Roll Call: Who's building, built, or thinking of building a beta22?
Aug 22, 2008 at 6:06 PM Post #691 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by kklee /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I couldn't find a suitable strain relief of the right size (I spent several hours hunting online), so I have to settle for just a rubber grommet. Since the power supply will rarely ever get moved, it'll have to do.


You've probably seen them but I've used these for things and they are great:

Farnell Export

Up to 21mm but of course there are others on the site.
 
Aug 22, 2008 at 6:40 PM Post #692 of 3,218
That link doesn't work for me, it just takes me to some kind of gateway page.

I tried a couple of different cable strain reliefs, but I wasn't happy with them. Some of the more suitable looking ones were too expensive to order just to see if they'd work.
 
Aug 22, 2008 at 6:48 PM Post #693 of 3,218
stevenkelby, unbalanced (I really dislike the term "single-ended" because it's overloaded and ambiguous) has only a signal and a ground. Balanced has a hot signal (+), a cold signal (-) and a ground. To drive balanced headphones on a balanced amp from an unbalanced source requires either additional circuitry or a transformer to derive the "missing" cold signal.

That said, wiring just an RCA to the hot signal and ground on 4-channel balanced amps "works", because the headphone at the output of the amp "sees" the swinging signal from the hot side amplifier on one end, and no signal from the cold side amp on the other. It's not truly balanced, and if the cold amp doesn't get an input signal, its input should be grounded to minimize noise.
 
Aug 22, 2008 at 6:51 PM Post #694 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenkelby /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hi Naamanf,

The way I understood it was that SE just has teh signal on the + side and - is all referenced to ground, but with balanced if you have a signal of +1V on the positive, there is the same signal but -1V on the negative?

I want to use my turntable as source mainly and did google balanced phono stages but $$$...

Also would be nice to use my imod or even laptop and Pico as a source. I plan on an RWA Isabella as my next source, from a laptop, and that's not balanced either.

Id there much sonic advantage to sorting out the transformers to turn an SE source into balanced, thus using all 4 boards? I suspect it might be better just to do a 2 board b22?

Clearly I'm not ready to build anything although I can solder well. If I took the time to read enough I know I can build one but I just don't have time. Shouldn't be here now.

Thanks again,

Steve



Not exactly.

Single-Ended (actually, "unbalanced" is preferred since "single-ended" means something else as well): There is the signal (+) and there is ground. The signal (+) basically pushes the signal through the device and the ground absorbs it.

Balanced: There is a signal (+), signal (-) and ground. The signal (+) pushes the signal through the device with the signal (-) pulling the other end. Ground is used to establish an actual "ground" and is generally used to connect to the PSU ground to provide a standard 0V between devices; it is not used for the headphones.

Look into active-ground 3-channel Beta22; unless you're using a balanced source, just use an unbalanced amp.

EDIT: amb beat me to it
tongue.gif
 
Aug 22, 2008 at 7:15 PM Post #695 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by kklee /img/forum/go_quote.gif
That link doesn't work for me, it just takes me to some kind of gateway page.

I tried a couple of different cable strain reliefs, but I wasn't happy with them. Some of the more suitable looking ones were too expensive to order just to see if they'd work.



A cable tie on the inside would go a long way, and its cheap
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Aug 22, 2008 at 7:41 PM Post #697 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by kklee /img/forum/go_quote.gif
That's exactly what I did.


Ah, I see. It usually work well for me, at least to keep the cable from pulling at the connectors on the inside.
 
Aug 23, 2008 at 4:07 AM Post #698 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by kklee /img/forum/go_quote.gif
That link doesn't work for me, it just takes me to some kind of gateway page.

I tried a couple of different cable strain reliefs, but I wasn't happy with them. Some of the more suitable looking ones were too expensive to order just to see if they'd work.



Sorry, still works for me. Cookies or something I guess. It's item number 1554654 if you want to search it.

Cable tie sounds perfect though
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Aug 28, 2008 at 7:59 PM Post #701 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenkelby /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Do these actually convert an unbalanced signal to balanced I wonder?

Browse for Products | CPC



There is no link to any datasheets or technical info, but I would guess that they contain a transformer inside. The question is whether these provide any gain (transformer ratio), if they are optimized for microphone or line-level use, or for input or output. Also, no specifications are given such as frequency response, phase, square wave step response, etc.
 
Aug 28, 2008 at 8:37 PM Post #702 of 3,218
Quote:

Originally Posted by jantze /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm also getting a balanced/unbalanced switch. Initial idea is to use TPA IVY and OTTO. Is this a good way to implement it?

My main source will be Buffalo DAC once I get it finished.



Any opinions to this idea? Should I consider something else?

And I'm still looking for confirmation to what gain I should use (balanced b22). I have MD2000's that I'm a bit worried, but I might just use them with my WA6. In the future I might go for D7000, W5000 or even DX1000, so low impedance support is definitely needed.

Any D2000 or D5000 users with a balanced b22?
 
Aug 29, 2008 at 12:17 AM Post #703 of 3,218
jantze, someone else had asked me essentially the same question, so I'll answer here.

As far as I could tell, the TPA Ivy is an I/V converter for the Opus DAC (converts the DAC's balanced current outputs to balanced and unbalanced voltage outputs). It is not a general-purpose balanced/unbalanced conversion device.

If you build a balanced β22, then you could just use the Ivy's balanced outputs to feed the β22. There is no need to use the Ivy's unbalanced outputs.

You may want to use a source that only has unbalanced outputs (e.g., a CD player, tape deck or whatever) with the balanced β22. This is where an unbalanced/balanced switch comes into play. But since the balanced β22 will accept only balanced inputs, before you could switch anything, you need to convert the unbalanced source' signal to balanced. This is because the inverted "cold" signal for each channel is missing. An unbalanced-to-balanced line driver circuit (which the Ivy isn't), or a special transformer made for this purpose must be used in order to derive that signal. That will then allow the balanced headphones to remain "balanced" (i.e., hot and cold signals of oposite phase at each end of its drivers).

An example of an active unbalanced-to-balanced line driver is a circuit built around the DRV134 chip. Lundahl, Jensen, Cinemax and others make passive conversion transformers, but they are very pricey. Both methods have their benefits and drawbacks.

If you don't have all balanced sources, then you should consider building the 3-channel active ground β22 instead. It gives you virtually all the benefits of balanced (except the doubled voltage swing), and you don't have to deal with unbalanced-to-balanced converters which would degrade the signal.

As for amplifier gain, I am not familiar enough with the D2000 or D5000 to make a comment about it.
 
Aug 29, 2008 at 9:18 AM Post #704 of 3,218
A follow up to my post above...

Here's a quick and easy way to add switchable balanced/unbalanced inputs to a 4-ch balanced β22 amp. It adds just a 4PDT switch (or two DPDTs) and some wiring. No extra circuitry or transformer necessary.

This scheme could also be used on almost any 4-ch balanced amps.

Note that when switched to unbalanced inputs, the - amps have their inputs grounded, so that they become active ground buffers similar to a 3-channel active ground amp (except in this case there is a separate ground amp per channel). In this mode, the "balanced" headphones are actually driven with unbalanced signals, only the + terminals of the headphone transducers "see" a varying signal. The - terminal is held to zero volts.

beta22_bal_unbal_sw_sch.png
 
Aug 29, 2008 at 4:19 PM Post #705 of 3,218
Quick question. If I want to cool all the MOSFETs for two boards with a single, large heatsink, what thermal resistance am I going to want? This is for a balanced B22 with possible speaker duty and likely 2 PSU boards.
 

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