[214324]

 

  You're getting this completely wrong. The stuff they use in flash drives and SSDs are completely different. There's a reason we see servers using SSDs and not flash drives for storage.
 
The tech used for flash drive NAND chips is eMMC which is cheap to make and poor performance. Solid state drives use a much more different kind of NAND, which is why we don't see our flash drives with NAND capable of doing 700-900MB/s of read/write like most SSDs do nowadays (ignoring interface limitations).
 
And here's the TLC lifespan article if you want some numbers for the shortest living type of NAND we can find in consumer SSDs right now: http://www.anandtech.com/show/6459/samsung-ssd-840-testing-the-endurance-of-tlc-nand
 
Keep in mind that lifespan depends on the amount of NAND chips you have as well since wear is spread over all of the chips. Even with a 128GiB TLC SSD you're looking at 11.7 years at 10GiB of read/write per day. That doubles with 256GiB drives and etc.
 
There is no reason to just keep the OS on disk. You're wasting free space and time (since it loads up programs waaaay way faster) by just having OS on there. You only get a boot speed boost and that's it. Everything from there on out is slow if it's not regarding the OS.
 
I don't know where you thought SSDs use eMMC like flash drives but that is completely wrong. There are countless servers that use ONLY SSDs as their storage medium and they write hundreds to thousands of gigabytes per day (if not even more). If they used eMMC, sure they'd be dead in a few days but there's a reason these servers can use SSDs.

Thanks for the clarification. 
 
When I first googled what SSD is and what is it made of, someone write that it is made of the same thing as USB flash drives, and they will eventually reach out of data. 
 
I was curious about TRIM, or what they use to not re-write the same cells. Is this feature embedded in the firmware of the SSD, or the OS should do this?

TRIM is OS side, Garbage Collection is built into the SSD.
 
I'll explain quickly why we have these 2 things for SSDs but not HDDs along with the differences between them. HDD's can rewrite over old data without any issues.
 
NAND chips, however, cannot do this; You have to erase the old data before you can write in new data. Our operating systems don't have a built in mechanism to do this because they're adapted to HDDs; they only mark the space as empty but the data is still there and, since NAND chips cannot write onto places with existing data, you end up with this dud space that's marked as empty but cannot be written to.
 
So in order to further explain GC and TRIM you need to know the structure of SSDs (most modern storage devices use this structure actually). Everything is broken into different layers of organization. The first layer is the hardware layer, aka "blocks." On SSDs, however, blocks are broken up into "pages" which are made up of some individual NAND cells. Pages are the smallest units SSDs can write to (they're usually 8KB acording to ArsTechnica).
 
Operating systems can't see the physical structures of our drives; they only see some total volume and some other stuff. Operating systems use file systems that adds another organizational layer on top of the physical structure discs have and it sets its own cluster size and way of distributing files. You start to see the disconnect between OS and HDD/SSD: the OS only sees the file system, so it's up to the SSD controller to know how to write the data to the NAND chips.
 
So SSD fundamentals: SSDs can read and write at the page level but for some reason they cannot ERASE at the page level. They can only erase entire blocks since the high voltage they apply will end up also wiping or altering all the other pages within the block.
 
So in order to get around this, SSD controllers have a built in routine called garbage collection. The OS only marks pages as stale/empty and the controller can see that. What garbage collection does is it looks in every block for all the good and stale pages, then copies all of the good pages to an empty block, then wipes everything in that old block and marks it ready to use. It gets weird though since when a file system has something marked as "deleted" it can still look like a good page in some occasions and ends up being copied by GC.
 
This is where the TRIM command comes in (it's not an acronym. Technically it's just Trim). TRIM is the bridge between the file system and blocks that helps SSDs mark pages as stale when the contents of those pages are deleted so garbage collection can do its job properly, aka not copying stale pages over that should have been deleted. Note that TRIM is not a replacement for GC, they work together.
 
TRIM isn't that necessary anymore since GC algorithms have gotten good enough to not need it but it makes the process more efficient and helps avoid GC marking stale pages as good.
 
Sources: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/04/ask-ars-my-ssd-does-garbage-collection-so-i-dont-need-trim-right/
http://www.thessdreview.com/daily-news/latest-buzz/garbage-collection-and-trim-in-ssds-explained-an-ssd-primer/

 

[Duncan]

Hmm...

I hate Windows 10...

So, I now have 980ti SLI setup - and, when booting up, right click function doesn't work, and windows pop up blank - the only way to fix this is to project to my TV, and then project back to the main display - any clue as to what this may be?

I don't really want to revert back to 8.1 but, if I cannot fix things, then I might just have to...

To add insult to injury I went overkill and bought an AX1500i PSU - haha, highest wattage I've seen so far is 900, but - I guess I've got good efficiency (94%) and am pretty future proofed for PSU power...

 

[Dobrescu George]

Hmm...

I hate Windows 10...

So, I now have 980ti SLI setup - and, when booting up, right click function doesn't work, and windows pop up blank - the only way to fix this is to project to my TV, and then project back to the main display - any clue as to what this may be?

I don't really want to revert back to 8.1 but, if I cannot fix things, then I might just have to...

To add insult to injury I went overkill and bought an AX1500i PSU - haha, highest wattage I've seen so far is 900, but - I guess I've got good efficiency (94%) and am pretty future proofed for PSU power...

 
Have you tried running your video card in single setup, instead of SLI? There might be incompatibilities with video drivers, and you should also ask Nvidia. They are pretty good guys, though they take a lot to answer. I know that some software have problem with SLI setups. 

  TRIM is OS side, Garbage Collection is built into the SSD.
 
I'll explain quickly why we have these 2 things for SSDs but not HDDs along with the differences between them. HDD's can rewrite over old data without any issues.
 
NAND chips, however, cannot do this; You have to erase the old data before you can write in new data. Our operating systems don't have a built in mechanism to do this because they're adapted to HDDs; they only mark the space as empty but the data is still there and, since NAND chips cannot write onto places with existing data, you end up with this dud space that's marked as empty but cannot be written to.
 
So in order to further explain GC and TRIM you need to know the structure of SSDs (most modern storage devices use this structure actually). Everything is broken into different layers of organization. The first layer is the hardware layer, aka "blocks." On SSDs, however, blocks are broken up into "pages" which are made up of some individual NAND cells. Pages are the smallest units SSDs can write to (they're usually 8KB acording to ArsTechnica).
 
Operating systems can't see the physical structures of our drives; they only see some total volume and some other stuff. Operating systems use file systems that adds another organizational layer on top of the physical structure discs have and it sets its own cluster size and way of distributing files. You start to see the disconnect between OS and HDD/SSD: the OS only sees the file system, so it's up to the SSD controller to know how to write the data to the NAND chips.
 
So SSD fundamentals: SSDs can read and write at the page level but for some reason they cannot ERASE at the page level. They can only erase entire blocks since the high voltage they apply will end up also wiping or altering all the other pages within the block.
 
So in order to get around this, SSD controllers have a built in routine called garbage collection. The OS only marks pages as stale/empty and the controller can see that. What garbage collection does is it looks in every block for all the good and stale pages, then copies all of the good pages to an empty block, then wipes everything in that old block and marks it ready to use. It gets weird though since when a file system has something marked as "deleted" it can still look like a good page in some occasions and ends up being copied by GC.
 
This is where the TRIM command comes in (it's not an acronym. Technically it's just Trim). TRIM is the bridge between the file system and blocks that helps SSDs mark pages as stale when the contents of those pages are deleted so garbage collection can do its job properly, aka not copying stale pages over that should have been deleted. Note that TRIM is not a replacement for GC, they work together.
 
TRIM isn't that necessary anymore since GC algorithms have gotten good enough to not need it but it makes the process more efficient and helps avoid GC marking stale pages as good.
 
Sources: http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/04/ask-ars-my-ssd-does-garbage-collection-so-i-dont-need-trim-right/
http://www.thessdreview.com/daily-news/latest-buzz/garbage-collection-and-trim-in-ssds-explained-an-ssd-primer/

 
Thanks. It was pretty interestin reading that. 
 
Seems that my concerns regarding SSDs were un-based., 

 

[62ohm]

Hmm...

I hate Windows 10...

So, I now have 980ti SLI setup - and, when booting up, right click function doesn't work, and windows pop up blank - the only way to fix this is to project to my TV, and then project back to the main display - any clue as to what this may be?

I don't really want to revert back to 8.1 but, if I cannot fix things, then I might just have to...

To add insult to injury I went overkill and bought an AX1500i PSU - haha, highest wattage I've seen so far is 900, but - I guess I've got good efficiency (94%) and am pretty future proofed for PSU power...

 
Overkill PSU user unite! Though my PSU is not as overkill as yours haha (EVGA P1200).

 

[VXAce]

H-Hybrid asked for it.
 

 
Not completely used to touch typing yet, so there are keys there to help me some.

 

[vantt1]

How do I go about cloning a 60 GB SSD system drive to a larger, 120 GB one of the same model so I don't have to reinstall Windows and all that? I can connect both drives to another computer via SATA III to do the cloning. Any software that you might recommend?

 

[VXAce]

  How do I go about cloning a 60 GB SSD system drive to a larger, 120 GB one of the same model so I don't have to reinstall Windows and all that? I can connect both drives to another computer via SATA III to do the cloning. Any software that you might recommend?

No software to recommend honestly, some drives come with cloning software but I recommend just reinstalling. Pain in the ass but usually come out on top.

 

[deadlylover]

I used EaseUS ...something a long time ago, just look for free drive cloning or ssd migration software and you'll find a bunch. It's especially simple because you're upgrading to a larger capacity.

 

[vantt1]

I used EaseUS ...something a long time ago, just look for free drive cloning or ssd migration software and you'll find a bunch. It's especially simple because you're upgrading to a larger capacity.

Yeah, I use EaseUS' Partition Master all the time and it works great. I saw they did have a disk cloning one as well, so I'll give that a try when I feel like it.

 

[gopanthersgo1]

How do I go about cloning a 60 GB SSD system drive to a larger, 120 GB one of the same model so I don't have to reinstall Windows and all that? I can connect both drives to another computer via SATA III to do the cloning. Any software that you might recommend?

I've used Macrium Reflect Free a few times, works perfectly!
[rule]
Using the deal Boweii posted, I got a fully spec'd out XPS 13 with a 2 year protection plan for $1,078 plus tax. (The code wouldn't work on Saturday, so I called them today and they would make the offer valid if I bought the warranty)
Specs:
6th Generation Intel Core i7-6500U (Dual core, but this won't be a PC for intensive tasks)
Windows 10 Professional
8GB LPDDR3 1866MHz (Soldered. )
256GB PCIe Solid State Drive
Integrated GPU
13.3” QHD+ (3200 x 1800) InfinityEdge touch display
2 Years Premium Support
[rule]
It's my first laptop, so I'm excited!

 

[VXAce]

Dunno if you saw it... http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-15-7559-laptop/pd
 
Linus did a video on that, personally would have gotten that. Haha. Possibly my next laptop there, balanced in almost every way possible.

 

[bowei006]

I've used Macrium Reflect Free a few times, works perfectly!

---

Using the deal Boweii posted, I got a fully spec'd out XPS 13 with a 2 year protection plan for $1,078 plus tax. (The code wouldn't work on Saturday, so I called them today and they would make the offer valid if I bought the warranty)
Specs:
6th Generation Intel Core i7-6500U (Dual core, but this won't be a PC for intensive tasks)
Windows 10 Professional
8GB LPDDR3 1866MHz (Soldered.

)
256GB PCIe Solid State Drive
Integrated GPU
13.3” QHD+ (3200 x 1800) InfinityEdge touch display
2 Years Premium Support

---

It's my first laptop, so I'm excited!

Nice panthers!
 
but do note that a new XPS 13 is comming out in the next month or two with an update to IRIS PRO graphics. That however will be at full price and most likely wont get the same discount treatment.

 

[bowei006]

  Dunno if you saw it... http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-15-7559-laptop/pd
 
Linus did a video on that, personally would have gotten that. Haha. Possibly my next laptop there, balanced in almost every way possible.

Yep, one of the first laptops I saw
 
It's a great spec'd and priced laptop but that is where it ends.
 
Panthers and I needed a laptop that was basically a born-again-Windows Mac computer. Meaning great build, keyboard feel, and super light and thin. His isn't gaming oriented though.
 
The Dell 7559 at minimum is 8.7Lbs with most real life loadouts hitting 9Lbs (Dell doesn't include some stuff in their 8.7Lbs weight mark)
 
It has very average build with reviewers noting that it was more akin to the laptop shell of a $500 laptop and the keyboard of something super cheap.
 
 
At 9Lbs, above average in thickness, squishy keyboard/touchpad, and average build. It didn't make the list for what I needed.
 
 
The Dell XPS 15 I ordered, if I put in the standard battery, will be 3.9Lbs (4.2Lbs w/ big battery and 4.3+ with 4K screen+ big battery) and thinner than the new retina MBP 15". It also has much higher specs with an i7 6700HQ (Quad Core and 8 Threads) and a NVMe SSD at a top rate of 2GB/s.
 
The Dell 7559 is currently $800 with a coupon and maybe $750 if you are lucky with regular price at $900. That one only has the most basic layout with a standard hard drive. 
 
 
It's really different ideals. 

 

[gopanthersgo1]

Nice panthers!

but do note that a new XPS 13 is comming out in the next month or two with an update to IRIS PRO graphics. That however will be at full price and most likely wont get the same discount treatment.

Is that the only update? On-board will be more than enough for me, I won't game or do any intensive work besides some programming if I feel like it.

Yep, one of the first laptops I saw

It's a great spec'd and priced laptop but that is where it ends.

Panthers and I needed a laptop that was basically a born-again-Windows Mac computer. Meaning great build, keyboard feel, and super light and thin. His isn't gaming oriented though.

The Dell 7559 at minimum is 8.7Lbs with most real life loadouts hitting 9Lbs (Dell doesn't include some stuff in their 8.7Lbs weight mark)

It has very average build with reviewers noting that it was more akin to the laptop shell of a $500 laptop and the keyboard of something super cheap.


At 9Lbs, above average in thickness, squishy keyboard/touchpad, and average build. It didn't make the list for what I needed.


The Dell XPS 15 I ordered, if I put in the standard battery, will be 3.9Lbs (4.2Lbs w/ big battery and 4.3+ with 4K screen+ big battery) and thinner than the new retina MBP 15". It also has much higher specs with an i7 6700HQ (Quad Core and 8 Threads) and a NVMe SSD at a top rate of 2GB/s.

The Dell 7559 is currently $800 with a coupon and maybe $750 if you are lucky with regular price at $900. That one only has the most basic layout with a standard hard drive. 


It's really different ideals. 

Exactly, I am looking for size, weight, battery, display, keyboard, and trackpad in a laptop. I could get a quad-core with a discrete gpu probably for the price, but, that just is not what I am looking for. If a laptop doesn't feel nice, it will just feel cheapy no matter the specs, IMO.

 

[VXAce]

If that's what you are looking for, then I guess so. It's a different ideal from what I look for in a laptop so I can't really say. Paying a premium for a laptop that is locked up and unable to upgrade or work on right off the shelf is kind of silly to me, and getting used to a slightly meh keyboard or a slightly meh frame (the Dell 7559 seems pretty well built to me, especially at the price they are giving it) is something I'm willing to give up for. Weight is almost never an issue for me, only size and the Dell 7559 does just fine for size.
 
We just are looking for different things.