Recording Impulse Responses for Speaker Virtualization
Jan 21, 2021 at 4:13 AM Post #511 of 1,816
guys, i'm thinking to buy the Soncoz LA-QXD1 i saw that's a good cheap balanced dac but also i saw on internet that it's useless to buy good dac when you use the surround virtualization algorythm, is that true?

I'm willing to use hesuvi with that dac so...
 
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Jan 21, 2021 at 4:38 AM Post #512 of 1,816
guys, i'm thinking to buy the Soncoz LA-QXD1 i saw that's a good cheap balanced dac but also i saw on internet that it's useless to buy good dac when you use the surround virtualization algorythm, is that true?

I'm willing to use hesuvi with that dac so...
Doesn't really matter since practically all modern DACs are audibly transparent, except the ones whuch are engineered purposefully to color the sound. Even your motherboard probably has really good DAC.
 
Jan 21, 2021 at 6:00 AM Post #513 of 1,816
Doesn't really matter since practically all modern DACs are audibly transparent, except the ones whuch are engineered purposefully to color the sound. Even your motherboard probably has really good DAC.

so you are telling me that i don't need a good dac? maybe i need an amp? i tried to use the motherboard but the audio is too low and i doubt that there's some audio quality hardware in that mobo (is cheap), i use the xonar u3 usb sound card from years but i want to change to something much more solid but if you're telling me that there's zero differences in surround sound if i use one dac or another, i trust you
 
Jan 21, 2021 at 6:32 AM Post #514 of 1,816
so you are telling me that i don't need a good dac? maybe i need an amp? i tried to use the motherboard but the audio is too low and i doubt that there's some audio quality hardware in that mobo (is cheap), i use the xonar u3 usb sound card from years but i want to change to something much more solid but if you're telling me that there's zero differences in surround sound if i use one dac or another, i trust you
You need an amp that has more power if you can't push your headphones to high enough volume.
 
Feb 6, 2021 at 7:26 AM Post #515 of 1,816
After trying different mountings I now use the construction like shown in the image below for 3 of my Primo pairs. It is working very well and I can even place the speakers without taking out the mics in the room.

p1050558-procmics_1052101.jpgp1050549-proc-mic1-r11_1052100.jpg

I wanted to share that in the meantime I have changed the mic placement. I removed the yellow foam and place the capsule now really into the ear canal opening as shown in the image. Overall it improved the quality of the measuremt. The second image shows how I did my last measurements. I'm really happy with the results.

P1050715_procheadfi.jpgP1011689_proc.jpg
 
Mar 14, 2021 at 1:58 AM Post #516 of 1,816
I came across this reddit post that seems a great idea in principle to translate headphones from one to another. You just put your over ear headphone into one ear and your IEM into the another ear and perform equal loudness adjustments in EAPO.

Mr Pasanen, would there be any way we can implement that to translate over ear headphone compensations to IEMs? I'm still struggling to get a good sounding profile for my Air Pods Pro and this seems like it'd work because it's manual EQ/perceptual rather than on a dummy head!
 
Mar 14, 2021 at 5:22 AM Post #517 of 1,816
I came across this reddit post that seems a great idea in principle to translate headphones from one to another. You just put your over ear headphone into one ear and your IEM into the another ear and perform equal loudness adjustments in EAPO.

Mr Pasanen, would there be any way we can implement that to translate over ear headphone compensations to IEMs? I'm still struggling to get a good sounding profile for my Air Pods Pro and this seems like it'd work because it's manual EQ/perceptual rather than on a dummy head!
Usually what is done is that you set your own loudness contour as baseline and you EQ both IEM/headphones to it(using tones and working you way with EQ until a sweep feels like it's all at the same loudness. Then from those 2 EQ you have the difference. It's long, annoying and takes time to get good at it(at least it took time for me back then).
Something like this
I did ask him for his really basic .exe back then and it made the process easier in some ways, so long as you gave yourself some headroom before starting(to avoid clipping).
One phone in each ear felt easier, but also didn't work as well for me somehow.
 
Mar 14, 2021 at 6:03 AM Post #518 of 1,816
I came across this reddit post that seems a great idea in principle to translate headphones from one to another. You just put your over ear headphone into one ear and your IEM into the another ear and perform equal loudness adjustments in EAPO.

I think most over ear headphone are not so flexible that you can wear them like this without changing the sealing and sound signature. ManLoud EQ z

I tried the mehtod suggest by Griesinger but I found it very hard to get a feeling for equal loudness.
 
Mar 14, 2021 at 7:16 AM Post #519 of 1,816
I think most over ear headphone are not so flexible that you can wear them like this without changing the sealing and sound signature. ManLoud EQ z

I tried the mehtod suggest by Griesinger but I found it very hard to get a feeling for equal loudness.
We sadly are struggling when going back and forth using single tones, and need a lot of training to get something useful. If only we could be like all the elite audiophiles who can listen to gears with different music at different volume levels and years apart, and still tell you in great detail, with absolute confidence, all about the differences they heard.
I use sarcasm to hide how jealous I am.
 
Mar 14, 2021 at 9:52 PM Post #520 of 1,816
I came across this reddit post that seems a great idea in principle to translate headphones from one to another. You just put your over ear headphone into one ear and your IEM into the another ear and perform equal loudness adjustments in EAPO.

Mr Pasanen, would there be any way we can implement that to translate over ear headphone compensations to IEMs? I'm still struggling to get a good sounding profile for my Air Pods Pro and this seems like it'd work because it's manual EQ/perceptual rather than on a dummy head!
Also the phase response difference between the two headphones would mean you would perceive the sound as off to one side even when they are at equal loudness...
 
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Mar 16, 2021 at 4:18 AM Post #521 of 1,816
We sadly are struggling when going back and forth using single tones, and need a lot of training to get something useful. If only we could be like all the elite audiophiles who can listen to gears with different music at different volume levels and years apart, and still tell you in great detail, with absolute confidence, all about the differences they heard.
I use sarcasm to hide how jealous I am.

Yep! If it's one thing Impulcifer has taught me it's that your other senses "hear". Hearing is a multi sensory experience - I've cited it before but my HRIR I generate in my theater sounds IDENTICAL to the real thing in the same room. I took that same HRIR into a cafe (pre covid!) and it sounded like ass. Dolby Virtual Headphone blew it away.

I tried David C's loudness matching and just couldn't really do it, I only gave it one shot though, might try it again.

I guess I'll stick to the synthetic HRIR's for my Air Pods Pros and rely on my Bose 700s for my theater when I need ANC
 
Mar 16, 2021 at 9:54 AM Post #522 of 1,816
Yep! If it's one thing Impulcifer has taught me it's that your other senses "hear". Hearing is a multi sensory experience - I've cited it before but my HRIR I generate in my theater sounds IDENTICAL to the real thing in the same room. I took that same HRIR into a cafe (pre covid!) and it sounded like ass. Dolby Virtual Headphone blew it away.

I tried David C's loudness matching and just couldn't really do it, I only gave it one shot though, might try it again.

I guess I'll stick to the synthetic HRIR's for my Air Pods Pros and rely on my Bose 700s for my theater when I need ANC
It also seems like we're not equals when it comes to the impact of certain cues. I'm a total slave to visual cues. I sort of knew it, but for a long time I assumed it was just standard human behavior prioritizing sight(after all it's the bigger area allocation for the brain). But in the last years discussing and reading everything I can find on psychoacoustics, it has becomes apparent that my eyes do even more "hearing" than for the average guy. I guess it started when people made fun of me at an audio meeting for having the habit to close my eyes to test gears.
The best thing I did for my headphone setup at my desk was to put some speaker monitors on the desk, and elevate them at my level. They're like sound magnets, anything I feel in the general direction of the speakers gets stuck on them(in my mind^_^). If I move my head everything collapses, but it comes back pretty fast. Even some very average crossfeed DSP works fairly well if I don't move much.

Head tracking on the A16 with the right impulses for all directions, works great without needing the speakers as visual anchors, but it still helps in my case and I still get influenced to some degree. I played moving them around and even almost 45° to the side, after a while not moving my head much, I feel like they're emitting the sound. It blows my conscious mind.
But then I've seen people who don't even care to use a head tracker, and people who only see minimal improvements between vague Xfeed effect and HRIR. I mean some people even say that default headphone playback without any DSP, makes them feel like they're front raw at a concert. I always thought it was BS, but apparently not. Our imagination is the limit and in this case, I might be lacking because the best I can get from typical stereo albums with unprocessed headphone signal, is lateralization and the singer+drums usually sitting on my forehead unless they're panned in some way.

Oh and of course, like you I can get pretty different feelings depending on the room size and where I'm sited. It's annoying because it puts pretty hard limits to what I can hope to simulate. Some of the best headphone experience I got in my life were in a completely dark room where I couldn't see anything. The "image" I get can be pretty badass after a while. Maybe some people experience that with their eyes open? IDK.
 
May 15, 2021 at 9:33 AM Post #524 of 1,816
Plotting bug is probably now fixed in branch plot-fix. Switch from master with git checkout plot-fix and install dependencies python -m pip install -U -r requirements.txt. This comes with the requirement of Python 3.8 (up from 3.7).

Would be superb if someone who has encountered the bug could test if this fixes the problem.
 

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