened to love poorly recorded albums. Listening those through hd800s was mixed experiences, sometimes fiercing and painful. I appreciate wide soundstage and clarity hd800s can comfortably deliver. But unforgiving nature together with thin sounding was a deal breaker for me.

 

[donlin]

In case anyone is interested, there is a brand new thread and head-fi tv episode about the new massdrop sennheiser hd58x jubilee. In the discussion under the first post as well as the comments on youtube there are some interesting comments regarding the 660s.