[naamanf]

I wouldn't by any stretch consider myself a technical expert or a golden ear but I figured I might as well weight in on this.

I have both listened to and seen the inside of the Amphora. The first thing I thought was CMOY when I looked inside. Single DIP-8 chip with assorted resistors and caps powered by a 9V fed into a voltage regulator. The DIP-8 is either an opamp or similar device, possibly a single chip "headphone amp". Still nothing revolutionary. Other than the V-caps the rest of the parts selection looked to be pretty ordinary. Parts used for the headphone jacks, switches and knobs did seem to be a bit on the cheap side, especially at this price point. I would say the most expensive thing on this amp is the CNC/Laser engraved case or the Goldpoint. Depending on OEM pricing I do think this could be made for $300 or a good deal under. As mentioned before in this thread you do have to take into consideration a businesses operating costs so using just parts cost isn't always a fair assessment on price. It also seems if your not going to be using this with an iMod the V-caps are a waste, and if anything detracting from the sound.

How do I think it sounded? I didn't have a whole lot of time to spend with it but I do think it sounded good, but not amazing. During the same session I also compared it to a P-51 and a maxed Woo 6. It seemed more on par with the P-51, and under classed by the Woo 6. Seeing as the Woo is in the same price class it seemed to me to be the no brainer between the two and a far better value.

I think people also need to keep in mind that sound is subjective and go with reviewers opinions who have similar sonic tastes. If Skylab's (or any other reviewers) opinion is that it is a great sounding amp and your taste matches his then more than likely you will love it regardless what's inside.

 

[moonboy403]

Isn't a maxxed woo 6 close to $1500? I was looking to get that before I got my SP.

 

[les_garten]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moonboy403 /img/forum/go_quote.gif That analogy is clearly flawed as there isn't any unknown variable involved in those two cases you mentioned. You're saying since I know 1 + 1 = 2 and 1 + 2 = 3, therefore, I know X + 1 too.

You are wrong in your "Math" here and you are trying to rationalize this amp because it is Chock full of "Magic Dust"

Because we have this fuzzy pic, we actually can see what we are getting for $1000 here. Come on, you're getting a $30 amp here. The Board is small and has nothing on it, that's the heart of this $1000 product. Like I said before, with so few parts and building an amp circuit, there's only so many ways you can build it.

I'd like to see Krell build a CMOY, now that would be somethin'!!

.

 

[naamanf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moonboy403 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Isn't a maxxed woo 6 close to $1500? I was looking to get that before I got my SP.

This one was maxed minus the DACT. So maybe in the $1200+/- range.

 

[moonboy403]

Quote:

Originally Posted by naamanf /img/forum/go_quote.gif This one was maxed minus the DACT. So maybe in the $1200+/- range.

I see. Thanks! I would love to hear a maxed woo 6 someday.

 

[krmathis]

What a thread...

All that matters is the end result, sound quality, build quality and looks wise. If you don't like what you see/hear just move on.

 

[bidoux]

This is a bit like spending 1,000 in a cable...

Anyone here had a closer look at the amp and can definitly say if it is a (maxxed) Cmoy or not ?

 

[itsborken]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moonboy403 /img/forum/go_quote.gif That analogy is clearly flawed as there isn't any unknown variable involved in those two cases you mentioned. You're saying since I know 1 + 1 = 2 and 1 + 2 = 3, therefore, I know X + 1 too.

Yeah, you would know that; it's derived via proof by induction.

 

[les_garten]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bidoux /img/forum/go_quote.gif This is a bit like spending 1,000 in a cable... Anyone here had a closer look at the amp and can definitly say if it is a (maxxed) Cmoy or not ?

Look above at Naamaf's post. Naamaf's Post He also knows what he is talking about. Look at his B22 build if you want to POP righteous wood! I want his B22 bad enough to kill him for it. Except I suspect he has bigger and better guns than I do!

Look at Naamaf's Build on the Gallery page

Here's the DNA thread at work here:

CMOY >>>> RA-1 >>>> Amphora

$30 >>>> $500 >>>> $1000 >>>> ????

.

 

[moonboy403]

Quote:

Originally Posted by itsborken /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, you would know that; it's derived via proof by induction.

Nope. Induction doesn't work like that. Moreover, 1 + 1 doesn't necessarily equal to 2 either.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skylab /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks Miguel! And I agree with you - I preferred both of my Singlepower tube amps, as a matter of personal preference. I think Larry prefers the Amphora over the Singlepower SquareWave, which I have never heard.

I felt the Amphora and Square Wave XL were on pretty even footing, if the Sq Wave was run balanced even though the Amphora is single ended.

The main thing I am using the Square Wave XL for right now is for my balanced K1000 because it has gobs of power, but if my Eddie Current ZDT drives the K1000 and HD600 better then I may cut the Sq Wave loose. This from someone who thought the Sq Wave was better than a Headroom Balanced Desktop when I listened to each at the 07/08 CO meet. I do like my Sq Wave better than others I have heard including Headamp Gilmore Reference, Grahm Slee NOVO, Travagans Red or White, Firestone Cute Beyond, StyleAudio TOPAZ, Head-direct EF1, Qinpu A-3, DV 336i, MSSH, Cavalli CTH and most of my portable amps except the Amphora.

I am mostly using the D10/Amphora in my computer rig, my Apogee/maxed WA6 in my main dynamic rig, and the PS Audio DL3/Woo GES in my stat rig. Once the WA6 with Vcaps and blackgates was fully burned-in and I got the Sophia 274b rectifier it has edged out the Sq Wave, and I think the maxed WA6 still has a lead over the Amphora too.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by naamanf /img/forum/go_quote.gif I wouldn't by any stretch consider myself a technical expert or a golden ear but I figured I might as well weight in on this. I have both listened to and seen the inside of the Amphora. The first thing I thought was CMOY when I looked inside. Single DIP-8 chip with assorted resistors and caps powered by a 9V fed into a voltage regulator. The DIP-8 is either an opamp or similar device, possibly a single chip "headphone amp". Still nothing revolutionary. Other than the V-caps the rest of the parts selection looked to be pretty ordinary. Parts used for the headphone jacks, switches and knobs did seem to be a bit on the cheap side, especially at this price point. I would say the most expensive thing on this amp is the CNC/Laser engraved case or the Goldpoint. Depending on OEM pricing I do think this could be made for $300 or a good deal under. As mentioned before in this thread you do have to take into consideration a businesses operating costs so using just parts cost isn't always a fair assessment on price. It also seems if your not going to be using this with an iMod the V-caps are a waste, and if anything detracting from the sound. How do I think it sounded? I didn't have a whole lot of time to spend with it but I do think it sounded good, but not amazing. During the same session I also compared it to a P-51 and a maxed Woo 6. It seemed more on par with the P-51, and under classed by the Woo 6. Seeing as the Woo is in the same price class it seemed to me to be the no brainer between the two and a far better value. I think people also need to keep in mind that sound is subjective and go with reviewers opinions who have similar sonic tastes. If Skylab's (or any other reviewers) opinion is that it is a great sounding amp and your taste matches his then more than likely you will love it regardless what's inside.

Somehow I missed your post while I was typing my long one.

I definitely trust your ears, as you can hear a deteriorating foam in the driver of my AKG K240M before I did. As you can see, my opinion of the Woo vs Amphora is similar and I prefer the Woo WA6. And I do think the P-51 is very close to the Amphora but the P-51 was a little more forward and aggressive and not as refined sounding as the Amphora. And, my WA6 would clock out at around $1250 with all the upgrades and rectifier, so you are right on the money.

Also, you didn't mention that the Amphora was driven by an iMod docked directly into the Amphora's internal Vcaps, and the P-51 was using a $350 portable Vcap dock with an LOD and mini-mini interconnect costing another $150. So, at that point, the P-51 was really a $900 iMod rig vs a $995 iMod rig. I believe I was told the cost to manufacture the Amphora is closer to $650 after the RWA board ($500 retail option for Isabella Preamp), Goldpoint, CNC machining of the case with mother of pearl inlays, and Vcaps, and other parts.

 

[itsborken]

Quote:

Originally Posted by moonboy403 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Nope. Induction doesn't work like that. Moreover, 1 + 1 doesn't necessarily equal to 2 either.

Sure it does: F(n+1)=1+F(n); F(0) would be your basis. The proof is elementary.

 

[moonboy403]

Quote:

Originally Posted by itsborken /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sure it does: F(n+1)=1+F(n); F(0) would be your basis. The proof is elementary.

You're assuming that we're working under the field of real numbers and a sequence exists which is a big no no in proofs. What if I say that we're working under a field of two elements?

 

[Skylab]

Quote:

Originally Posted by les_garten /img/forum/go_quote.gif You've hung your reputation on this in your review. You made unequivocal bold statements about it. I don't know any other way to look at it. .

Why is it that you cannot make your case without attacking me personally? I've asked several times for you to stop. Since *I* am the civil sort, I will ask again politely : PLEASE STOP crapping in my thread. You're embarrassing yourself, and weakening your position. Please keep your posts to your opinions about the PRODUCT - there is no need for the kind of attacks you have now made repeatedly.

My review does not in ANY WAY hinge on whether the Amphora is the result of a new design based on recently de-classified military research, or a simple design with swanky parts. Either way, it sounded good, and that's enough for me. Nothing about what went into the design changes a thing about my review, not does it have the SLIGHTEST bearing on my opinion. I did level-matched comparisons with other reference amps I have. I have reviewed dozens and dozens of amps in the same way. Other very experienced reviewers here felt the same way about the amp that I did. So regardless of what you think about the design, THE AMP SOUNDS GOOD. There is plenty of evidence for that. The rest is just quibbling about philosophy, which is FINE, if you can just keep it CIVIL.