[Delirious Lab]

I got my Saga "Classic" and Vidar to drive me LS50's two days ago. I replaced my Denon 2100 with them. I now have all of my HDMI sources into my TV, which sends optical out to my Gumby, into my Saga. My Gumby also has a raspberry Pi 3B+ with Volumio going into the USB that pulls all my CDs ripped to FLAC off of my home server NAS. The other input on my Saga has my Mani and my U-Turn orbit on it. My Loki is between my Saga and Vidar.

Impressions so far (for those that were interested). The biggest first impression is how nice it is to be able to EQ anything in my system. I think the Loki makes the biggest difference of anything because it is actively shaping the sonic signature, and when it's on, you can't discount how big of a change that is.

My first impression when I got everything hooked up was disappointment. I was expecting to just be blown away with the differences of having a bigger power amp in my system, and I wasn't. The LS50s still sounded like LS50s. Then I cranked the Saga to 11 to try to see how much power was on tap, and it didn't blow be away either. It was louder than comfortable listening, but it didn't hurt my ears. So my first impression was disappointment.

Then I quickly told myself, I'm never going to listen to them that loud anyway, so why does it matter that the pot position for comfortable listening is 1:30-2 'o clock instead of 10 o' clock? Regardless, it hits the volume I need with more on tap, just not WAY more on tap. So it comfortably hits the volume I need and has room to spare, it just didn't meet my initial expectations. Ok, change my expectations and move on.

But the audio quality didn't change in a night and day way like I expected either. I was a little disappointed with this as well. Then I started streaming some music and making my kids dinner, and I started hearing a little bit more crispness. A little bit more detail in the treble. A little bit fuller bass. The thing that I finally noticed that I now think is the biggest change is the blackness, or space between notes so to speak. It feels like it's a lower noise floor. It's not that my Denon was noisy, but it feels like when there is a rest in the music, there's a longer falloff to quiet than there was before.

I continued to listen to streaming for a while and then switched on a record with similar results. I was becoming happier the longer I listened, and the subtleties slowly started to add up to a noticeable change. It's not a night and day difference like changing out speakers or cans. But I guess it really shouldn't be. It is a pleasant and subtle change for the better. That could be the end of my initial impressions review, but I do have three more notable tid-bits.

1. My wife's control tracks whenever I change out my audio components is a deep cut off of Adele's 21 (not sure the exact song) followed by Taylor Swift's I Did Something Bad. She stood in the middle of the room in the sweet spot with her eyes closed and absorbed Adele. She was moved by the music and said it hasn't ever sounded that good. She was also against buying new amplification, but is now a big fan of the upgrade. So she doesn't want to hear a real difference and noticed fuller bass and more detailed treble. When Dan Auerbach's Waiting on a Song record was streaming, she told me something was wrong with a speaker and to come listen. What was "wrong" was a fuzzed bass coming into the track that she has never heard before even though we have both listened to that record dozens of times.

2. While watching her stand in the middle of the room, I was sitting at the back of the room on a couch and noticed how much my living room now felt like I was in a hi-fi shop sampling some new speakers. It was the "black" between notes that I really think makes the difference. It really sounds like a very high end system with that space between notes. I have read other reviewers talk about "space between notes" but never really understood the analogy until I got the Saga/Vidar combo.

3. When I eventually switched over to TV, everything sounded so much crisper. This is the first time I've had my Gumby in the stream with my video components, and it was neat to hear how much crisper everything sounds. The newscasters voice just sounds better, it's really evident. Now this is going from an AVR to a Gumby, Saga, Loki, Vidar, so the ENTIRE signal path changed, and it's apparent. Baseball crowds in the stands sound way more detailed, the music on Jeopardy sounds better, watching Deadwood on HBOGo, I don't have to crank up the volume nearly as loud to hear the dialogue. Once again, I changed a bunch of components here, so I couldn't tell you what made the biggest impact, but my guess would be the DAC. Do I need a high end multibit DAC to watch Deadwood? Absolutely not. Does it "spark joy" to hear extra detail in the crowd at an Astro's game? Not really. I really appreciate the extra detail in music, something that has the ability to get an emotional response. If I get an emotional response from baseball, it's because someone turned a double play, not because I hear the ball go into the mitt a little crisper. So I personally wouldn't recommend dumping a bunch of money into a DAC for TV, but if you already have it in your system for music, it does make an impact (I think) in TV that is kind of neat. Just my two cents.

4. Bonus bullet. The new remote with the Saga is awesome. It is just a cold, heavy, metal slab that feels so good, and so premium. Great design!


TLDR: Saga and Vidar improved my KEF LS50s with a string of subtleties.

Thiiiiiiis. My experience was very similar (but with R300's instead of LS50's).

 

[Derrick Swart]

I'm now madly searching the intarwebs to see if that is a Zappa quote.[/QUOTE]

'A wise man once said, never discuss philosophy or politics in a disco environment.' - Mr. F. Zappa -

 

[Snowpuppy77]

Has anyone ever compared the Schiit Mani to the phonostage module on a MM cartridge? Would appreciate impressions. If I get a Ragnarok 2 I am thinking about getting the phono module and putting the Mani in a separate system. I would not do that however if the Mani will sound better with a MM cartridge than the phono module.

 

[porchwizard]

What a man and his tractor do in the privacy of their own home is no concern of mine.

Other things you can do with a tractor...

 

[Derrick Swart]

Other things you can do with a tractor...

that tractor needs THE GADGET to get in tune

 

[thebkt]

I would 100% own a Saga right now if it had a bit more versatility in regards to powering on/off. If it had power on the remote and a standby mode that would switch on with an audio signal (eg. turn my TV on and sound comes out), then I'd be a Saga owner.

I'm aware there are compromises involved with including solutions like that, but a product with that additional functionality would easily be a (relatively) cheap powerhouse.

 

[Ableza]

Theres any chance to see a Schiit Pre amp in near future with phono card?

Cheers!

Any of their preamps plus a Mani gets you there.

 

[Pedro Janeiro]

Any of their preamps plus a Mani gets you there.

Thanks @Ableza. I know, and that probably will be my choice, but if theres any option without Mani and less cables i would prefer that.
Do you already tried Jotunheim as pre amp, its good?

thank you

 

[rkw]

Has anyone ever compared the Schiit Mani to the phonostage module on a MM cartridge?

"phonostage module" is a generic term. Are you asking about a specific phono preamp from a particular manufacturer?

 

[Snowpuppy77]

"phonostage module" is a generic term. Are you asking about a specific phono preamp from a particular manufacturer?

I am referring to the Schiit phono module that goes into the Lyr 3, Jotunheim, and likely the Rangnarok 2:

https://www.schiit.com/products/phono-module

 

[Derrick Swart]

"phonostage module" is a generic term. Are you asking about a specific phono preamp from a particular manufacturer?

i think he means the -passive RIAA balanced phono module- from Schiit Audio

 

[Derrick Swart]

I am referring to the Schiit phono module that goes into the Lyr 3, Jotunheim, and likely the Rangnarok 2:

https://www.schiit.com/products/phono-module

my guess the Mani is better (also as in more flexible) and cheaper. If you don't like the small box, put/hide it behind your amp

 

[Snowpuppy77]

my guess the Mani is better (also as in more flexible) and cheaper. If you don't like the small box, put/hide it behind your amp

Yes the Mani is cheaper and more flexible and I currently own one and use it for the Ragnarok. Plan to upgrade to the Ragnarok 2 and put the Mani into another system. Rather than get a second Mani I may just get the phono module for Ragnarok 2. I do not plan to use MC cartridge so do not need that functionality on the Mani. I have a hunch that the phono module may sound better than the Mani with a MM cartridge for two reason. One is that there is no need for an extra interconnect and the extra contacts. The other is the noise level. The wal wart power supply that comes with the Mani is not very good and the noise level of the Mani seems high to me. Perhaps using the internal power supply of the Ragnarok 2 would be better in terms of noise.

Which is why I am wondering if any one has compared the Schiit Mani with the Schiit phono module.

 

[Seret]

Pedro Janeiro asked:
"Anyone here knows if the Jotunheim is as good as pre amp, compared to dedicated schiit pre amps?"

From a Darko review of the Saga Classic and the Vidar (https://darko.audio/2017/11/schiit-vidarsaga-an-affordable-care-act-for-loudspeakers/):
"in delivering more of a polished windowed vibe to take the listener further inside Tom Waits’ Mule Variations, the Saga aces the Jotunheim as Vidar partner. No contest."

I had been using a Magni 3 as a preamp for the past 8 months until the Saga S arrived on Thursday. The Saga S is definitely superior with a greater soundstage and better imaging.

 

[Ableza]

Thanks @Ableza. I know, and that probably will be my choice, but if theres any option without Mani and less cables i would prefer that.
Do you already tried Jotunheim as pre amp, its good?

thank you

I have not used a Jotunheim, sorry.