Questions I have as a newbie about 4.4mm cables.

[Grom781]

I've read a little bit about 4.4mm but I had some specific questions that I hope one of the many experts here could help me with.

What does 'balanced audio' mean? Does it split the signal from the source evenly between each core in a cable or is it something else?

Does a source need to be altered to properly accommodate for 4.4mm? Are there any little settings that can be changed to truely utilise 4.4mm?

Is there a clear distinction between cables that terminate in 3.5mm but come with a 4.4mm that could then be plugged into DAC amp and cables that simply terminate in 4.4mm?

Im quite new to this space and still learning to pick up little subtleties in good sound quality. I also only use iems and nothing expensive. If I were to invest in a 0.78mm 2pin connector to 4.4mm cable I would run it with Moondrop Aria, or DQ6S's (so either only combined with a ~$70 or ~$35 iem)
I also only have a fairly cheap chinese made amp, I can output 4.4mm from it though, hence my intrigue in 4.4mm.
My question in relation to all this background is this; would a newbie running toslink from source then running the signal through a cheap (~$80) DAC Amp then into a 'budget' iem notice something new?

If the answer is probably no, at what level of experience or at what price point might it be something worth investing in to try? (best estimate is fine)

Last question I promise.... for the setup listed above what should be the pricepoint I should be aiming for if I were to try it out.

I know that was a lot haha but thankyou for any advice or imput. Any is helpful and I dont expect one person to answer everything but I thought it best to inform people of some of the shortcomings in my knowledge.

Have a great day

 

[WILLJS]

I've read a little bit about 4.4mm but I had some specific questions that I hope one of the many experts here could help me with.

What does 'balanced audio' mean? Does it split the signal from the source evenly between each core in a cable or is it something else?

balanced audio means, in practice, each channel has it's own negative signal, which has been reversed in polarity. conventional amps share a negative for each channel.
generally this is acheived by having a seperate amp chip for each channel, rather than one.

 

[WILLJS]

the benefit to balanced audio is reduced noise, therefore acheiving greater clarity.

 

[Grom781]

balanced audio means, in practice, each channel has it's own negative signal, which has been reversed in polarity. conventional amps share a negative for each channel.
generally this is acheived by having a seperate amp chip for each channel, rather than one.

Like destructive wave interference to balance the signal?
Thats pretty amazing tech if I've understood that correctly

 

[Thomasr]

There seems to be a lot of confusion and differing opinions about balanced audio in consumer gear.

In short, a regular (unbalanced) stereo setup uses two amplified channels to "push" the signal to the headphones, and the signal then returns via a common negative conductor. That's why a typical connector jack has 3 conductors: tip, ring, and sleeve (left channel, right channel, and common return).

In a balanced configuration, there are four amplified channels: two which "push" the signal, and a matching two which "pull" the signal via a dedicated return conductor for each channel. That's why a balanced connector jack has 4 conductors: tip, ring, ring, sleeve.

For demanding, hard-to-drive headphones, balanced amplification can be useful if the amplifier is otherwise a bit lacking in power. Beyond this basic fact, you'll find there's a lot of conflicting opinions about the benefits of a balanced signal. Does it offer better imaging and staging? Greater resolution? More "slam"? Does it make your teeth whiter and your breath fresher? It all depends who you ask.

 

[Grom781]

There seems to be a lot of confusion and differing opinions about balanced audio in consumer gear.

In short, a regular (unbalanced) stereo setup uses two amplified channels to "push" the signal to the headphones, and the signal then returns via a common negative conductor. That's why a typical connector jack has 3 conductors: tip, ring, and sleeve (left channel, right channel, and common return).

In a balanced configuration, there are four amplified channels: two which "push" the signal, and a matching two which "pull" the signal via a dedicated return conductor for each channel. That's why a balanced connector jack has 4 conductors: tip, ring, ring, sleeve.

For demanding, hard-to-drive headphones, balanced amplification can be useful if the amplifier is otherwise a bit lacking in power. Beyond this basic fact, you'll find there's a lot of conflicting opinions about the benefits of a balanced signal. Does it offer better imaging and staging? Greater resolution? More "slam"? Does it make your teeth whiter and your breath fresher? It all depends who you ask.

legendary answer, thankyou. so what you're telling me it actually may not give me whiter teeth and fresher breath then? damn

legit though, thankyou for your answer I appreciate it

 

[WILLJS]

There seems to be a lot of confusion and differing opinions about balanced audio in consumer gear.

In short, a regular (unbalanced) stereo setup uses two amplified channels to "push" the signal to the headphones, and the signal then returns via a common negative conductor. That's why a typical connector jack has 3 conductors: tip, ring, and sleeve (left channel, right channel, and common return).

In a balanced configuration, there are four amplified channels: two which "push" the signal, and a matching two which "pull" the signal via a dedicated return conductor for each channel. That's why a balanced connector jack has 4 conductors: tip, ring, ring, sleeve.

For demanding, hard-to-drive headphones, balanced amplification can be useful if the amplifier is otherwise a bit lacking in power. Beyond this basic fact, you'll find there's a lot of conflicting opinions about the benefits of a balanced signal. Does it offer better imaging and staging? Greater resolution? More "slam"? Does it make your teeth whiter and your breath fresher? It all depends who you ask.

that is what i meant by each channel has it's own negative, rather than sharing a ground.

 

[o0genesis0o]

Just to add that a balanced amp does not necessarily sounds better than a well done single ended only amp. However, when both connectors are on the same device, manufacturers tend to favour the balanced out one way or another, making it sounds better than the other. Sometimes it’s glaringly different, sometimes subtle. That’s why all of my IEM uses 4.4mm balanced cable, except 1 that I use with gaming consoles.

Anyhow, the differences between DAC/amp are small on the grand scheme. It’s mind over matter. If you don’t mind then it doesn’t matter

 

[PinkyPowers]

An important point I don't think has been brought up yet:

If you have a balanced termination for your cable, you can adapt it back to single-ended very easily. But there is no adapter which can take a single-ended cable and make it balanced.

Because of this, many find it advantageous to always go for the balanced cable, when the choice is available, as it can be used on the best output on every device. And 4.4mm is optimal, because it's relatively small compared to 4-pin XLR. And there are plenty of good 4.4mm-to-4-pin-XLR adapters out there.

 

[Thomasr]

But there is no adapter which can take a single-ended cable and make it balanced.

Those adapters exist, but they shouldn't. Plugging a single-ended headphone into a balanced amplifier (via one of these ill-conceived adapters) is a great way to permanently damage the amp.

 

[Roseval]

Those adapters exist, but they shouldn't

There is an exception to this rule.
The Pentaconn is TRRRS so 2x2 for the "balanced" connection and a ground. This can be used for TRS connection by using L+, R+ and the Ground.

 

[PinkyPowers]

Those adapters exist, but they shouldn't. Plugging a single-ended headphone into a balanced amplifier (via one of these ill-conceived adapters) is a great way to permanently damage the amp.

Scary indeed.

Still, while the adapters may exist, they don't make your cable balanced. They simply allow you to plug into a balanced output. Which, as you pointed out, is not a good idea. lol

 

[Roseval]

a balanced amp does not necessarily sounds better

If we assume identical amps, it will be worse!
Using 2 amps instead of one will
double the power
double the distortion
double the impedance
However, well designed amps have such a low distortion and impedance, this doubling is trivial.
In practice the single ended might be substantial worse spec wise.
I have also seen amps with a 4 pin output but internally it is single ended
etc, etc.

 

[o0genesis0o]

I have also seen amps with a 4 pin output but internally it is single ended
etc, etc.

That’s the Topping G5. They didn’t claim that it’s a balanced device though.

For some IEMs, it’s indeed worse on balanced for the same amp. But besides exceptions, most benefit from 4.4 when running the same amp, especially if you listen pay attention to sound stage and the perceived dynamic. When I heard the difference, I was like “why wasting my investment”?

Moreover, I paid for 2 or 4 DAC chips and two separate set of amps when I buy a balanced DAC/amp, I’m going to use all them