[rtaylor76]

The point where you're adding a sub for headphones seems like the point where you might be asking if you should just use speakers... But that's just me.

On another note, does anyone find that M on the Modi picture a bit odd? It's not been seen anywhere else, and perhaps could be a deliberate misdirection. Why is it on top of the most where it's never been before? Don't most folks stack Magni/Modi, Modi on bottom? Why the M after the Modi on the front? Add to thatJasons Elvis comment... Maybe I'm looking too much into it, but something doesn't add up...

If so. That would be one helluva Photoshop job. The M is in a screwed angle on all three axis'. Then thre is the back screen and serial number sticker, which look very true to me. And besides, you really think he'd do something like that just to goose us? That would be bad press and a mean joke. It's not April 1st.

My guess is that it was a Word Press error. Someone must have hit "Publish"

 

[Letmebefrank]

Yeah that would be really hard to edit, and judging by how bad the vali 2 pictures are on the Schiit site, they don't have a PS expert on hand. Also I believe the other more expensive schiit dacs have the S logo on top, why not an M for the modi multibit? It's pretty insane to have MB in that little cheap modi so why not show it off?

 

[MothAudio]

 

 

[spkalka]

The point where you're adding a sub for headphones seems like the point where you might be asking if you should just use speakers... But that's just me.

 
Is that so? I thought one of the main selling points of high end headphones is that they reproduce an experience as true to live music as possible at a fraction of the cost of a comparable speaker system. 
 
There are audiophiles living in high rise buildings, and my neighbors do not complain about the occasional sub rumble, they do complain about speakers playing at reference levels. While headphones can reproduce bass, no headphone will cause reverberations of the music in your body. One of the main reasons live music sounds better, is that you not only hear the music, but you feel the music.

 

[earnmyturns]

  I wonder what effect relative humidity and temperature has on sound and whether it would be worth inventing a device to compensate for these factors.
 
EDIT: http://www.rane.com/pdf/eespeed.pdf
 

Physics, meet psychoacoustics. Key quote (near the end): "[...] if we could hear phase shift, we would go absolutely nuts in everyday life. Every time a reflected version of a sound adds to the direct sound, the phase shifts are enormous, and it happens in abundance in all rooms, even carrying on a conversation across a table."

 

[spkalka]

This is interesting,

  Physics, meet psychoacoustics. Key quote (near the end): "[...] if we could hear phase shift, we would go absolutely nuts in everyday life. Every time a reflected version of a sound adds to the direct sound, the phase shifts are enormous, and it happens in abundance in all rooms, even carrying on a conversation across a table."

Very interesting. There seems to be varying opinions in regard to that matter. 
 
"Just a 10% change in relative humidity, from 10 to 20% for instance, at a frequency of 12.5 kHz results in an additional 35 dB per 1000 ft (300 m) of absorption. 1000 ft (300 m) may seem excessive, but that is an additional 3.5 dB per 100 ft (30 m), which could alter the acoustic response significantly. It could be the difference between two identical concerts, where one sparkles and has more brilliance than the other. Yet the same orchestra performed them in the same hall with the same exuberance and skill-only the weather was different."
 
I believe that psychoacoustics do play a significant role, since there are people buying $600 power cords and RCA interconnects. Or on the other hand, maybe there are factors that while improbable they might still improve the audible experience. *Cough*WYRD*Cough*
 
 

 

[ThePianoMan]

Is that so? I thought one of the main selling points of high end headphones is that they reproduce an experience as true to live music as possible at a fraction of the cost of a comparable speaker system. 

There are audiophiles living in high rise buildings, and my neighbors do not complain about the occasional sub rumble, they do complain about speakers playing at reference levels. While headphones can reproduce bass, no headphone will cause reverberations of the music in your body. One of the main reasons live music sounds better, is that you not only hear the music, but you feel the music.

Depends on what reference levels are for you. My usual listening levels at home are what most people consider exceptionally quiet. I used to think headphones were like that, but nowadays I think of them as headphones. A different experience than speakers. I prefer speakers overall, but some really immersive stuff or mixing/mastering is better (for my mood/purpose) on headphones. Just depends.

I also don't think live music always sounds better. I've heard speakers that pressure a room playing vocal music in a way no vocalist could. Been in little clubs where stand up bass, piano and kick drums were like gut punches. Depends on where you are and what you're looking for. I actually happen to think the level of fidelity we enjoy at home with transducers is generally much higher than most "live" music. Unless you have great seats, in a great concert hall listening to carefully amplified or totally acoustic music. I get paid to play perform, record, produce, etc. does it mean I have "better" ears than anyone else? Nope. Just trained for certain things. But I do think love music isn't really comparable to recorded music. One is reproducing something that was recorded, the other is a live musical performance. From my perspective, the two things are totally different and have radically different goals and places in my life. I get what you're saying about feeling the sound, and agree that felt vibration can be an integral part of the live experience. But that's not what makes it "Better" Oregon different. It's the fact that there's mics, preamps, ADCs, DACs, DAWs, amps, and transducers that have captured and attempted to replicate a sound wave as an electrical/mechanical/digital construct.
It's like comparing the view from the top of a mountain to a digital photograph viewed on your computer screen.

Anyways, I digress.

 

[Ableza]

Actually, "reference level" is called that because it's always the same, and therefore a "reference." 
http://www.thx.com/consumer/thx-technology/thx-reference-level/

 

[earnmyturns]

Been in little clubs where stand up bass, piano and kick drums were like gut punches. Depends on where you are and what you're looking for.

Even not so little clubs, some seats close to the front at the Village Vanguard do that. Probably the most memorable session I've ever been to anywhere was with Bill Frisell, Joe Lovano, and the late Paul Motian, sitting just a few feet from them at the Vanguard. There's a freely available recording of what they were doing in those sessions.

I actually happen to think the level of fidelity we enjoy at home with transducers is generally much higher than most "live" music. Unless you have great seats, in a great concert hall listening to carefully amplified or totally acoustic music.

Yes, but what it's worth it to try to get those great seats whenever possible Like with these guys, from first-row seats at SFJAZZ recently, transcending the already superior work on their "Landmarks" album.  Myron Walden and Brian Blade especially.

 

[castleofargh]

 
This is interesting,

  Physics, meet psychoacoustics. Key quote (near the end): "[...] if we could hear phase shift, we would go absolutely nuts in everyday life. Every time a reflected version of a sound adds to the direct sound, the phase shifts are enormous, and it happens in abundance in all rooms, even carrying on a conversation across a table."

Very interesting. There seems to be varying opinions in regard to that matter. 
 
"Just a 10% change in relative humidity, from 10 to 20% for instance, at a frequency of 12.5 kHz results in an additional 35 dB per 1000 ft (300 m) of absorption. 1000 ft (300 m) may seem excessive, but that is an additional 3.5 dB per 100 ft (30 m), which could alter the acoustic response significantly. It could be the difference between two identical concerts, where one sparkles and has more brilliance than the other. Yet the same orchestra performed them in the same hall with the same exuberance and skill-only the weather was different."
 
I believe that psychoacoustics do play a significant role, since there are people buying $600 power cords and RCA interconnects. Or on the other hand, maybe there are factors that while improbable they might still improve the audible experience. *Cough*WYRD*Cough*
 
 

it's not about varying opinions, it's about how something can both be real and not matter to the listener. like our nose being brainoshopped out of everything we see. even though if we pay attention, it's there and can't be said to be of insignificant size in our field of vision. still we all see as if it wasn't there, and we really don't need a system to compensate for it. we already have that system.

 

 

[johnjen]

snip EDIT:
 
Not to hijack this discussion, but since the official product announcement is not until Monday, a little bit of a side discussion might not be all that distracting.
Did any of you gentlemen/women experiment with listening to your Ragnarok with headphones while also keeping the speaker system connected?
 
I normally run my 800's and my cheap speakers at the same time.
The bass from my 800's is not in need of any external reinforcement.
 
EDIT 2: 
 
Do any of you guys notice an improvement of sound once the Ragnarok reaches operating temperature? I know that heat is a killer of electronic components and I think a computer fan could be cleverly mounted to direct heat away from the amp. On the other hand, Mr Nelson Pass claims that his amplifiers do not sound right until the external heat sink fans reached a temperature of 50 degrees Celsius.

Thermal equilibrium is a fairly well established factor in attaining optimal SQ.
 
JJ

 

[valiant66]

   

 
 

 
See, now that's the kind of picture I was looking for last October in post #8355 - it really gives you a sense of the relative sizes of the various chassis, and there's nothing like it on the Schiit site.
 
Just by looking I can tell that where I currently have my Modi there is not enough space to step up to the next chassis size.
 
Thanks for the comparative shot!

 

[valiant66]

 

Not to hijack this discussion, but since the official product announcement is not until Monday, a little bit of a side discussion might not be all that distracting.
Did any of you gentlemen/women experiment with listening to your Ragnarok with headphones while also keeping the speaker system connected?

I felt that the added bass felt in the floor and stomach from my Cornwalls adds to the headphone experience. Do any of you run headphones with an external subwoofer?

I thought about this long ago when I first heard the reissue AKG HD414's The radio station I worked for in the 90's had a bunch of them because the owner was a huge jazz fan. Matter of fact he had the AM country radio station, but then bought and FM frequency just for jazz in the 70's - of course the FM became the country station in the 80's, but I digress.

With bright and open headphones, a sub in the room might be really cool. With some brighter Grado's perhaps? Many others I have heard have enough bass, and a sub would only add some impact, but also might muddy things up.

Sounds like a job for a buttshaker. Here's a pro-audio solution, a Parts Express bargain and a review site with installation instructions.

 

[audiojun]

There is also the subpac http://subpac.com/subpac-m2/ more expensive though.

 

[ScottFree]

  

 
 

 
See, now that's the kind of picture I was looking for last October in post #8355 - it really gives you a sense of the relative sizes of the various chassis, and there's nothing like it on the Schiit site.
 
Just by looking I can tell that where I currently have my Modi there is not enough space to step up to the next chassis size.
 
Thanks for the comparative shot!

If you click on the Specs tab on each product page it gives you the dimensions in inches and the weight of each product . You could have used that for comparison.