[Nick01]

Quote:

I am experiencing soemthing really strange with my FA-006. It seems to amplify some ambient noises that I can hardly hear normally, like fan noise from my laptop at low speed.
 
It is virtually silent at 2:30am now. But FA-006 makes the background become more "airy", more so than not wearing anything. Nothing is played through the headphones, as I'm purely speaking of isolation here. How can wearing headphones sound more open than not wearing any? I'm deeply puzzled...
 
Do you have a similar experience?

Whoa...me too!!
 

 

[headphonatic]

I was wondering if I should get these, the audio technica m50, panasonic htf500, denon ah d1100. I need bass, but not over powering the mids or treble, and i listen to beck, dubstep, drum and bass, 30s and 40s classical. thanks

 

[kingpage]

Get Creative Aurvana Live! (same drivers as D1001). FA-006 has unemphasized bass. It is better for classical, jazz, opera, etc.

 

[Header]

So.. 
 
I have read about 100 pages about FA-011, FA-003 and FA-006.. thanks to LFF. You are not making this easy for us!
Is it only the comfort that makes the FA-003 better than the FA-006 or is the FA-003 worth the extra $ due to its "much" better sound? From what I could tell they sound much like eachother.. Would I go wrong if I started off with the FA-006 for portable/home use now and later on buy the FA-003 for home use while the FA-006 becomes my main portable gear?
 
An answer would be highly appreciated!
 
 
Merry Christmas!

 

[sofastreamer]

anyone who directly compared the fishers with the creative aurvana live?

 

[kingpage]

Not directly. I had CAL for a year, after which I had the 006 for 3 weeks. What do you want to know about them?

 

[sofastreamer]

i wonder how they compare in terms of detail and soundstage.

 

[kingpage]

FA-006s have more detail and a sligtly bigger soundstage. As strange as it sounds, I did find the 006 to be more fatiguing (harsh at times) than the CAL, despite many said the 006s had smooth treble. It could just be my pair.

 

[Deadeight]

Quote:

 
 
 
I think it's important to consider the state of the industry when you compare the price/performance ratios of different manufacturers.  Sennheiser, Beyer, Denon, AKG, and especially STAX seem to have grown extremely comfortable with their positions in the audiophile headphone industry.  They compete with each other, but they're all pretty happy with the status quo price/performance ratio, so none of them are really interested in shaking things up too much.  Whenever this happens in any industry, the price levels gradually inflate (or decrease slower than manufacturing costs) to accomodate larger profit margins and gradually increasing inefficiency through laziness.  None of the big boys want a price war, so they advance their mainstream lineups slowly.
 
To give an example of where the industry has/had been heading, consider Sennheiser's HD800.  They innovated with this headphone (it's far more revealing than their other models), but not in a price/performance sense; they didn't bring break price barriers with efficiently manufactured audiophile headphones.  Instead, they simply created an outrageously expensive high-end product, which earned them a bit more prestige and made the $300-$600 ballpark seem much less expensive in comparison.  Another poster on this board commented recently that the "high end" is moving farther and farther out of reach, and headphones in the $2000 range are now considered "entry level" to the "high end."  This encourages people to spend more money:  If $300 is barely more than entry-level and $600 only nabs you mid-tier audiophile headphones, just imagine how much quality you'd be losing by getting something less than $200!   There are people on this board who spend as much on a STAX flagship and amp as it would take to buy a good car or put a modest down payment on a house.
 
Headphone prices just do not directly reflect absolute performance.  They reflect absolute performance only indirectly, and only with a large margin of error (especially given that performance rises logarithmically with price in this industry, hence diminishing returns).  The price levels between different manufacturers reflect a mixture of brand prestige and relative quality, and the price levels between the same manufacturers' different products reflect a mixture of relative quality and product positioning/marketing.  Consumers allow this by maintaining a demand for these products at current price levels.
 
In other words, the labor theory of value is completely false:  Prices do not necessarily reflect the cost of R&D/parts/labor, and even when they do, they could reflect excess or inefficiency in any of those categories.  For instance, we already know that it's possible to make a world-class headphone driver cheaply:  Check out the Fostex T50RP!  These headphones cost $74 shipped from bhphotovideo.com, and their only weakness is poor enclosure design.  With some DIY know-how and cheap craft materials, they can be modified to match or exceed the quality of Audeze LCD-2's.
 
This same principle applies to Fischer Audio:  If they apply their limited resources more wisely than Sennheiser, Beyer, Denon, AKG, STAX, etc., they can create products with significantly higher price/performance ratios than their incumbent competition.  Since they're newcomers to the industry, they HAVE to do this (or create a standout flagship) to set themselves apart, or they'll fail.  The big boys have grown too used to their position, and companies like Fischer are bringing back the kind of cutthroat competition the headphone market needs.
 
Does the <$100 FA-006 really sound as good as, or close to as good as, the HD600?  Does the $118 FA-011 really sound as good as, or close to as good as, the DT990?  I don't know, because I haven't heard them (though I have an FA-011 on the way, and I can't wait).  What I do know is that it's about damn time that someone really moved the market forward like that, and we shouldn't be especially surprised if Fischer has risen to the challenge.  If they haven't, someone else will, sooner or later.
 
The same principle applies to amplifiers:  The niche headphone amp market has been pretty insulated from cutthroat competition for a while, so companies like Schiit and Burson can easily charge >$400 for powerful, delicious-sounding amps like the Lyr, etc.  The cost of colored amps may or may not be justified by the amount of time and energy a company put into making it sound as subjectively warm and yummy as they could, and YMMV.  However, not everyone needs to pay such high prices for good sound, companies like FiiO are finally coming along to break price barriers on decent, warm-sounding amps.  FiiO amps won't have synergy with the same headphones, and they're probably not going to bring in as much pleasant, musical-sounding harmonic distortion as a tube amp, but they're seriously changing the headphone amp market.
 
On the other side of the headphone amp market, companies like Violectric are charging $1000 for amps that simply amplify an electric signal with good measurements.  This is hardly reflective of necessary costs; the science of amplifying an electric signal with minimal distortion has been settled for decades.  It's no ongoing mystery, and it doesn't require secret sauce, and there is no reason it should be anywhere near that expensive, especially with power levels as low as what we're using for headphones (and it shouldn't be particularly expensive for 1000 watt amps, either).  The Objective 2 amp has risen to address this particular gap, and to my knowledge it does so quite well.
 
In short, you shouldn't be surprised if a newcomer is setting an extremely low price point for a product that may be comparable to the heavy-weights:  That's how competition incites change in a lazy market, and it's about damn time that someone might be getting the ball rolling.  The timing makes sense too, given the headphone market has been growing rapidly lately (probably due to Beats hype).
 
I might be biased, of course:  I ordered an FA-011 due to LFF's review and the feedback from other head-fi members, and I've made it into my avatar (excited for them to actually arrive).  I WANT them to be as good as they're made out to be, which is basically "competitive with the DT-990."  That's not really the issue here though:
It really does seem that Fischer is helping to push the headphone market forward with better price/performance ratios, but regardless of whether their products are really "that good," it doesn't change the basic point:  We shouldn't be that surprised if they do turn out to be, because we're quite simply due for that to happen.
 
BTW, this is my first post, so...hi everyone.

I realise I'm late on this, but great post and sound logic. Of course, it does depend on the assumptions you've made (particularly that manufacturers are being lazy with their R&D and pricing), and evidence for them would be pretty hard to find, but it does make sense. 

 

[Jack Nicholson]

http://shop.conrad-uk.com/multimedia/audio/headphones/hifi-headphones/305878.html
 
to be or, not to be

that is the question

 

[Deckard1979]

Duplicate post - please ignore this and see below:

 

[Deckard1979]

Quote:

http://shop.conrad-uk.com/multimedia/audio/headphones/hifi-headphones/305878.html
 
to be or, not to be

that is the question

Interesting find... seeing this did make me highly suspicious of FA, I have to admit.

The FA-006s are the first FA's I've purchased and been disappointed with.  I've just found the sound to be really muffled and poorly defined.  After several hours burn-in... slight improvement, but not much.

A previous poster mentioned the foam pads covering the drivers.  Well, as a last resort I've removed them.  And guess what?  A lot of that muffled sound has gone.  In fact I'm fairly confident all of it has.

It seems an incredibly odd design fault to have had that in the first place.  Ok, it improves comfort somewhat... but bloody hell, am I the only one who noticed how it affects the sound?

Now sounds pretty good overall.  Still not massively impressed, but I can at least enjoy music on them now to a reasonable degree.

Personally, found the FA-004s much stronger.  And my FA-002Ws blow them away (though perhaps understandable considering the price gap).

Now... what's going on with these Renkforce CD-340s (£20)?  They look identical.  Are Fischer Audio ripping us off?  Or is this simply the same externals with poorer drivers?  Anyone?

 

[LimeANite]

Quote:

Now... what's going on with these Renkforce CD-340s (£20)?  They look identical.  Are Fischer Audio ripping us off?  Or is this simply the same externals with poorer drivers?  Anyone?

Fischer uses a lot of the same OEM parts as other manufacturers.  The FA-011 headband is the same as the one on a Turtle Beach model (and the cups look very similar as well, just wooden), and there are at least two FA-003 clones out there (Lindy Premium Hi-Fi Headphones and Brainwavz HM5).  Pretty sure I've seen a FA-004 clone somewhere as well.
 

 

[Deckard1979]

Quote:

Fischer uses a lot of the same OEM parts as other manufacturers.  The FA-011 headband is the same as the one on a Turtle Beach model (and the cups look very similar as well, just wooden), and there are at least two FA-003 clones out there (Lindy Premium Hi-Fi Headphones and Brainwavz HM5).  Pretty sure I've seen a FA-004 clone somewhere as well.
 

So the drivers are the difference, then... (hope they are)...
 
That's a relief!

 

[Deckard1979]

Advice for all FA-006 owners, regarding the glued-on foam:
 
Rip the foam off and bin it!
 
Finally enjoying these... absolutely astonished Fischer decided to muffle the drivers with that crap.