[castleofargh]

  Oh... Doh.
 
Must resist.... buying....
 
Actually I'm considering getting the TH900 which is even pricier than the HD800 but a worse headphone. The world of audio in general is a weird one.

 
 
when did price reflect the quality of a product or its sound?
if I build something, I'll factor the components price, the work time I need to make it estimating my hourly salary or my employees salary, then add to that a little something for margin/benefits/problems/quality rejects/returns... the rest of my company's cost and how many I expect to be selling.
 if I were to make crap tomorrow on my own, it would still probably cost the price of a sennheiser, if only because I would be making them one by one mostly by hand from buying components in small quantities. and because I would be unsecured about how many I would sell and my future, I would probably make them cost around 1000$ a piece so that I can last a few months even if I sell very few. ^_^
 
so seeing a worst product selling for more is really not so surprising.

 

[Jeff Y]

   
 
when did price reflect the quality of a product or its sound?
if I build something, I'll factor the components price, the work time I need to make it estimating my hourly salary or my employees salary, then add to that a little something for margin/benefits/problems/quality rejects/returns... the rest of my company's cost and how many I expect to be selling.
 if I were to make crap tomorrow on my own, it would still probably cost the price of a sennheiser, if only because I would be making them one by one mostly by hand from buying components in small quantities. and because I would be unsecured about how many I would sell and my future, I would probably make them cost around 1000$ a piece so that I can last a few months even if I sell very few. ^_^
 
so seeing a worst product selling for more is really not so surprising.

It's kind of unfortunate because if everyone was into audio I imagine that the 650 would cost only $200 or so.
Well, I figured it out within a week from the first day I found about audio... it happens.

 
No logic to hi-end audio.
There you go. No need to banter about the 800 any longer.
 
I thought this was the 650 thread? 

Yes indeed. The talk kinda went off topic while comparing the 800 to the 650. Let's move on I guess. I didn't realize I was dragging on the topic.

 

[Solrighal]

If someone who'd never heard even semi-decent headphones previously was to walk into a shop & listen to the Q701 and then the HD 650 I'd bet good money they'd walk out with the AKG.
 
Then they'd be back in a fortninght demanding a refund.

 

[Jeff Y]

  If someone who'd never heard even semi-decent headphones previously was to walk into a shop & listen to the Q701 and then the HD 650 I'd bet good money they'd walk out with the AKG.
 
Then they'd be back in a fortninght demanding a refund.

The opposite happened to me. First headphones (other than Bose which were the only ones I used before that) (yes embarrassing to admit I know, but hey, I'm only 17) I put on other than Bose or Beats were the HD650s. Still remains my favourite. I tried the AKGs that day as well and didn't like them and continues to do so.
 
Wonder when companies figure out that they should make their next headphones follow the overall sound sig. of the 650 and add detail and openness of the 800 to it. I don't need anything more than that... or do I?

 

[Charliemotta]

Maybe the HD 700.    ♫

 

[mikoss]

I don't see the problem with comparing the 650's to other headphones in this thread.

 

[Jeff Y]

  Maybe the HD 700.    ♫

Oh no. HD700? First time I listened to those my thoughts: Hmmm.... what the hell was Sennheiser aiming for here? Wannabe HD800 that's got a weird coloration and overall less of the HD800 goodness? Oh nevermind I'll just put these back where I found them.
 

I don't see the problem with comparing the 650's to other headphones in this thread.

I did kinda take it away from the 650 by talking about my hyperacusis, AKGs, and whatnot but I've seen threads get completely derailed so meh.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

I don't see the problem with comparing the 650's to other headphones in this thread.

the problem is that the gist of all these comparisons are the same old conclusions: No HP does it all. etc etc

 

[Jeff Y]

 
the problem is that the gist of all these comparisons are the same old conclusions: No HP does it all. etc etc

Not everyone has arrived to that conclusion though. Also, we're all trying to find our most ideal headphone, not the do-it-all.

 

[Solrighal]

  The opposite happened to me. First headphones (other than Bose which were the only ones I used before that) (yes embarrassing to admit I know, but hey, I'm only 17) I put on other than Bose or Beats were the HD650s. Still remains my favourite. I tried the AKGs that day as well and didn't like them and continues to do so.
 
Wonder when companies figure out that they should make their next headphones follow the overall sound sig. of the 650 and add detail and openness of the 800 to it. I don't need anything more than that... or do I?

 
Yeah but my point remains. In a showroom environment the HD 650's might easily be perceived as lacking in detail & drive whereas other lesser headphones would appear to have bags of detail.
 
Anyway, what I'm reading about the Nighthawk's is intrigueing. Too expensive for me but they do seem to have a somewhat similar sound.

 

[Jeff Y]

   
Yeah but my point remains. In a showroom environment the HD 650's might easily be perceived as lacking in detail & drive whereas other lesser headphones would appear to have bags of detail.
 
Anyway, what I'm reading about the Nighthawk's is intrigueing. Too expensive for me but they do seem to have a somewhat similar sound.

Not sure if it was the production version but I listened to them and they're really not HD650s IMO. They're kinda of a darker and more forward Phillips X2 which I dislike.

 

[DavidA]

  Not everyone has arrived to that conclusion though. Also, we're all trying to find our most ideal headphone, not the do-it-all.

How about trying to find a group of 3-5 headphones that work great with what ever music you listen to?  Or indoors and outdoors or on the go?   Like; HD-800 for classical, HD-650 for female vocals, HE-560 for jazz, etc.  Probably why I've been keeping most of the headphones that I've bought.

 

[Jeff Y]

 
How about trying to find a group of 3-5 headphones that work great with what ever music you listen to?  Or indoors and outdoors or on the go?   Like; HD-800 for classical, HD-650 for female vocals, HE-560 for jazz, etc.  Probably why I've been keeping most of the headphones that I've bought.

Yes I am in the exact process of doing the same thing.
I keep most of the headphones I bought too for such reasons. All I try to do is to try to rule out the ones I do not like (personal preferences ofc).
Only thing that stops me from buying 5-10 headphone is the lack of funds because of my young age.
But one day...
Cheers.

 

[bracko]

 
the problem is that the gist of all these comparisons are the same old conclusions: No HP does it all. etc etc

Agreed. Also our ears are different and we cannot make any definitive and objective conclusions by making comparisons. We try to use our memory when comparing headphone gear and that is actually completely impossible. Our reference framework changes all the time. When I heard HE-500 a couple of years ago I absolutely loved them. When I got my 400i last week I thought they sounded great but HE-500 still sounded better in my memory. Yesterday I borrowed a pair of HE-500 from a friend to compare them and guess what... they don't sound that different to 400i at all and definitely not "better".
 
Many times it is not the sound quality we are judging but emotions related to what we see, touch, what we expect regarding to the price paid etc. We expect things and many times they become true. After hearing so many high-end headphones and reading so many opinions about them on these forums I sometimes wonder if we actually listen to same stuff. Of course we do but we seem to hear different things depending on what we are looking for and concentrating at (at that particular moment).

 

[Mark Up]

I think 1-2 db gentle boost above 10 khz and 3 db boost peaking at 20 hz (starting at 40 hz) would make the HD650 ideal, maybe better than the Audeze LCD-2 that I liked better than any other Audeze or HiFiMan for that matter (even the newer HE-1000) and would own if not for the weight mainly (and to a lesser degree their price). If they did this and called it the HD675, I'd buy it. Yes, we can do that with EQ but it is best to get EQ changes with mechanical design, not with EQ after, which can alter the phase info.