[Ancipital]

I've heard this many times...most people don't really know what 800s can do because they haven't heard them driven properly. Its a good idea not to come to any conclusion about that HP until you find an amp they really gel with. Its Sennheiser's flagship for a reason. Best to hold on to it and try and find an amp they work well with. As I said, Jot is supposed to be just that.

 
Arguably, it's not their flagship any more- there's more than one model in their line above the HD800.

 

[ColtMrFire]

Flagship for most practical purposes. Orpheus and the underlings are more luxury items most people aren't going to buy. It doesn't really change my point.

 

[Ancipital]

Flagship for most practical purposes. Orpheus and the underlings are more luxury items most people aren't going to buy. It doesn't really change my point.

 
HD800S? Surprisingly popular.

 

[cthomas]

Yeah you're probably right. I was completely surprised hearing the 650s on 2 different amps. I went to a DJ store who had the 650's yesterday and heard them through an Allen and Heath DJ mixer, it was amazing. Then tried the Apogee Groove with the 650, was unimpressed. Thinking I might take the trip again but with my 800's, see what they sound like.

 

[Ancipital]

Yeah you're probably right. I was completely surprised hearing the 650s on 2 different amps. I went to a DJ store who had the 650's yesterday and heard them through an Allen and Heath DJ mixer, it was amazing. Then tried the Apogee Groove with the 650, was unimpressed. Thinking I might take the trip again but with my 800's, see what they sound like.

 
Hah, I have a couple of A+H DJ mixers, never thought to plug my HD650 into them. I'd be amazed if sounded anywhere near as good as my Jot, even though the A+H headphone sections tend to go up to "11".
 
That said, my Xone 92 rotary has developed a recurring fault, so unless I can find someone who wants to fix it and give it a good home, I'm going to end up skipping it (no matter how much I love the filters and LFO).

 

[cthomas]

Hah, I have a couple of A+H DJ mixers, never thought to plug my HD650 into them. I'd be amazed if sounded anywhere near as good as my Jot, even though the A+H headphone sections tend to go up to "11".

That said, my Xone 92 rotary has developed a recurring fault, so unless I can find someone who wants to fix it and give it a good home, I'm going to end up skipping it (no matter how much I love the filters and LFO).

Yeah I'm quite sure it was an xone 92. Is it still working? Would like to hear how it compares to the Jot. Might give me an idea of what to expect

 

[Ancipital]

Yeah I'm quite sure it was an xone 92. Is it still working? Would like to hear how it compares to the Jot. Might give me an idea of what to expect

 
It is, but it has feedback on a channel. If I can take that channel out of routing, I will give it a go, though. It spends most of its time hooked up to a Serato setup, but I am sure I could hook it up to my Mimby instead, just to even things out a bit. It lives about two meters away from my Jotenheim, and I still have the SE cable for my HD650 

 
(If anyone in the UK wants a Xone 92 rotary with some funny feedback fault, fixed once, but annoying returned, probably on another channel, they can always drop me a PM. I'm sure the price would be sensible- though you'd have to pay shipping. Comes with an aluminium flight case!)

 

[cthomas]

Cool, only if it's not too much trouble.

 

[GearMe]

Would tubes only be good for HD800's though? Was thinking of the Lyr 2 since its SS and tube. Still confused to how you can switch between the 2.

Yeah, I decided to go the multiple amp route...having an OTL amp for my high impedance headphones and SS for the rest. If you envision getting some more of these types of cans, then an OTL amp may be a good investment for you. Otherwise, the Lyr may be a better play. My personal thought was I'd rather get the Valhalla 2 and then upgrade my SS amp...was thinking Asgard 2 prior to the Jot being released; probably will go with Jot now


FWIW...don't have much Hip-Hop / Electronic but took the time to listen to several songs from The E.N.D. by The Black Eyed Peas with the HD800's and the HD650's on both the UDA-1 and the Mimby/Vahalla 2.

A few observations:
- Not a fair fight between the Sony vs the Schiit...that said, I paid $200 for a new UDA-1 on Woot vs $950 for the Mimby/Vahalla 2 stack...sometimes, you get what you pay for.
- The Black Eyed Peas on the HD800's / Schiit stack sound pretty darn good to my ears -- enough bass, etc....so do the 650's! On the UDA-1...Meh.
- I wouldn't spend any time with the HD800's on the UDA-1 (and haven't) but it's not what I bought it for.
- TBH, the Sony is a solid, swiss army knife for a computer desktop system including DSD and the ability to drive speakers. Jack of all trades; Master of none.

A question/consideration:
- If the SE846's (known to be bass heavy) are your preferred signature and the HD800's sound 'thin/harsh no bass etc etc', why don't you sell the Senn's and get cans closer to SE846's signature?

Below is an FR graph with the 650's, SE846's, SRH1540's, and HP50's. As an example, the SRH1540's seem to come fairly close to the SE846's and hopefully share some Shure house sound similarities (innerfidelity review here). Never heard them but they appear to have a sound signature quite different from the Senn's. Another option would be NAD HP50's (innerfidelity). Just two of many options...

 

[ColtMrFire]

The 800s are capable of bass. If they are "bright and thin" it is the amp. I personally don't think he should even consider selling the 800s until he's heard them on a proper amp. Its like wanting to sell a new Porsche because you've only driven it in a parking lot. That said, the Valhalla 2 is not very plentiful in the bass department. Its one of the reasons I sold mine. But it is excellent in every other area (tone, timbre, soundstage, air, transients, etc)

 

[BarDash]

Hey guys, hoping for some advice... Currently own the HD800's and the only amp/DAC I own is the Sony UDA-1. Mist of my music (except for classical or jazz) sounds thin/harsh no bass etc etc. Is the jot solving these problems with the 800 or should I just sell them and buy a hd650?

Cheers.

HD800s sounds nothing like that to me... probably the amp. Personally I really enjoy the Jot balanced with those HP's.

 

[cthomas]

Yeah, I decided to go the multiple amp route...having an OTL amp for my high impedance headphones and SS for the rest. If you envision getting some more of these types of cans, then an OTL amp may be a good investment for you. Otherwise, the Lyr may be a better play. My personal thought was I'd rather get the Valhalla 2 and then upgrade my SS amp...was thinking Asgard 2 prior to the Jot being released; probably will go with Jot now


FWIW...don't have much Hip-Hop / Electronic but took the time to listen to several songs from The E.N.D. by The Black Eyed Peas with the HD800's and the HD650's on both the UDA-1 and the Mimby/Vahalla 2.

A few observations:
- Not a fair fight between the Sony vs the Schiit...that said, I paid $200 for a new UDA-1 on Woot vs $950 for the Mimby/Vahalla 2 stack...sometimes, you get what you pay for.
- The Black Eyed Peas on the HD800's / Schiit stack sound pretty darn good to my ears -- enough bass, etc....so do the 650's! On the UDA-1...Meh.
- I wouldn't spend any time with the HD800's on the UDA-1 (and haven't) but it's not what I bought it for.
- TBH, the Sony is a solid, swiss army knife for a computer desktop system including DSD and the ability to drive speakers. Jack of all trades; Master of none.

A question/consideration:
- If the SE846's (known to be bass heavy) are your preferred signature and the HD800's sound 'thin/harsh no bass etc etc', why don't you sell the Senn's and get cans closer to SE846's signature?

Below is an FR graph with the 650's, SE846's, SRH1540's, and HP50's. As an example, the SRH1540's seem to come fairly close to the SE846's and hopefully share some Shure house sound similarities (innerfidelity review here). Never heard them but they appear to have a sound signature quite different from the Senn's. Another option would be NAD HP50's (innerfidelity). Just two of many options...

Wow! Thanks so much for that I didn't realise anyone used the uda-1 but me. I bought it before I knew anything about amps and dacs and am (was) a bit of a Sony fan-boy. I paid close to full price for the Sony too, $750 AUD. I could've had something so much better for that price now I realise. One thing I really like about the uda is it has a remote so I can lay back with my logitech harmony remote and control volume with the uda and skip tracks on Audirvana without having to reach for a volume nob or use 2 remotes. It's not powerful enough to power my speakers so I just use some rca's to my receiver from the uda. But I also like that it has Optical in so I can hook it up to my PS4 to watch movies. So it has a few benefits over the jot, but I guess it's stuff I could go without since the jot would schiit all over the uda in the amp department.

I used to own the TH-X00 before the HD800's. They were my first full size cans I'd ever bought, I'd always been into iem's. They sounded ok but the bass was a bit too much and I thought they lacked detail compared to the SE846's, so I couldn't see the point in owning them since the SE846's were more comfortable. And the Fostex didn't have much soundstage and I expected full size HP's to have decent soundstage.

Then I auditioned the HD800's but the guy only had classic music but the soundstage and clarity blew me away so I bought them, but now 6 months later I realise (at least with the uda) that that's all they're good for. But I would love if they just sounded a bit fuller and bassier, if a good amp like the jot can help that then I will most likely keep them. It's just difficult to know what to do when I don't have any stores near me that have decent gear.

And I'm really not experienced enough to know what graphs really show. I feel like most people on these types of forums have gone to headphone college or something

I think I'll just sell the uda, buy the jot and go and try as many HP's as I can within a 100km radius. Providing I decide not to keep the 800's. But basically something with accurate bass and decent soundstage would be my preferred signature. And nothing too crazy expensive... I was maybe considering the Elear but then people mention they are very close in performance to the 650, and in Australia the 650 is around 1/4 the price of the Elear. This hobby is seriously becoming a headache if you can't audition everything at once. My only real solution... Go for a 9 hour drive to Sydney

 

[cthomas]

The 800s are capable of bass. If they are "bright and thin" it is the amp. I personally don't think he should even consider selling the 800s until he's heard them on a proper amp. Its like wanting to sell a new Porsche because you've only driven it in a parking lot. That said, the Valhalla 2 is not very plentiful in the bass department. Its one of the reasons I sold mine. But it is excellent in every other area (tone, timbre, soundstage, air, transients, etc)

It's weird because some songs have decent bass when I don't expect it and vice versa.

 

[cthomas]

HD800s sounds nothing like that to me... probably the amp. Personally I really enjoy the Jot balanced with those HP's.

I know I'm probably getting ahead of myself here... But are expensive cables needed for balanced?

 

[ColtMrFire]

No.