[Zurv]

==-- UPDATE-==
When i moved the unit away from my floor standing setup it is much better.
source of my problems there? No idea!

How are people liking this as a headphone amp? Did you AB it with something else?

One of the nice things when testing headphones vs speakers, is one normally has a bunch of headphones.
Also, in my odd setup (till i get my dac) is i'm running my bluesound node 2i digital out to my AVR Denon x8500h. Then pure direct to the PL. I also directly connected to bluesound to the PL. (Pure Direct mode shut off the fancy stuff in the AVR. No dsp, no room connection, it shuts off everything (including the display) to keep it as "pure" as it can be.)
the Denon has an headphone amp too.
So i can switch between the PL as AMP or the internal Denon. (also the dac in the denon was better than the bluesound, but then no one claimed that the bluesound had a great one.)
It didn't go well for the PL.
Headphones used: Focal Utopia and Meze Empyrean.
Nora Jones was screechy and painful on the Utopia. The Meze wasn't as bad but still not great (that thing is muddy in general.) With the meze I couldn't hear the background details like quiet symbol taps - but that was more a meze issue.
In Elton John's Your Song - the harp in the background (i think that is what it is.) sounded like a banjo on both headphones when on the PL.
blah. Everything sounded better using the Denon headphone jack. This wasn't just a personal coloring problem .. some of it was painful - like with the Nora Jones and the Utopia (on the PL)
I did check using my desktop setup. Hey, maybe i'm being picky when this is how it always sounds. (which i knew wasn't the case already as the Denon HP amp sounded better.) But, I'm still loving these headphones and songs at my desktop. But that has a a real dac and the mj2 (which i took a really long time to find tubes to make it sing.)
I spent maybe 6 hours deep into the night doing AB testing on songs that i know.

Sooo PL... For me it is still an improvement for the speakers vs in internal AMPs of the AVR - at less that reference sound. ( i'll be spending this weekend doing some critical listening with the speakers.) It also looks super cool (and will keep me warm in the winter.) I'm not so sure for the headphone amp part.
I only have 2 NOS tubes (so far.. SLOW MAIL!) and those did change the sound a bit - a little more sweetness but the bad was still there. I wasn't testing bad recordings. These are good recordings, lossless and sounded better on the AVRs HP amp which was the source to the PL.
No headphone amp should be making someone wince to Nora Jones.

hrmm.. lets see what i can do with tube rolling. I'm a little bummed right now.

 

[Strayngs]

I have a ifi Pro iCAN as well as the EVO 300i. Different sounds but both very good. I had a Utopia (which I sold to fund my speakers) And it paired very very very well with the primaLuna. My Dac is very good and My Turntable is no slouc. the Utopia sounded better with my PrimaLuna than with the Trafomatic Head 2 I Had. I would say it might be your source as my experience with My utopia and primaLuna is much different than what you described.

 

[Zurv]

i'm super sad today. Even as a speaker amp it doesn't sound great. I swapped in a Schiit Vidar and also tried a Schiit Aegir.. both sound MUCH better. The PL sounds like i'm using some $100 speakers (vs the $5000 ones i am using )
There is no meat on the bones.
I guess i'm comment to this thing as i ordered all these NOS tubes and new power tubes.

for the headphones.. the "source" is the same in the A/B test.

wife: "what did you do to break the music"

hey.. at least the buzzing is gone

Update:
let me move this monster to my desk and test it there.

OMG.. thank god.. much better here. Pretty amazing! (it could still use a little tweaking.. ie, coloring to my tastes. But that is expected)
now What is wrong in the other spot. It wasn't the source as it as i was A/B'n from the some one.

Now to hunt for the issue. argh! do i need to order all my cables again (and longer)

Maybe i say "**** it" and just use it my desk. Sadly, the amps there are monoblock that need xlr and my AVR doesn't have XLR....
(thank god their aren't any new flagship AVRs with hdmi 2.1... because i'd be tempted to get that.)

"hey zurv, i know you say it isn't the source, but are you sure you don't want to move the Yggy over to the FS setup?"

waaa.. you know you need to keep that one for a month (per power cycle) to sound its best! (Which.. does NOT make any sense!!)


UPDATE #2

I think it is power related. If i run a cable from the other side of the room, the PL sounds like it did when it was at my desk. (i'm making mess )

(yes, i know i'm talking to myself. )

 

[ThanatosVI]

i'm super sad today. Even as a speaker amp it doesn't sound great. I swapped in a Schiit Vidar and also tried a Schiit Aegir.. both sound MUCH better. The PL sounds like i'm using some $100 speakers (vs the $5000 ones i am using )
There is no meat on the bones.
I guess i'm comment to this thing as i ordered all these NOS tubes and new power tubes.

for the headphones.. the "source" is the same in the A/B test.

wife: "what did you do to break the music"

hey.. at least the buzzing is gone

Update:
let me move this monster to my desk and test it there.


OMG.. thank god.. much better here. Pretty amazing! (it could still use a little tweaking.. ie, coloring to my tastes. But that is expected)
now What is wrong in the other spot. It wasn't the source as it as i was A/B'n from the some one.

Now to hunt for the issue. argh! do i need to order all my cables again (and longer)

Maybe i say "**** it" and just use it my desk. Sadly, the amps there are monoblock that need xlr and my AVR doesn't have XLR....
(thank god their aren't any new flagship AVRs with hdmi 2.1... because i'd be tempted to get that.)

"hey zurv, i know you say it isn't the source, but are you sure you don't want to move the Yggy over to the FS setup?"

waaa.. you know you need to keep that one for a month (per power cycle) to sound its best! (Which.. does NOT make any sense!!)


UPDATE #2

I think it is power related. If i run a cable from the other side of the room, the PL sounds like it did when it was at my desk. (i'm making mess )

(yes, i know i'm talking to myself. )

Good luck with sorting out the issue.
Keep the pictures coming, the Amp looks much nicer on real screens than on the Marketing stuff

 

[Zurv]

I tried the dumb $500 power cable again (still on the extension cable).. and everything went to crap . (I have two of them too 1m and 2m versions. So it is the cable model. Oddly the cheaper snake oil AQ cables are fine.)
Here is something interesting with bass. I was playing with going through the AVR and LFE crossover. I liked bass through PL and the speakers vs PL speakers with LFE via subwoofer (from the AVR at different levels of crossover from 30hz-90hz.) The speakers are spec'd down to 30hz, but just because a speaker can do it doesn't mean it is ideal to do it. If i knew i wasn't going to use the subs I could have gone with the higher end model with another woofer (FS 409), that said, still sound great!. (The subs are still helpful in gaming, surround sound and movies.)

@ThanathosVI when are you getting yours?

 

[ThanatosVI]

I tried the dumb $500 power cable again (still on the extension cable).. and everything went to crap . (I have two of them too 1m and 2m versions. So it is the cable model. Oddly the cheaper snake oil AQ cables are fine.)
Here is something interesting with bass. I was playing with going through the AVR and LFE crossover. I liked bass through PL and the speakers vs PL speakers with LFE via subwoofer (from the AVR at different levels of crossover from 30hz-90hz.) The speakers are spec'd down to 30hz, but just because a speaker can do it doesn't mean it is ideal to do it. If i knew i wasn't going to use the subs I could have gone with the higher end model with another woofer (FS 409), that said, still sound great!. (The subs are still helpful in gaming, surround sound and movies.)

@ThanathosVI when are you getting yours?

This will still take a while.

Planned is in october as personal birthday gift to myself.
However I still need to convince my better half that there is enough space in the living room for such a big device...

 

[Zurv]

Just tell her (or him) It will keep you warm in the winter Put it next to the bed to keep you cozy (just cover up those blinding leds!)
If that fails, just say it is 1/2 the price it really is... then still get yelled at.
You are still a crazy person (which i'm 100% for) to just use it as a headphone amp. That said, now that mind is working. It is pretty amazing. I really love my mj2 with my months of tube rolling.. but yeah.. the stock PL beat it (and I've still not done any tube love for the PL.)
The PL is also much smaller than you'd think too.

 

[ThanatosVI]

Just tell her (or him) It will keep you warm in the winter Put it next to the bed to keep you cozy (just cover up those blinding leds!)
If that fails, just say it is 1/2 the price it really is... then still get yelled at.
You are still a crazy person (which i'm 100% for) to just use it as a headphone amp. That said, now that mind is working. It is pretty amazing. I really love my mj2 with my months of tube rolling.. but yeah.. the stock PL beat it (and I've still not done any tube love for the PL.)
The PL is also much smaller than you'd think too.

Well it is half the price of the Woo Audio Wa33 which I intended to get initially.
I actually found out about it by asking for conpetition to the wa33.

Then while reading I found out about a few Things that the primaluna does better and was personally Sold on it. Even if it is aktually a speaker amp with really good headphone Implementation.

I will keep you updated here if I manage to convice her.

Then we both have the Meze Empyrean on a primaluna.
Next year or two from now I will upgrade my DAC as well

 

[Zurv]

The KT150s showed up! They are pretty big.
Here is some p0rn:

As you can see I raised the PrimaLuna cage to have it fit with the KT 150. (It won't fit (not even close) when you using KT150s.) It looks a little odd close up, but you can't tell the diff when you are away from the unit. I personally like it better with the cage on.
How does it sound? No idea yet. From what i read they require burn-in. I got these from Upscale audio (which i'd strongly suggest people getting KT150 to do), and they already do some burning already for 70+ hours.

oh. yes, there is electric tape on the front of the unit. Nothing is wrong. i was just coving the super bright led lights.

 

[ThanatosVI]

The KT150s showed up! They are pretty big.
Here is some p0rn:







As you can see I raised the PrimaLuna cage to have it fit with the KT 150. (It won't fit (not even close) when you using KT150s.) It looks a little odd close up, but you can't tell the diff when you are away from the unit. I personally like it better with the cage on.
How does it sound? No idea yet. From what i read they require burn-in. I got these from Upscale audio (which i'd strongly suggest people getting KT150 to do), and they already do some burning already for 70+ hours.

Is it safe to have the cage touching the tubes?

I hope so, because I also greatly prefer the look with cage.

Gonna order 4 KT150S with my Evo 300 as well, I wonder if they cut me some nice Deal.

The pics are amazing, thanks for sharing

 

[Zurv]

Is it safe to have the cage touching the tubes?

I'm not sure if it is or isn't, but in my case the cage isn't touching the tubes. There is about 1/2 inch between them.

also, video on KT150 from upscale

 

[ThanatosVI]

I'm not sure if it is or isn't, but in my case the cage isn't touching the tubes. There is about 1/2 inch between them.

also, video on KT150 from upscale

What did you use to raise the cage?

 

[Zurv]

Yeah, these units sing with the KT150s. Also as everyone says, it brings more impactful (not boomy or pointless) bass. This is seen in the headphone amp too (which i wonder what the impact would be.)
The sound stage seems a but more limited than the EL34s, but i think that is what the breaking in fixes. It isn't as bad as i was expecting (maybe because these have had some burn-in already.)
what is odd - i do not like the RCA blackplate with the KT150s. I like them much better than when using the EL34s. The Brimar CV4003 is the reverse. "OK" with the stock power tubes (and i like the stock chinese 12AU7 and RCA more.) Right now i'm running all Brimar CV4003 in driver and gain 12AU7 slots and KT150s in the power.

Did i say these are f'd hot!??! They are. For the first hour it smelled like my GF was using a hair iron.
I still wonder what kinda output these have at 4 ohms. I guess we'll never know. But, (unneeded) this unit is at almost 100wpc with the K150s in ultra mode. I say unneeded as i didn't have a problem before the EL43.. nor in triode mode (which would be 38wpc at 8ohms.)

Another random pix (with the RCAs in gain):

 

[Zurv]

Hi peeps,

Can someone that owns an EVO tell me if their hear a slight hum/buz? (This is different that my other issue.. which was a fan.. boo)
I found 2 others with integrated units that are getting this. What is in common is that we are all using HT mode (which bypasses the pre, so the amp is at full output.)
But, like me, they still hear the noise if they move the vol up on the other inputs.

I sent an email to PL US support (which i think is Upscale audio)

Email sent:

Hi PrimaLuna Support (upscale support?) J,

I’m having an issue with my EVO 400 integrated. (I also found 2 others that have the same problem with the integrated – but they are using EVO 300 i. I didn’t find people using just the EVO pre and EVO amp with this issue.)

When in HT mode there is a hum/buzzing. This can also be heard on all the other inputs. One can start hearing it at 9-10 o’clock on the volume. This can be hear with headphone and with speakers.

The noise is there even when no source is connected.

Troubleshooting:
Changed the tubes. I have the stock, NOS and KT150s. All have noise.
Different power cables. Stock, AQ NRG-Z3, AQ Monsoon, and random UL certified cables.
Moved away from anything that might give off EMI.
Connected directly to the wall or via AQ Niagara 1200 (I also tried different Niagara units. I have two.)
The unit by itself with only headphones connect directly to a wall jack that shares nothing. (It was once a jack for an AC. I think it might even be 20amp.) – no inputs, no speakers. (and changing cables and with and without the Niagara.)

I also shut off all power to my apt via the fusebox (is that what it is still called?) and only had this one jack/breaker live. Everything else was switched to off.

An example pix,

I have 5 other amps and none have is type of sound issue. Ie, they aren’t picking up issues (if there are issues) related to AC power.

Maybe other people with Evo integrated might not notice it as they aren’t using it in HT mode? (or play that loud? Maybe they wouldn’t notice it if it was loud because why would one have the vol up with no content playing?)

It is very clear with headphones. For the speakers you have to get right up on them.

Thoughts? Ideas? Integrated problem? Maybe try a unit in HT mode and put some headphone on it? Are you hearing the same thing?
(wasn’t there a problem with the older Integrated units? Something about the headphones.)

Thanks!

Anyone else seeing this? headphone only user? move the vol up and test please
Also, thoughts? If it knew it was power i could get a AC regenerator or something. But if it is the EVO integrated model itself....
(*note, this is minor issue for speaker use, but for headphones.. maybe something to worry about.)

 

[Focux]

if one does not intend to change tubes, is opting for the EVO100 over 200 make more sense?