Scammer: TRL (Tube Research Labs) / Paul Weitzel
Feb 5, 2009 at 6:08 AM Post #106 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Unfortunately, all of you are clueless, and I can tell from your avatars that you have not actually heard this preamp.

Don't you know the only objective measure of quality if hearing something yourself? After buying it?



All the best amps use plastic cable ties inside of them, didn't you know?
 
Feb 5, 2009 at 6:07 PM Post #107 of 170
Wow, I didn't realize that high end audio had the potential for scams like this. I figured if someone was going to drop over $1000 on a piece of audio equipment, they would know exactly what it is and who made it.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 3:52 AM Post #109 of 170
I did a Goggle search for TRL a couple days ago, since I had not visited the site for awhile, just to see if there was anything new. The link to this thread got my attention. I read the whole thing, looked at the pictures, and was amazed at how my experience with TRL was so different than that of rincewind. I don't want to be combative, or impune anyone who has tried to protect the public from snake oil salesmen. I just felt I had to join the forum, and shout from the housetops, that I have had a wonderful experience with TRL! I don't know if I should give a short version, or very detailed one. I tend to be long winded, but will try to be short, at least to begin with. I hope I don't cause this thread to go on and on, either.

First off, I need to mention that I was aware that Paul was VERY sick for awhile. I recieved an email from him in July of 2008, that he had had Hepatitis in his pancrease for two years. Finally, the doctors figured it out, and he was thrilled that he was feeling better than he had in years. I suspect that rincewind caught him at his very worse, when they didn't even know if he would make it.

I do not work for Paul. I have met him and his brother less than a half dozen times in my life, in person, and conversed with Paul about audio, several times over the past five or so years, via email, since first meeting him at an "audiophile party" at the former Cain & Cain factory. I have not tried to contact him for awhile, and he does not know that I am putting up any post in his defence. I don't know whether or not he knows about this thread. I am just a very satisfied customer, and would also like to consider myself his friend.

About four years ago I bought a Sony DVP-NS900S that had been one of the first players they had modified. I had compared it to a Rega Planet I was also considering, at home, and the TRL/Sony was the obvious winner IMHO. Soon I got an unsolicited email from Paul, telling me that they had done over 300 since then, and had learned a lot more about how to make them sound better, and would do some more mods, free of charge, if I could get it there and back. I hope Paul won't regret me telling this part, but I feel if I don't tell the whole truth, people will not believe me. I drove from Yakima, WA to Quincy, WA and left it with Paul. I picked it up a week or two latter. I was stunned at how much better it sounded! It had TONS more bass, TONS more resolution, more dynamics, more extended treble, and had not lost any of its mid-range magic.

I did pop the hood before playing it, and yes, there was "gooy stuff" inside, along with some Auricaps etc. I did not see any burned areas, and the soldering is top notch IMHO. I admit that am not "tecky" enough to try to understand what they did. I did see a wire that was cut, and not going to anything, but I don't care at all, since it sounds marvalous, and has operated flawlessly for about four years with almost daily use! If I go into the two times I A/B'd it with two different highly regarded players, this will get to long. I will save that for another post. Suffice it to say that I hope to someday replace most of my Audio System, but not my TRL/Sony player. It may not be everyones cup of tea, but I like what it does better than the other players I compared it to (Cary Audio 303 and my brother $9K Krell-sorry I don't have the model name at hand).

Some time after a bought the TRL/Sony, I met another audio buddy. This man opened up a Store called The Audio Attic in Ellensburg, WA. The store was open for about two years, until he was in a VERY serious motorcycle accident, and had to close the store. Once the store opened, we had an audio party, and invited Paul among others. We spent the first half of the day listening to various speakers, powered by a Cary Audio 303 CD player-the SLP 05 pre-amp, and the CAD 120S power amp. Since we had been listening to the Nu Force S-9 Speakers the longest, we then switched the electronics.

Paul had brought a transistor based Integrated Amp he had designed and manufactured, also a TRL pre-amp, and a TRL modified Marantz player. I had a pretty good seat, and decided to stay put, while they swapped everything out. Paul and his brother connected all their gear to the S-9's. They connected the pre-amp to the pre-amp connections that thier integrated amp had. The speakers had not moved. I had not moved. IMHO the TRL chain was at a significant level superior to the Cary chain. I was surprised that the mid-range was better than the execptional Cary gear with a transistor based power amp!

At the end of the party, the TRL integrated amp went home with a guy from the Seattle area who plays in a Symphony Orchestra, and had already bought the unit. I think the price tag was $4500. He had apparentely agreed to let us all play with it first.

So much for being brief. The bottom line is that I have had a wonderful experience doing business with TRL, and I still plan to do more business with them, as soon as I get a little money freed up.

Sincerely,

Benjamin Webber
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 3:58 AM Post #110 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by benjaminwebber /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I did a Goggle search for TRL a couple days ago, since I had not visited the site for awhile, just to see if there was anything new. The link to this thread got my attention. I read the whole thing, looked at the pictures, and was amazed at how my experience with TRL was so different than that of rincewind. I don't want to be combative, or impune anyone who has tried to protect the public from snake oil salesmen. I just felt I had to join the forum, and shout from the housetops, that I have had a wonderful experience with TRL! I don't know if I should give a short version, or very detailed one. I tend to be long winded, but will try to be short, at least to begin with. I hope I don't cause this thread to go on and on, either.

First off, I need to mention that I was aware that Paul was VERY sick for awhile. I recieved an email from him in July of 2008, that he had had Hepatitis in his pancrease for two years. Finally, the doctors figured it out, and he was thrilled that he was feeling better than he had in years. I suspect that rincewind caught him at his very worse, when they didn't even know if he would make it.

I do not work for Paul. I have met him and his brother less than a half dozen times in my life, in person, and conversed with Paul about audio, several times over the past five or so years, via email, since first meeting him at an "audiophile party" at the former Cain & Cain factory. I have not tried to contact him for awhile, and he does not know that I am putting up any post in his defence. I don't know whether or not he knows about this thread. I am just a very satisfied customer, and would also like to consider myself his friend.

About four years ago I bought a Sony DVP-NS900S that had been one of the first players they had modified. I had compared it to a Rega Planet I was also considering, at home, and the TRL/Sony was the obvious winner IMHO. Soon I got an unsolicited email from Paul, telling me that they had done over 300 since then, and had learned a lot more about how to make them sound better, and would do some more mods, free of charge, if I could get it there and back. I hope Paul won't regret me telling this part, but I feel if I don't tell the whole truth, people will not believe me. I drove from Yakima, WA to Quincy, WA and left it with Paul. I picked it up a week or two latter. I was stunned at how much better it sounded! It had TONS more bass, TONS more resolution, more dynamics, more extended treble, and had not lost any of its mid-range magic.

I did pop the hood before playing it, and yes, there was "gooy stuff" inside, along with some Auricaps etc. I did not see any burned areas, and the soldering is top notch IMHO. I admit that am not "tecky" enough to try to understand what they did. I did see a wire that was cut, and not going to anything, but I don't care at all, since it sounds marvalous, and has operated flawlessly for about four years with almost daily use! If I go into the two times I A/B'd it with two different highly regarded players, this will get to long. I will save that for another post. Suffice it to say that I hope to someday replace most of my Audio System, but not my TRL/Sony player. It may not be everyones cup of tea, but I like what it does better than the other players I compared it to (Cary Audio 303 and my brother $9K Krell-sorry I don't have the model name at hand).

Some time after a bought the TRL/Sony, I met another audio buddy. This man opened up a Store called The Audio Attic in Ellensburg, WA. The store was open for about two years, until he was in a VERY serious motorcycle accident, and had to close the store. Once the store opened, we had an audio party, and invited Paul among others. We spent the first half of the day listening to various speakers, powered by a Cary Audio 303 CD player-the SLP 05 pre-amp, and the CAD 120S power amp. Since we had been listening to the Nu Force S-9 Speakers the longest, we then switched the electronics.

Paul had brought a transistor based Integrated Amp he had designed and manufactured, also a TRL pre-amp, and a TRL modified Marantz player. I had a pretty good seat, and decided to stay put, while they swapped everything out. Paul and his brother connected all their gear to the S-9's. They connected the pre-amp to the pre-amp connections that thier integrated amp had. The speakers had not moved. I had not moved. IMHO the TRL chain was at a significant level superior to the Cary chain. I was surprised that the mid-range was better than the execptional Cary gear with a transistor based power amp!

At the end of the party, the TRL integrated amp went home with a guy from the Seattle area who plays in a Symphony Orchestra, and had already bought the unit. I think the price tag was $4500. He had apparentely agreed to let us all play with it first.

So much for being brief. The bottom line is that I have had a wonderful experience doing business with TRL, and I still plan to do more business with them, as soon as I get a little money freed up.

Sincerely,

Benjamin Webber



So Paul gets a freebie because of this?

You should have kept this to yourself, because you have no credibility here. It only makes it look like Paul has hired more defenders. Your testimony is worthless.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 4:28 AM Post #111 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by benjaminwebber /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I did see a wire that was cut, and not going to anything, [...]


Which means, he's a nice guy who has dodgy electrical practices.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 4:46 AM Post #112 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by Currawong /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Which means, he's a nice guy who has dodgy electrical practices.


I hate this thread almost as much as any ones started by Patrick82.

I just hope TRL will go under.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 7:30 AM Post #113 of 170
Just read the whole thread..

IMO it is obvious that all posts defending TRL are totally useless.. jeez... 1 post wonders defending...

It's funny how these people are ready to write so many paras in defense but not provide a single pic.. -_-

The pics of the 'bad'-mod and the ebay pic made me want to cry.. people should go donate than shell it out to TRL like organisations ***.. at least it will go to a good cause :|

I'm a newbie to all this but any decent amp I've seen yet has complete pics of the internals and most of them have the schematics in the open too..

I can't believe anyone could possibly shell out 80k or 140k $ on such amps with that tiny pic. lol.

epic fail imo.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 8:59 AM Post #114 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brighten /img/forum/go_quote.gif
So Paul gets a freebie because of this?

You should have kept this to yourself, because you have no credibility here. It only makes it look like Paul has hired more defenders. Your testimony is worthless.



All I can say, is that Paul has not hired me. I have not had ANY communication with him for several months. I am just a happy customer who feels like a lot of people are pilling on to a guy based on one guy's bad experience. I can not belive how many rebuttels I have gotten in just a few short hours! How many of you have heard TRL's products?

I tried to tell my experience. I feel like I am in a war zone. I will probably not trouble myself to visit this site anymore. I will however, continue to enjoy my SACD/CD player more than I would have been able to enjoy some REALLY expensive gear that does not sound as good, at a fraction of the cost. I will do business with TRL again. And, I will continue to recommend them to people that I care about.

Yes, it will be tempting to look back and see what has been written to me. On the other hand, I know it will be negative, and I have better things to do. adeu to you bunch of friendly people-----NOT

Sincerely,

Benjamin
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 12:51 PM Post #115 of 170
All in all, impressions from non head-fiers are not going to fly here. Impressions might not fly at all no matter who anymore, I'm thinking there is going to need to be more evidence. I have seen no pictures showing any active components that were changed or added, only some bad rewiring and goop jobs.

The differences that people describe just don't make logical sense to me. Until that is settled with pictures and/or notes (maybe schematics), there is no use replying to post impressions, it won't be able to change my mind honestly.
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 2:58 PM Post #116 of 170
grannyring is so full of it. First he says he has over 350 positive feedbacks on AG, then he says he has well over 1000 positive feedbacks... Get your story(lies)straight lol.....
 
Mar 16, 2009 at 3:14 PM Post #117 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by benjaminwebber /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I admit that am not "tecky" enough to try to understand what they did. I did see a wire that was cut, and not going to anything....


emphasis added

I am techy. I don't design amps, but I build them and have restored over 100 antique radio sets and even a television. I have an amateur radio license, too. I've been doing this for something around 12 years.

A loose wire is entirely unacceptable. There is no excuse. None whatsoever. You never leave loose wires inside a chassis. Never. Don't take my word for it, go ask in the DIY Forum if that is good practice. I guarantee you that not one member will say it is.

What happened is that you were taken in by a con man. It happens. Shifty, shady types don't rip people off. Everyone suspects them. Con man is short for "confidence man," which is someone who gains your trust and then rips you off.

What you hear may or may not be there. Audio is tricky. But please, please consider that you were probably the victim of a scam. It happens, it's nothing to be embarrassed about, but don't let it happen again.

No, I don't "have it out" for anyone in particular, but I've spent many years learning how to do builds, repairs and restorations correctly. I can tell you that this is entirely unacceptable.
 
May 21, 2009 at 11:27 AM Post #118 of 170
No comment.

See pictures of TRL unit. Very impressed with the sound. I've done some mods myself to improve on the unit further
smily_headphones1.gif



 
May 21, 2009 at 12:48 PM Post #120 of 170
Quote:

Originally Posted by madmax7 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
grannyring is so full of it. First he says he has over 350 positive feedbacks on AG, then he says he has well over 1000 positive feedbacks... Get your story(lies)straight lol.....


350 positive transactions = a scoring of 1050 on audiogon.
 

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