[nc8000]

What ear tips are these ? The only way I could get a decent and (reasonably) lasting seal with the M3s was by ramming in the Final E LL (or Comply T200) in my ear canals and that was just not sustainable for long sessions, not counting the annoyance at having to fit them in again if they had to be pulled out. Contrast to the APP that you just drop in your ear in job done, and you can keep them for hours with zero pressure/pain. There's really no contest. As for ANC in a "controlled" environment with this "Cabin Noise" video below at full volume the APP do nearly as well as the "best in class" QC25 and slightly better than the Sony's, what more can you ask for ? Ah yes, a better price

I’m also using the Final E LL and have no problem keeping the in and in place for 6-8 hours in a stretch with absolutely no pain or discomfort. With the XM3 you have the option of hunting and rolling tips for the best fit whereas it seems that the APP have a custom tip in 3 sizes so either they fit you out of the box or you are out of luck as you cant go and buy something else (although I suspect that when the APP sells in huge numbers as they almost certainly will there will be third party tips for them)

 

[webvan]

That's true but with the way they're designed I can't see them not working for anyone (and I have not see any single complaint here or on YT/Reviews). Unlike the Sony's you do not insert them into your ear canal, they rest just outside and have large "floppy" tips that cover the entrance of your ear canal and stay there thanks to the gentle pressure of the shell against your ear. The only issue I can see is that the tips are so thin that they could tear in the long run. But yes third party tips will likely become available. Maybe even some "thicker" ones to possibly provide more passive isolation.

 

[jaymbee]

Maybe even some "thicker" ones to possibly provide more passive isolation.

I'd like to see 3rd party tips, but crucially they'll have to fit inside the charging case to retain the AirPods' convenience.

 

[nc8000]

Just went back to try my Earin M2 and boy do I love their form factor, wish the features and sound of the XM3 could be had in that size

 

[nanaholic]

What ear tips are these ? The only way I could get a decent and (reasonably) lasting seal with the M3s was by ramming in the Final E LL (or Comply T200) in my ear canals and that was just not sustainable for long sessions, not counting the annoyance at having to fit them in again if they had to be pulled out. Contrast to the APP that you just drop in your ear in, job done, and you can keep them for hours with zero pressure/pain. There's really no contest. As for ANC in a "controlled" environment with this "Cabin Noise" video below at full volume the APP do nearly as well as the "best in class" QC25 and slightly better than the Sony's, what more can you ask for ? Ah yes, a better price

I'm using the Fender SureSeal Tips
https://www.aiuto-jp.co.jp/products/product_2709.php

I was in the office today with a couple of Japanese co-workers coming into work for the entire week while being sick and were coughing like crazy so I put on the APP hoping I can block out their coughing so I won't be so bothered. The APP DID NOT block their coughing sound at all. The ANC on the APP is merely good enough for background low frequency noise but is not good enough for speech and human voice - which I think is build better into the NC of the Sony as we know we can tune the level of the filtering targeting specifically for human speech frequency which is not possible with the APP, the M3 with good tips is simply much better and I wish I had them today just for this situation.

 

[webvan]

It's not the "ANC on the APP", it's excellent, best in class with the Forcefeed+feedback combo, it's ANC in general that only blocks out recurring noises, nothing new here, hence the requirement for good passive isolation, one of the reasons I didn't keep the QC20 that provide very little passive isolation. The APPs are a lot better than the QC20 and are a good compromise for me between perfect fit/comfort/isolation with the stock (and only fitting so far) tips. Since you didn't have the M3s there's really no way you can know how the would have performed but chances are you would have heard your colleagues coughing like crazy too. Heck, even with QC25's or WH-1000Xm3s you would have heard them, just more faintly

 

[nanaholic]

It's not the "ANC on the APP", it's excellent, best in class with the Forcefeed+feedback combo, it's ANC in general that only blocks out recurring noises, nothing new here, hence the requirement for good passive isolation, one of the reasons I didn't keep the QC20 that provide very little passive isolation. The APPs are a lot better than the QC20 and are a good compromise for me between perfect fit/comfort/isolation with the stock (and only fitting so far) tips. Since you didn't have the M3s there's really no way you can know how the would have performed but chances are you would have heard your colleagues coughing like crazy too. Heck, even with QC25's or WH-1000Xm3s you would have heard them, just more faintly

That is simply not true - because I've programmed NC before as part of my DSP studies in university.

ANC is about digital signal processing, the fundamental is doing a sound recording (hence the external mic), perform a simple delay reverse signal transformation, and overly it with the output, but the issue with that is once you combined it with the source signal not only will it remove the noise it also severely distorts the signal you want remaining, this is why tuning an ANC is difficult and why makers starts to introduce predictive filtering into their algorithms and balancing it between being sufficiently good at cancelling the noise while not distort the sound you want remaining. Because ANC is done in the digital domain, if you know what you are doing, you can target specific frequencies very accurately in the transformation and add it into the system - that's actually how sonar works but that's a different topic.

Apple may claim best in class but experience shows Sony simply has a better ANC algorithm than Apple - again as proven they have an algorithm that can specifically target human speech frequencies and patterns and allowing you to tune how much human voice gets let through via the app, because they've been in the game longer. Bose used to be the best as well until Sony tuned their ANC enough to match them. ANC CAN be made to be very good - and Apple's current implementation is simply not good enough yet and it shows with just a day of real world usage in my experience.

Also I've had the M3 longer and had them on trains with people coughing, they don't come through.

 

[webvan]

Can't hear people coughing in the train ? Come on, with no music I could hear people talk in the train and the plane with the Comply T-200s or the Final E LL's rammed in...Anyway, next time, have your XM3s with you when your colleagues are coughing like crazy and see how well they do, the only meaningful way to do comparisons.

 

[nc8000]

I can certainly hear human voices when no music is playing with anc active on both my XM3 (full size and in ear) but clearly less than without phones or with anc disabled and how loud also depends on which anc setting I choose in the Sony app so some reduction is due to anc and some to passive isolation. With music playing there is no meaningfull outside noise at about 50% on the volume and I’ve yet to go over 60% no matter what the surroundings

 

[john galley]

Newbie .. so forgive me if this has already been discussed.. i have recently bought the WF-1000XM3...and at present the verdict is in the balance.. to my point the seal in the ear the Left fits nice and snug but the Right is causing problems in getting to fit snug .. i am using the large Tips, but i am thinking maybe try 3rd party tips rather than the supplied Tips .. along the line of Comply True Grip Pro or Spinfit 360 .. A . Will these fit the WF-XM3 or have any members have other suggestion's i could try.. Thanks.

 

[wowser]

John, are you using the foam tips or the silicone ones?

 

[wowser]

Now got the 360 audio thing popping up on my app. The ear analysis works, but when I try to optimise it for Tidal, it won't connect to the server. Anyone else having issues? (May all be moot as the sample 360 songs sound a bit odd).

 

[nc8000]

Newbie .. so forgive me if this has already been discussed.. i have recently bought the WF-1000XM3...and at present the verdict is in the balance.. to my point the seal in the ear the Left fits nice and snug but the Right is causing problems in getting to fit snug .. i am using the large Tips, but i am thinking maybe try 3rd party tips rather than the supplied Tips .. along the line of Comply True Grip Pro or Spinfit 360 .. A . Will these fit the WF-XM3 or have any members have other suggestion's i could try.. Thanks.

I use these as the stock large where too small for me

http://www.hifiheadphones.co.uk/final-silicone-eartips-type-e-black-ll-3-pairs.html

 

[john galley]

John, are you using the foam tips or the silicone ones?

It's the Grey which i think are silicone .. i am finding noise cancelling is just absent with not being able to get a good seal with the supplied tips.

 

[wowser]

I'd try the ones suggested above (Final Audio). I actually trimmed the nozzle on those to get them to fit closer to the earphone. That said, don't expect miracles with the NS.