[Tunkejazz]

I have a K-R 6C8G. I haven't had a good listen to it yet (it was especially buzzy with the 6F8G to 12AU7 adapter). If you get the 6F8G to 6DJ8 adapter, please let us know if you get any weird noises.

Anyways, I have had a good listen to my Raytheon JAN 6F8G.




I'm still getting used to the lingo, so YMMV. I used my K7XX cans with the Raytheon. I do still get the buzzing in the left channel, but it is low enough to not need my grounding wire hack.

The actual character of this tube is transparent and fairly balanced. It's one of the more neutral tubes I've listened to. I remember saying earlier I thought this tube had punchy bass. I need to amend that to say the attack is punchy - it's not as bass-heavy as I might have made it out to be. The Raytheon is much faster than the RCA 6F8G. Sounds hit hard when they arrive but don't linger. There's no sign of sibilance or heavy reverb. The soundstage is nice and spacious. Overall, I like this tube much more than the RCA.

But then...what about the bass amount? I understand it is not bass-light nor bass-heavy. Just the "right-amount" of good quality bass? -> EDIT: no point to ask that question, your explanation was great already.

 

[Astral Abyss]

I just checked, mine are Reflektor 6N23P from 1974 with gray shields single wire.

Edit: I paid $35 + shipping for a pair, I think I was quite lucky.

 
I believe rb2013 normally sells those for $89 a pair.  $35 is a great price, although, if one of yours died after a week, maybe not so lucky.  Those are some of the best Reflektors out there that you have.

 

[Tunkejazz]

   
I believe rb2013 normally sells those for $89 a pair.  $35 is a great price, although, if one of yours died after a week, maybe not so lucky.  Those are some of the best Reflektors out there that you have.

I can only confirm your comments and I would encourage anyone with an Ember to try these tubes if finances allow. My 6N23P get a lot of time on the Ember-2 along with the Syl. Bad Boys, and IMHO overall both sound better than the 7193 (more clarity, better extension in both ends), although with a smaller soundstage than the latter.
 
Now I am waiting to receive the Visseaux and the RCA 6C8G (with the corresponding adapters), let's see if I fall in love with the new flavor they give to the sound!

 

[richard51]

After 8 hours of listening with the metal tube westinghouse 6J5 on the moonsoon speakers and with my he 400 Hifiman  i can confirm that with my gear and my ears there is no comparison with the 7193 tube i had love for the last months...The 6J5 tube transform completely not only the soundstage but the cleanliness of all the spectrum made listenable for me some music i had not listen very much... For the choral music it was way better because each voice is more distinct and generally any group of instrument more distinctly heard...I thank all of you for that discovery...It seems  that there is no end in sight with the Ember...

 

 

[DecentLevi]

Good achievement Richard... don't hate on me for this, but... there's still better out there! I think all of us who have tried the Coke bottle shaped 6J5's have agreed the soundstage is larger. Then there's the recently infamous Visseaux that has me wallowing in sonic bliss and purity for weeks on end for both my electrostat and balanced amps without any desire to roll other tubes! 
 
Now on the other hand I'm not going out and saying this is the end-all, be-all. Because while the Viss. does ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong, I think there just may be something out there that just may surpass the natural realm... something I got cookin' top secret, and the possibility that from sheer random experimentation with the vast array of untapped other 6J5's, something better may be quantifiable. 

 

[richard51]

  Good achievement Richard... don't hate on me for this, but... there's still better out there! I think all of us who have tried the Coke bottle shaped 6J5's have agreed the soundstage is larger. Then there's the recently infamous Visseaux that has me wallowing in sonic bliss and purity for weeks on end for both my electrostat and balanced amps without any desire to roll other tubes! 
 
Now on the other hand I'm not going out and saying this is the end-all, be-all. Because while the Viss. does ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong, I think there just may be something out there that just may surpass the natural realm... something I got cookin' top secret, and the possibility that from sheer random experimentation with the vast array of untapped other 6J5's, something better may be quantifiable. 

i hate you but i thank you for all infos

 
 
by the way i wait for my coke bottle shape national union 6L5 tube ...Alas! i cannot afford the Visseaux now if i dont organize a bank robbery...

 

[Makiah S]

ugh my wallet is already crying lol an I only have a loaner Starlight II 

 

[tommo21]

I'm on a  "roll" again. Ordered me a 6F8G adapter and the following tubes:
 
Raytheon 6F8G
Tung-Sol 6F8G(if I win the auction)
National Union 6C8G
 
Franken Jr here I come

 

[Tunkejazz]

I'm on a  "roll" again. Ordered me a 6F8G adapter and the following tubes:

Raytheon 6F8G
Tung-Sol 6F8G(if I win the auction)
National Union 6C8G

Franken Jr here I come

Congrats! Looking forward to hearing your impressions. I also managed to source a Raytheon

I am done for a while!

 

[Mechans1]

Mr. Decent Levi,
It always troubles me to see the word infamous used incorrectly.  Here is a typical dictionary definition for infamous.

infamous

 

 

[in-fuh-muh s] /ˈɪn fə məs/
SpellSyllables

1. Synonyms
2. Examples
3. Word Origin

adjective
1. having an extremely bad reputation: an infamous city.


2. deserving of or causing an evil reputation; shamefully malign; detestable: an infamous deed.


3. Law.

• deprived of certain rights as a citizen, as a consequence of conviction of certain offenses.
• of or relating to offenses involving such deprivation.

I am not a word Nazi I make mistakes all of the time.  My grammar isn't very good either, but I want people to know what infamous actually means despite sounding like it should have a different definition.
 
 
Well you guys can keep loading the Ember with fabulous and expensive tubes, but at some point,, I don't know when,  you will find the limit the refinements in tube choices can  deliver due to the electronics in the amp.  That is not saying you can't improve the SQ a great deal with tube rolling.  I have found a pair of really nice 1966 NOS  Marconi ECC82/12AU7 made at the Madrid plant. 
Given that a 12AU7 is the "stock" tube and one which  the proprietor uses in the Ember some of the time.  (He told me he likes  a good RCA clear top from time to time.) 
I am curious about thie use of old separate triodes, I want to try it myself.  Has anyone found another single triode we might try? I guess the adapter guy is back from vacation.
A quick story, I saw a Bendix branded 6SN7 GT for sale on Ebay and put a $9.95 bid on it.  I was surprised when I got it and couldn't understand the lack of interest in it -until I nnoticed the EIA code on it 280 which means Raytheon.  So I got a used Raytheon for $14.00 with shipping.  It sounds pretty good actually. 

 

[sneaky415]

Originally Posted by Mechans1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
Given that a 12AU7 is the "stock" tube and one which  the proprietor uses in the Ember some of the time.  (He told me he likes  a good RCA clear top from time to time.) 
I am curious about thie use of old separate triodes, I want to try it myself.  Has anyone found another single triode we might try? I guess the adapter guy is back from vacation.
A quick story, I saw a Bendix branded 6SN7 GT for sale on Ebay and put a $9.95 bid on it.  I was surprised when I got it and couldn't understand the lack of interest in it -until I nnoticed the EIA code on it 280 which means Raytheon.  So I got a used Raytheon for $14.00 with shipping.  It sounds pretty good actually. 

 
There is another adapter that I don't think has been discussed in this forum. It is the 6sn7 to 37/76 adapter. You can use it with Jeremy's 6sn7 adapter, then you can use type 37 or type 76 tube in the Ember. It is a nice tube but not better than the 6j5g imho but it could be fun for someone who enjoys tube rolling. I have some Sylvania 76 tubes that i like to plug in once in a while just to get some variation.
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Dual-RCA-76-TO-6SN7GT-B65-CV1988-tube-converter-adapter-/201398487020?hash=item2ee44907ec:g:XOcAAOSwyQtVvETC

 

[HOWIE13]

  I'm on a  "roll" again. Ordered me a 6F8G adapter and the following tubes:
 
Raytheon 6F8G
Tung-Sol 6F8G(if I win the auction)
National Union 6C8G
 
Franken Jr here I come

 I've only got the RCA versions of Franken Jr, which I find very good in their different ways, so I'm very much looking forward to your impressions too.

 

[DecentLevi]

@Mechans1 I see now, the word infamous actually refers to a negative thing - which however is actually a vocabulary rather than a grammar error. 
 
True that there is a theoretical limit to how far you can enhance the sound of an amp with tube rolling, but that limit is not black & white; it is set only from the 'ear of the beholder'. Occasionally in the tube rolling hobby, fluke setups are discovered which are able to really take the amp's sound to new heights that are beyond what anybody could have previously guessed. 
 
The Ember amp is set up to accept dual triode tubes, so if using single triodes you would need to run them in dual mode using a dual adapter in order to get a stereo signal; as far as I understand.
 
I for one, believe there is still untapped potential from tubes that have been dormant for decades - waiting for somebody to finally put them to use! 

 

I think most of us here prefer to be an optimist.

 

[HOWIE13]

In answer to Mechans 1's apposite question ' has anyone found another single triode we might try' I have two on the go in Ember and Horizon3:
 
Zenith and Ken-Rad  6P5's, and Hytron E1148/VT232's. My impressions are similar in both amps.
 
The E1148 looks like a 7193 but has a longer bottle, so our helpful Chinese seller made a new adapter with a longer wire so they wouldn't stretch too much. 
 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1pc-Dual-E1148-VT232-CV1135-TO-6CG7-6FQ7-ECC88-6DJ8-tube-converter-adapter-/191763536185?hash=item2ca5ff5939:g:XgYAAOSw3KFWdlyy
 
I could still use the 7193 Franken Ember adapter but the wires were quite tight and I was concerned the soldered connections might eventually break.
 
The 6P5's, which I believe predate the 6J5's, are Zenith, which is a coke bottle shape, and the Ken-Rad is a straight bottle.
 
The Zenith is fairly fast, dynamic and very sweet sounding-a very good tube- but unfortunately it has quite a loud, intrusive hum which I can't at present remove by the usual earthing methods. I have another coming to see if it's just these two tubes. Hence I hesitated posting about them as I'm unsure if the hum is universal to this tube type, but if it's not then it's a fine sounding tube to me.
 
The Ken-Rad 6P5's don't hum and are actually very quiet. They are warm and glowing, a fraction down in dynamics, with a prominent bass. The mids and treble don't suffer though and the whole sound is refined and well ordered in a holographic sound stage. Some might find it too polite but I like them for solo piano and late night listening to relax and unwind. They won't get your adrenaline going though, and hence I don't think they will suit large scale orchestral music or a reverberant church acoustic. Nor are they likely to suit warm/bass heavy cans. They do go well with my K701's and DT 1770's though.
 
The E1148 was apparently used extensively in British Army tank radios in WW2- the 'E' designating 'Export' . Many were manufactured by Hytron, and there is a similar tube labeled VT232. I can't differentiate the two by their sound. This is a great tube to my ears and has many of the characteristics of the Visseaux. Without going into excessive hyperbolic jargon I would describe them as perfectly balanced with excellent instrument detail, separation, texturing and imaging. Timbre is very good too. They are quiet tubes with the usual big, holographic sound stage we have come to associate with these dual single triode set ups.
If you can't source a Visseaux I would say these, together with the 6L5's, would be worthy alternatives to try.
 
Here's some pics:
 

 
Zenith 6P5 in Horizon  
 
 
 

 
Hytron E1148 in Horizon (note the horizontal plates, each of which glows from both ends, as below)
 

 
 
 
 

 
Ken Rad 6P5 in Ember.

 

[DecentLevi]

Also the 'top secret' tube I was planning to give a try has been debunked, for the reason below which was given to me be Jeremy. I think this info. is also useful to consider when experimenting with new tubes:
 
(The Ember's heat current) "Maximum output is 1A with a little overhead. At the very very best with modification we can do 1.5A"
If running dual tubes you must make sure each tube does not draw more than approx. 0.6A at the most, at risk of damaging the heater circuit.