[rlw6534]

Never tried Max, I am set at CD quality. But I will verify when I get home later.

That probably explains it. Thanks for the info!

 

[Joe Bloggs]

At present, i have the M 300 but I will be tempted by R4 once it shows on Amazon, how much of a sound upgrade is the R4 over the M 300... Just to say I own an R6 1st Gen whose battery has died, and also an R5 gen 1, which charges to 100 % but as soon as you use it, it drains to 0% in 30 mins, works perfectly if you keep it charging while using, but that defeats the whole object of the device... So that's why I would only buy from Amazon as they allow hassle-free returns and I need to test the battery life is good before it becomes a keeper, explained this in an E-Mail to Hiby but they never replied, another reason to buy from Amazon.

Hi John,

I can't be the one to answer how much the R4 has over M300 in sound quality. On a fundamental level, the R4 has more powerful and dedicated DAC and amplification hardware, systewide bitperfect audio and separate SE and balanced headphone ports for compatibility with a wider range and higher quality range of earphones and earphone cables. On a software level it has a whole host of systemwide audio improvement measures available for you to explore.

Yes, you may well buy from Amazon to facilitate hassle free returns, which we would love to offer to all our customers worldwide directly as well but for the fact that we would go bankrupt quickly if even 1 in 10 units were requested to be returned (hassle-free also means no rigorous reason needs be given, remember) and we underwrote all return costs worldwide (and have them all shipped from Alaska or wherever direct to China as it were). The hassle free returns available with Amazon and local resellers is facilitated by the fact that we pre-sell set numbers of units to them, and the returns only need be returned to them instead of all the way back to China. You may notice that their selling prices are nonetheless higher in most cases.

We are also more than happy to replace your batteries in or even out of warranty (for a nominal fee in the latter case), we just need the devices back in our China HQ if bought direct from us, because batteries by themselves we cannot ship out of China except illegally or at great cost. Although if you dug online for third party providers and a local electronics repair shop....

Best regards,
Joe

 

[o0genesis0o]

Hi John,

I can't be the one to answer how much the R4 has over M300 in sound quality. On a fundamental level, the R4 has more powerful and dedicated DAC and amplification hardware, systewide bitperfect audio and separate SE and balanced headphone ports for compatibility with a wider range and higher quality range of earphones and earphone cables. On a software level it has a whole host of systemwide audio improvement measures available for you to explore.

Yes, you may well buy from Amazon to facilitate hassle free returns, which we would love to offer to all our customers worldwide directly as well but for the fact that we would go bankrupt quickly if even 1 in 10 units were requested to be returned (hassle-free also means no rigorous reason needs be given, remember) and we underwrote all return costs worldwide (and have them all shipped from Alaska or wherever direct to China as it were). The hassle free returns available with Amazon and local resellers is facilitated by the fact that we pre-sell set numbers of units to them, and the returns only need be returned to them instead of all the way back to China. You may notice that their selling prices are nonetheless higher in most cases.

We are also more than happy to replace your batteries in or even out of warranty (for a nominal fee in the latter case), we just need the devices back in our China HQ if bought direct from us, because batteries by themselves we cannot ship out of China except illegally or at great cost. Although if you dug online for third party providers and a local electronics repair shop....

Best regards,
Joe

If my HiBy's batteries balloon up, I'll just bug you instead )

Is there a plan to implement the switching of DAC circuits for PCM signal in R4 as one post on Twitter mention?

 

[Safeinthemountains]

Hi John,

I can't be the one to answer how much the R4 has over M300 in sound quality. On a fundamental level, the R4 has more powerful and dedicated DAC and amplification hardware, systewide bitperfect audio and separate SE and balanced headphone ports for compatibility with a wider range and higher quality range of earphones and earphone cables. On a software level it has a whole host of systemwide audio improvement measures available for you to explore.

Yes, you may well buy from Amazon to facilitate hassle free returns, which we would love to offer to all our customers worldwide directly as well but for the fact that we would go bankrupt quickly if even 1 in 10 units were requested to be returned (hassle-free also means no rigorous reason needs be given, remember) and we underwrote all return costs worldwide (and have them all shipped from Alaska or wherever direct to China as it were). The hassle free returns available with Amazon and local resellers is facilitated by the fact that we pre-sell set numbers of units to them, and the returns only need be returned to them instead of all the way back to China. You may notice that their selling prices are nonetheless higher in most cases.

We are also more than happy to replace your batteries in or even out of warranty (for a nominal fee in the latter case), we just need the devices back in our China HQ if bought direct from us, because batteries by themselves we cannot ship out of China except illegally or at great cost. Although if you dug online for third party providers and a local electronics repair shop....

Best regards,
Joe

Hi again Joe,

Very interesting to get the POV from Hiby's side...
Back in 2022, I sent my R3 Back for repair as it had been subject to moisture/water and the mainboard was damaged.
As the R3 is quite light and thin the return fee from France was ~15€ as I remember (bubble enveloppe)
The spare pieces (mainboard+battery) were quite affordable if not cheap from EU POV, but if you add the way back shipping (25€) it starts to get close (120€) to the device initial value...

Also the whole process took ~2month, because the shipping was reaaaaally slow.

I like a lot my R5 from 2020 for its form factor, and the battery starts to show some signs of ageing. I could send it to Hiby HQ like the R3, but the shipping would probably be doubled as I need to put it in a proper box this time... And the delay...

Would it be possible to get the ref. number of the battery of the R5/R5 Saber ? Especially because it has finished its commercial life cycle.
I'm an electronics tech, so I can deal with the change of a battery... But as you stated, it seems quite difficult for Hiby to send some batteries to customers.

Thank you...

 

[fish1050]

Just finished reading the headfonia review, a bit of a mixed bag as far as the sound goes.

https://www.headfonia.com/hiby-r4-review/

The new R4 has a capable sound performance for the price, especially in neutral sound reproduction, speed and clarity. It has a neutral but clear character. It doesn’t sound very musical or full, and it is a faithful device to the recording. There are also very high technicalities for the price, a good amplifying power for most IEMs and not hard-to-drive headphones.

the presentation feels close and in front, providing a dynamic feel but not roomy and spacious. The layering performance isn’t great either, but that is expected from the price and the DAC chips inside.

When it comes to bass, the R4 has good speed and resolution. It has quite a quick attack & decay, which makes it dynamic for faster genres. but it lacks the kick and rumble that some users may prefer. The mid-bass section is hollow and lacks fullness, while the sub-bass is timid.

It will be interesting to read some posts hear about the sound once people get them in their hands.

 

[wj18]

At present, i have the M 300 but I will be tempted by R4 once it shows on Amazon, how much of a sound upgrade is the R4 over the M 300... Just to say I own an R6 1st Gen whose battery has died, and also an R5 gen 1, which charges to 100 % but as soon as you use it, it drains to 0% in 30 mins, works perfectly if you keep it charging while using, but that defeats the whole object of the device... So that's why I would only buy from Amazon as they allow hassle-free returns and I need to test the battery life is good before it becomes a keeper, explained this in an E-Mail to Hiby but they never replied, another reason to buy from Amazon.

Have you tried contacting Steve at npaudio.co.uk he's very responsive and highly professional and might be able to help and they also sell Hiby daps, Amazon isn't necessarily always the first place we should look at - especially if we want to give our local smaller dealers a chance to breathe.

 

[nioh]

If you are playing music on your DAP, you are using at least a few of points 1, 5, 6, 7, 8 even if you don't touch the software

More like 1, 5, 6 for me.
I never use Line Out on DAPs. I don’t hear any difference in filters.

 

[nioh]

Just finished reading the headfonia review, a bit of a mixed bag as far as the sound goes.

https://www.headfonia.com/hiby-r4-review/

The new R4 has a capable sound performance for the price, especially in neutral sound reproduction, speed and clarity. It has a neutral but clear character. It doesn’t sound very musical or full, and it is a faithful device to the recording. There are also very high technicalities for the price, a good amplifying power for most IEMs and not hard-to-drive headphones.

the presentation feels close and in front, providing a dynamic feel but not roomy and spacious. The layering performance isn’t great either, but that is expected from the price and the DAC chips inside.

When it comes to bass, the R4 has good speed and resolution. It has quite a quick attack & decay, which makes it dynamic for faster genres. but it lacks the kick and rumble that some users may prefer. The mid-bass section is hollow and lacks fullness, while the sub-bass is timid.

It will be interesting to read some posts hear about the sound once people get them in their hands.

Review sites almost always rate DAPs based on price. So it’s easy to say that the highest priced DAP will get the best review and the lower the price, obviously lesser the positive remarks.

 

[fish1050]

Review sites almost always rate DAPs based on price. So it’s easy to say that the highest priced DAP will get the best review and the lower the price, obviously lesser the positive remarks.

I don't agree with that statement, it depends more on the site doing the review. I trust headfonia for their reviews and have bought DAP's in the past based on their reviews. I have found their reviews very much in line with my opinions on the DAP's I bought.

The M0 Pro is a very cheap DAP yet they gave it a solid review despite the price. If your statement were true then I guess you can't trust any review sites so don't bother reading reviews at all.

 

[nioh]

If your statement were true then I guess you can't trust any review sites so don't bother reading reviews at all.

Exactly my point. Even more so, these review sites won’t even bother doing a review unless they receive a free review unit.

Take for eg. the Hiby R6P2. None of these review sites will rate it at the same level as the AK SP3000 or SP3000T. Why ? One costs 6-7 times lower than the other two.

 

[Safeinthemountains]

It is true that to some extent, rating (ranking) of audio equipment is correlated to the price of this equipment...
In some ways it's quite logical, even if the relationship is not linear at all. At some point you have to add a lot of money in order to get a marginal improvement (quite subjective sometimes...)

But it is not always true, and sometimes one can find a device that is really good for a fair price, better than other options at twice the price.
And in the end, audio perception is really subjective, so reviewers can be biased by the value, and think one unit HAS to perform better than another one just because it is more expensive...
I always take reviews with a grain of salt. But I'm "lucky"; I don't hear as many details, nuances as most of the people here, so most of the DAPs are more than OK for me in terms of SQ, and I focus on other specs like battery life, form factor, useability, durability...

I think that on the audio/SQ point of view, you have to make your own opinion by trying the device by yourself in the end... The same goes for headphones, even if differences are more obvious. In the end it comes to one's personal preference.

 

[UnderwaterB0i]

All the IEMs/Headphones I have use 3.5mm. They are all sub $100 IEMs, would I notice a different with a 4.4mm cable attached to those same IEMs used with the R4 when it comes in? Some of the ones I have are the Wan'er, Kiwi Ears Cadenza, and Simgot EW200. Considering some more expensive ones (Hidizs MP145, Simgot EA500LM, Kiwi Ears Quartet, Letshuoer S12 Pro), so maybe I just wait to get a 4.4mm cable when I pick up one of those better IEMs.

 

[Safeinthemountains]

I didn't really notice some obvious changes while using 3.5 then 4.4 with the same IEMs/HPs... But I'm not in your head
So yes, maybe better to wait until you get som IEM with balanced connection or even better, multiple connections.
My Fiio FH7s have that 3.5/2.5/4.4 option... but I personally cannot tell the difference

 

[fish1050]

Exactly my point. Even more so, these review sites won’t even bother doing a review unless they receive a free review unit.

Take for eg. the Hiby R6P2. None of these review sites will rate it at the same level as the AK SP3000 or SP3000T. Why ? One costs 6-7 times lower than the other two.

I was being facetious not literal! I sold audio gear for 15 years back before the internet became the only place to buy gear. There were plenty of reputable audio magazines that reviewed gear. If you find a site like headfonia whose reviews jibe with your assessment of the products you bought then they are at least to me trustworthy. Probably more than alot of the fanboys on this forum (Hello Sony!) who run down any product from another manufacturer to prop up their chosen brand of gear. These are the opinions I don't trust.

Since most gear is only available online you kinda need to rely on reviews since I am not going to buy every model I am considering to try it out. Especially if I have to import it from China. I am not a DAP collector I use one at a time and sell it before I buy another one. So I am very careful when I start shopping for a DAP. Hiby gave headfonia the R4 unit to review and the reviewer had no trouble being critical of what he found was lacking on the R4. If your view was correct it would have been a flowery puff review about how everything on the player was perfect.

 

[fish1050]

It is true that to some extent, rating (ranking) of audio equipment is correlated to the price of this equipment...
In some ways it's quite logical, even if the relationship is not linear at all. At some point you have to add a lot of money in order to get a marginal improvement (quite subjective sometimes...)

But it is not always true, and sometimes one can find a device that is really good for a fair price, better than other options at twice the price.
And in the end, audio perception is really subjective, so reviewers can be biased by the value, and think one unit HAS to perform better than another one just because it is more expensive...
I always take reviews with a grain of salt. But I'm "lucky"; I don't hear as many details, nuances as most of the people here, so most of the DAPs are more than OK for me in terms of SQ, and I focus on other specs like battery life, form factor, useability, durability...

I think that on the audio/SQ point of view, you have to make your own opinion by trying the device by yourself in the end... The same goes for headphones, even if differences are more obvious. In the end it comes to one's personal prefere

It is true that to some extent, rating (ranking) of audio equipment is correlated to the price of this equipment...
In some ways it's quite logical, even if the relationship is not linear at all. At some point you have to add a lot of money in order to get a marginal improvement (quite subjective sometimes...)

But it is not always true, and sometimes one can find a device that is really good for a fair price, better than other options at twice the price.
And in the end, audio perception is really subjective, so reviewers can be biased by the value, and think one unit HAS to perform better than another one just because it is more expensive...
I always take reviews with a grain of salt. But I'm "lucky"; I don't hear as many details, nuances as most of the people here, so most of the DAPs are more than OK for me in terms of SQ, and I focus on other specs like battery life, form factor, useability, durability...

I think that on the audio/SQ point of view, you have to make your own opinion by trying the device by yourself in the end... The same goes for headphones, even if differences are more obvious. In the end it comes to one's personal preference.

Your last statement is the problem, when you live in a country like Canada where only 10% of the products are available here, try before you buy isn't an option. The only DAP I might be able to try locally is the M5 Ultra once it arrives and most headphones aren't available here either. Even amazon.ca hardly carries any DAP's I can order to try out.

In most cases the audible differences between DAP's in the same price range are to minor to worry about. What I am looking for most in a review are any glaring issues that make it a bad option for me or a bad match for my headphones. When the reviewer said the mid-bass sounds hollow I take note of that and see if this opinion is shared by others.