New Schiit! Ragnarok and Yggdrasil

[SearchOfSub]

Any reason why I can't find a Ragnarok for sale? Schiit has a production date of 6/3 . Been trying for over a week now.

IDK. Is the Amp even good?

 

[kazsud]

Yes, maybe there is a new version coming...

 

[johnjen]

The Rok is a VERY good HP amp.
And a VERY good speaker amp.

In some ways it is still a SotA amp and can hold it's own against much more expensive amps.
And primarily being a balanced device (which can accommodate SE) it is somewhat unique because it handles both HP's and speakers.

But it's ability to handle HP's with authority due to its very low output Ω (0.03Ω) and it's high class A bias (4w/ch), means all but the most power hungry HP's are operating in class A mode with power reserves that keep the amp coasting along, with ease.

Yeah it's big, and heavy, and runs warm(er), and clicks when the big knob in front gets twisted, but it's sonic presentation is wonderful by any measure that matters to me.

And it doesn't come as much of a surprise to me that there aren't many on the used market, since it fulfills such a unique role and there aren't many other options, let alone better ones.

JJ

 

[Snowpuppy77]

The Rok is a VERY good HP amp.
And a VERY good speaker amp.

In some ways it is still a SotA amp and can hold it's own against much more expensive amps.
And primarily being a balanced device (which can accommodate SE) it is somewhat unique because it handles both HP's and speakers.

But it's ability to handle HP's with authority due to its very low output Ω (0.03Ω) and it's high class A bias (4w/ch), means all but the most power hungry HP's are operating in class A mode with power reserves that keep the amp coasting along, with ease.

Yeah it's big, and heavy, and runs warm(er), and clicks when the big knob in front gets twisted, but it's sonic presentation is wonderful by any measure that matters to me.

And it doesn't come as much of a surprise to me that there aren't many on the used market, since it fulfills such a unique role and there aren't many other options, let alone better ones.

JJ

I second that. I own a Ragnarok and I honestly can't imagine anything making my HD800S sound better. Does a great job driving my big 100 lb each 88db efficient Paradigm Studio 100 v.2 speakers. I no longer feel the need for my NAD separate that I was using with these speakers. Very nice to have my TT and Yggy going to the amp that beautifully drives both my headphones and speakers. Plan on getting a new pair of speakers for them to drive. My speaker short list so far is the Harbeth 7es3, Magnepan (0.7 or 1.7i), Focal Aria 926, ATC SM11 V2, or Golden Ear Triton 2s. If anyone here is familiar with how these sound with the Ragnarok or have any speaker suggestions I would appreciate your opinion.

 

[alpovs]

But it's ability to handle HP's with authority due to its very low output Ω (0.03Ω)

Unfortunately it's only for balanced output impedance. Ragnarok's single-ended output impedance for headphones is very high. You have to look it up in the manual. They don't even mention it anywhere else.

 

[johnjen]

Yes that's true.
But I don't consider the SE HP output to have the same SQ as the balanced, and to the degree that I never use(d) it.
In fact I have yanked the TRS connector out completely, in preparation for my mods.

To me this is a balanced amp which can accommodate some SE connections, but for me the HP SE output just doesn't cut it.

And I kinda wish I could disconnect the summers from the output stream altogether, as they offer nothing of value for me.
And I figure they might just improve the SQ from the balanced output if they were not being fed any signal.
But the only way to know would be to try it, but that would take a schematic, or perhaps knowing what component to remove to disable that portion of the circuit.

JJ

 

[kazsud]

I find the EMAC sounds better with the HD800 S than my Rag when I had it. I wonder how the Vidar does w/ headphones on the speaker taps or the Hifi Man adapter.

 

[matbhuvi]

I am using Yggy with Denon 3500 avr (Pure Direct mode) and Marantz mm7055 5 channel power amp, driving Polk RTi A5 speakers. The setup is exceptionally detailed and spacious. I feel I am missing some warmth in midrange. I have to raise volume to get the weight I love. Then I realize that I am entering into 90db+ range. There is no distortion. But, can cause fatigue over long sessions. Not so practical. Anyone else faced that?

 

[rkt31]

I am using Yggy with Denon 3500 avr (Pure Direct mode) and Marantz mm7055 5 channel power amp, driving Polk RTi A5 speakers. The setup is exceptionally detailed and spacious. I feel I am missing some warmth in midrange. I have to raise volume to get the weight I love. Then I realize that I am entering into 90db+ range. There is no distortion. But, can cause fatigue over long sessions. Not so practical. Anyone else faced that?

Toe out your speaker a bit

 

[bagwell359]

I second that. I own a Ragnarok and I honestly can't imagine anything making my HD800S sound better. Does a great job driving my big 100 lb each 88db efficient Paradigm Studio 100 v.2 speakers. I no longer feel the need for my NAD separate that I was using with these speakers. Very nice to have my TT and Yggy going to the amp that beautifully drives both my headphones and speakers. Plan on getting a new pair of speakers for them to drive. My speaker short list so far is the Harbeth 7es3, Magnepan (0.7 or 1.7i), Focal Aria 926, ATC SM11 V2, or Golden Ear Triton 2s. If anyone here is familiar with how these sound with the Ragnarok or have any speaker suggestions I would appreciate your opinion.

I agree with this in general but not the 800S part - all 3 OTL tubes (cheap) and Violectric v281 sounded better or well better on the 800 and 800S than the Rag 1 in XLR or SE

Rag is great for speakers and planars and not bad w the HD-600 and HD-800 just not as good as the others

 

[bagwell359]

Yes that's true.
But I don't consider the SE HP output to have the same SQ as the balanced, and to the degree that I never use(d) it.
In fact I have yanked the TRS connector out completely, in preparation for my mods.

To me this is a balanced amp which can accommodate some SE connections, but for me the HP SE output just doesn't cut it.

And I kinda wish I could disconnect the summers from the output stream altogether, as they offer nothing of value for me.
And I figure they might just improve the SQ from the balanced output if they were not being fed any signal.
But the only way to know would be to try it, but that would take a schematic, or perhaps knowing what component to remove to disable that portion of the circuit.

JJ

For sure Every can even ones I don't like do better on XLR over SE - not huge with lower end stuff like HE-4XX but big plus with the rest

 

[Slackaveli]

You can lump me in as a skeptic who does not believe in "significant changes after the first x hours" - I have always firmly thought that the Occam's razor answer is that it is our ears slowly adjusting to new equipment, and not the other way 'round. (I should note that I have never bothered to see if there is any research which shows that spec measurements do change somewhat after a burn-in period...so if that has been done please feel free to show me, and I may no longer be so firm in my beliefs.

As a sub-note to this note, I will say that I absolutely do not believe that "measurements" are any requirement for great sound - but if the sound is actually changing, then something must be changing with the measured specifications.)

Having said that, this is simply a factual question. If you believe (or it is objectively proven) that burn-in periods do exist, then they must logically apply to all equipment - unless a manufacturer is coming out and claiming they have eliminated this problem via a special process/materials that no one else uses - and thus the only way to meet your "Item 1" would be for the manufacturer to burn it in themselves before shipping it to you. (Not a bad solution actually.) Otherwise, no matter what equipment you buy, there would have to be some burn-in time.

And if burn-in periods do not actually exist, then it doesn't matter if someone does claim "1000 hours" (which is ludicrous BTW) - there is no burn-in time and you do not need to listen to these claims at all, and simply start enjoying your new equipment.

So I guess your "Item 1" sounds like a weird requirement to me. Especially so given that a reasonable burn-in time really is not much of an inconvenience, other than having to keep it on for a few days once you bring it home. Given all the other things one might like from their digital sources, it seems a rather minor inconvenience of delayed gratification.

Have you never tried on a new pair of jeans? You legs and ass don't get used to them- they break in.

 

[Synergist969]

Have you never tried on a new pair of jeans? You legs and ass don't get used to them- they break in.

To Whom it May Concern:

Though I TOO am more than somewhat skeptical regarding electronic/audio component "break-in", (driver/driver-surrounds MECHANICAL break-in notwithstanding...(and yes, I DO understand that expectation bias sometimes DOES rear its "subjective" head... ...))

Regarding the 1st Generation Yggdrassil/("Yggy") that I purchased within the first 6-8(??) months of its manufacture...

I elected to try out the new, "flagship" D/A converter which had already garnered remarkable praise from professional reviewers...so I looked forward to hearing just what a high quality/"stand-alone" component could do...Well, when I first inserted it in my dedicated stereo audio chain I must admit that I was rather disappointed...it sounded somewhat harsh and soundstage-wise dimensionally "flat", and I genuinely thought that I would send it back...rather than eating the rather significant cost of the beast...and for the next 2-3 days, (leaving my stereo system on/"playing" continuously), I continued to feel dissiapointed in not only the "Yggy", but myself for my having been influenced by the professional "advertisments"... ... ...quietly loathing the necessity of repackaging it and sending it back to "Schiit Audio"...

HOWEVER...upon returning home from work on the fourth late afternoon, firmly expecting to continue to be disappointed in the "Yggy" and its audio presentation, I was amazed to hear what I thought was a nearly entirely different audio presentation, though remaining detailed, the music was "smooth" and natural all the way up, however, the MOST amazing transformation was the breadth and in particular the DEPTH of the soundstage that I heard...!...I was genuinely taken aback regarding the "instantaneous" change that occurred in the sonic presentation of my stereo system...

SO, despite MY being a skeptic, I HAVE experienced a very significant electrical audio component "break-in" effect...I do NOT have an explanation as to WHY the "Yggy" changed so dramatically, (it was totally unanticipated that after 3+ days of disappointment, with an expecation of the same in the forseeable future for that component...

Sincerely,
T.A.K.

 

[Slackaveli]

To Whom it May Concern:

Though I TOO am more than somewhat skeptical regarding electronic/audio component "break-in", (driver/driver-surrounds MECHANICAL break-in notwithstanding...(and yes, I DO understand that expectation bias sometimes DOES rear its "subjective" head... ...))

Regarding the 1st Generation Yggdrassil/("Yggy") that I purchased within the first 6-8(??) months of its manufacture...

I elected to try out the new, "flagship" D/A converter which had already garnered remarkable praise from professional reviewers...so I looked forward to hearing just what a high quality/"stand-alone" component could do...Well, when I first inserted it in my dedicated stereo audio chain I must admit that I was rather disappointed...it sounded somewhat harsh and soundstage-wise dimensionally "flat", and I genuinely thought that I would send it back...rather than eating the rather significant cost of the beast...and for the next 2-3 days, (leaving my stereo system on/"playing" continuously), I continued to feel dissiapointed in not only the "Yggy", but myself for my having been influenced by the professional "advertisments"... ... ...quietly loathing the necessity of repackaging it and sending it back to "Schiit Audio"...

HOWEVER...upon returning home from work on the fourth late afternoon, firmly expecting to continue to be disappointed in the "Yggy" and its audio presentation, I was amazed to hear what I thought was a nearly entirely different audio presentation, though remaining detailed, the music was "smooth" and natural all the way up, however, the MOST amazing transformation was the breadth and in particular the DEPTH of the soundstage that I heard...!...I was genuinely taken aback regarding the "instantaneous" change that occurred in the sonic presentation of my stereo system...

SO, despite MY being a skeptic, I HAVE experienced a very significant electrical audio component "break-in" effect...I do NOT have an explanation as to WHY the "Yggy" changed so dramatically, (it was totally unanticipated that after 3+ days of disappointment, with an expecation of the same in the forseeable future for that component...

Sincerely,
T.A.K.

Yggy OG1 behaved similarly to your experience, as did my Flux Mentor amp- although it sounded great to begin with and just expanded into a wider, deeper soundstage and improved imaging.
I can't really tell anybody the 'why' of it, and i remain skeptical of cable burn-in, with components there's something to it for sure.

 

[bagwell359]

To Whom it May Concern:

Though I TOO am more than somewhat skeptical regarding electronic/audio component "break-in", (driver/driver-surrounds MECHANICAL break-in notwithstanding...(and yes, I DO understand that expectation bias sometimes DOES rear its "subjective" head... ...))

Regarding the 1st Generation Yggdrassil/("Yggy") that I purchased within the first 6-8(??) months of its manufacture...

I elected to try out the new, "flagship" D/A converter which had already garnered remarkable praise from professional reviewers...so I looked forward to hearing just what a high quality/"stand-alone" component could do...Well, when I first inserted it in my dedicated stereo audio chain I must admit that I was rather disappointed...it sounded somewhat harsh and soundstage-wise dimensionally "flat", and I genuinely thought that I would send it back...rather than eating the rather significant cost of the beast...and for the next 2-3 days, (leaving my stereo system on/"playing" continuously), I continued to feel dissiapointed in not only the "Yggy", but myself for my having been influenced by the professional "advertisments"... ... ...quietly loathing the necessity of repackaging it and sending it back to "Schiit Audio"...

HOWEVER...upon returning home from work on the fourth late afternoon, firmly expecting to continue to be disappointed in the "Yggy" and its audio presentation, I was amazed to hear what I thought was a nearly entirely different audio presentation, though remaining detailed, the music was "smooth" and natural all the way up, however, the MOST amazing transformation was the breadth and in particular the DEPTH of the soundstage that I heard...!...I was genuinely taken aback regarding the "instantaneous" change that occurred in the sonic presentation of my stereo system...

SO, despite MY being a skeptic, I HAVE experienced a very significant electrical audio component "break-in" effect...I do NOT have an explanation as to WHY the "Yggy" changed so dramatically, (it was totally unanticipated that after 3+ days of disappointment, with an expecation of the same in the forseeable future for that component...

Sincerely,
T.A.K.

Frequently reported for the Yggy and Gungnir. It could have to do with "forming" or "reforming" capacitors. "Cooking" the moisture out of the caps... I know that my Gungnir sounds like crap until its been on for about 70 hours. I don't even take it to other folks homes because the one time I did, my friend insisted it was awful (and he was right).

Usually with amps and pre-amps in very good or better systems one can hear a difference from cold to full operating temp, but few cases like these mentioned above.

Another place capacitors really make themselves heard is when you go from standard poly to a film cap(s) in passive speaker crossovers and also bypass caps in SS amps across the output caps. Once they are broken in - for speaker caps up to hundreds of hours - that's it, never heard any changes after that unless you wait for 30-35 years...