Public ABX Test (Show Off Your Ears)
Sep 7, 2007 at 1:22 AM Post #64 of 83
I can't tell the difference with the Guns N' Roses clip, but I encoded a copy of Hotel California Live (Hell Freezes Over) @ lame V2 (same as the GNR clip) and the difference is obvious in the first 3 seconds. 7/7 on this track w/ ABX-Comparator vs 4/10 on the Guns N' Roses.
 
Mar 15, 2008 at 6:18 AM Post #66 of 83
Links are still working. How is it this thread hasn't got more attention?

Anyway, just sent my results off to HiFire. 14/14 for Guns n Roses. I was using the PK1 but oddly enough, I got a higher score with the PK1 than with the TakeT H2. Very strange, especially considering the H2 has much much higher extension in the treble than the PK1.
 
Mar 16, 2008 at 12:10 PM Post #68 of 83
Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenkelby /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Nice one Serk. These positive results "prove" that there is an audible difference. Which we already knew, and hence I didn't bother to do the test! Hopefully this puts it to bed.


Assuming that his results are reproduceable, it proves that there is an audible difference for b0dhi for that clip. It doesn't prove anything with respect to you. Do the test!
smily_headphones1.gif


Edit: I just saw your post in the other thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenkelby /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Right, so any conclusion in the negative is only relevant to that person/track/gear etc. Results are not universal and it is naive to assume they are.


This is certainly true, but the same is also true for positive results, unless the only question you're trying to answer is, "Is there anyone in the world who can hear the difference?" Even then, you would need to reproduce your results before coming to any definitive conclusions. (If enough people take the test, there is always the possibility that some would get a perfect score by chance, though with a sufficient number of trials in each test, that possibility becomes very, very small.)
 
Mar 16, 2008 at 12:19 PM Post #69 of 83
Quote:

Originally Posted by Febs /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Assuming that his results are reproduceable, it proves that there is an audible difference for b0dhi for that clip. It doesn't prove anything with respect to you. Do the test!
smily_headphones1.gif



That's what I meant about it being possible to prove the positive but not the negative.

B0dhi's results, if reproducible, prove without doubt that their is, depending on ears and rig, an audible difference between the formats.

If only he would do one for copper V silver, or power cords, or everything else head-fi argues about!

I thought that was the point of the exercise, to see whether a difference can exist or not.

I don't need to do it as I know I hear it and don't need to prove to anyone that a difference exists, and that I hear it.

I will do it with different cables when I'm set up to for it.
 
Mar 16, 2008 at 12:26 PM Post #70 of 83
Sorry, we talked past each other slightly there as I was editing my post while you replied.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevenkelby /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I don't need to do it as I know I hear it and don't need to prove to anyone that a difference exists, and that I hear it.


The point of the test is to provide support for exactly this type of assertion. I have no problem if you don't want to take the test; however, if you choose not to, then this assertion has little value. If you actually can hear the difference, I wish that you would take the test, because yours would be a valuable data point.
 
Mar 16, 2008 at 12:32 PM Post #71 of 83
Ah yes I understand now. It would be valuable to know all the details, such as using the PK1 V H2. That sort of data could be very useful. With enough data from different people we could get very valuable results. Would be a nightmare to collate too.

OK I will do it with PK1 and D5000, not for me, but for the good of the community! (I sold my H2 to finance new speakers)

I'll use the Pico too.

Maybe easter weekend.

Hope I can figure it out, I may be back here for help...
 
Mar 17, 2008 at 2:20 AM Post #72 of 83
From my experience with the test, I think most of our ears are quite capable of hearing the difference, but that the difficulty is in concentrating so intensely and consistently for an extended period of time. It was surprisingly taxing, and I did feel mentally exhausted afterwards.

However, this ABX test is one of the best I've tried in that it is well designed to allow one to do the whole test with one hand and without needing to open their eyes (an absolute requirement IMO).

A while back, there was a thread about an online test that was trying to measure the audibility of distortion, and that test had an atrocious design. You had to continually open your eyes, move the mouse, and click a button to hear the other sample or to make a selection of any kind, all of which would destroy such an intense concentrative state required for detecting subtle changes in sound.

So, although the instructions for this test seem a bit daunting, it's actually quite easy to get running, and I think it's worth taking because it's well designed, and you may be surprised at what you'll learn about your headphones by it.
 
Mar 17, 2008 at 3:02 AM Post #73 of 83
I think this arguement will always come to the same conclusion. Though most of us here spend lots on headphones and amps, people are in it more for the music, and not concentrating that that cymbal was .1dB louder with a lossless recording. IMHO, I think if you really have to argue this much about it, you can't fully enjoy your music and it just makes you stubborn. Sure, if you listen very very hard, you might hear a difference, but most people don't. You don't even have to really do this test. Tell someone to rip a cd on their computer into apple lossless and mp3 320 kbps, and probably 7 out of 10 won't be able to tell a difference.
 
Mar 18, 2008 at 4:42 AM Post #75 of 83
Quote:

Originally Posted by pez /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I think this arguement will always come to the same conclusion. Though most of us here spend lots on headphones and amps, people are in it more for the music, and not concentrating that that cymbal was .1dB louder with a lossless recording. IMHO, I think if you really have to argue this much about it, you can't fully enjoy your music and it just makes you stubborn.


If I've understood you correctly, we shouldn't care about whether the equipment we spend $$$$ on actually sounds any better, and if we argue about it, it means we can't enjoy the music and are stubborn?

I would've thought that a whole bunch of people who have a habit of stretching the limits of plausibility (Patrick82 springs to mind) would jump on this thread to prove once and for all their amazing hearing. Since they haven't, either they haven't seen it or are not submitting their results because they can't tell the difference. I think, judging by the number of views this thread has compared to the number of submitted results, it's mostly the latter.
 
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