[ai0tron]

Perhaps the sources they compiled the article with were outdated.

Perhaps the monitors they used for the comparison were themselves outdated.

Perhaps it was merely published in 2001 and written earlier.

Perhaps things have changed rapidly in the past year.

Perhaps they are simply wrong on many accounts and a very simple search on yahoo shopping can be the first step in showing just how 'outdated' this article is.

 

[gloco]

I'm no techie or anything so this is going on what my eyes have seen. I have both a flat screen CRT and a LCD and i can easily tell you the CRT LOOKS better and i have one of those $500 15" NEC models. The LCD just looks "muddy" and plain (in color contrast) in comparison to my TRINITRON 17" flat crt, which by the way, the two little dampeners (i think thats what their called) dont bother me one bit since i can only notice them on a one color screen (like word) so who cares if they are there? Granted the LCD is nice for limited desk space, but i usually see a $300 CRT that can handle high resolutions. On the other hand you have to spend a few times more (like a grand) to get a LCD to get the same kind of resolution out of it.

I agree with Cousin Eddie, right now the technology isnt up to snuff, thats not to say we should all turn our backs on LCD's and Plasma (which by the way looks like crap). This technology for consumer use is in its infancy and will take a few more years to really shine over CRT's which took a major leap with flat screens.

As for building your own box, cool, i did that with my Athlon 1.4, 60gig hd, Gforce2/64mb ram, soundblaster live, 768MB DDR memory, all for a grand! Now you can probably get a hi end pentium 4 for that much. Not too expensive to build it on your own. Good luck! And dont load XP on it (lol), stick with Professional 2000...for now. Just my .2 cents.

George

ps. i went through pricewatch, i had no problems with any of the vendors.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

DanG, each type of display has its advantages and disadvantages. I was simply stating that CRT has more advantages. That claim is supported by the entire content of this thread and the article. You may have gotten a 18 inch LCD for $900, but you can also get budget 19" CRT's for $125. The point here is that CRT is a better technology right now. Not only is it better overall, but it costs only a fraction of LCD technology.

ai0tron, or perhaps that article is right...

 

[DanG]

Not to get into an I-have-you-have debate, but another reason I like my LCD monitor is because of a digital input (which, as I said before, I still can't use

). Anyway, you generally won't find cheap CRT monitors with digital inputs.

 

[MacDEF]

Quote:

LCD monitors don't really make a lot of sense right now. LCD monitors don't respond as quickly as CRT's, so the picture will sometimes seem to smear.

On cheap ones, yes. On good ones, not at all.

There is a HUGE disparity between bad LCDs and good LCDs. The best ones, like the Apple flat-panels and some HP displays (and a few others; those are just examples) don't "smear" or "blur" at *all.* They also don't glare, are brighter than even good CRTs, and have excellent color balance.

The downside to LCD displays is that color *isn't* as accurate as a high-end CRT -- but that's only really important if you're doing color-sensitive work. The average user will never know the difference. Also, as mentioned before, non-native resolutions don't scale well. Not a big deal to me, since I always use the default rez, but for some people that will be an issue.

In terms of refresh rates, they are *not* comparable between CRT and LCD. LCD displays only "refresh" pixels that change -- if a particular pixel doesn't change, it won't be refreshed. CRTs refresh the entire image. So a MUCH higher refresh rate is necessary for a CRT. LCDs are much better on the eyes over long-term use.

Also keep in mind that a 15" LCD is equivalent to a 17" CRT. 17" LCD = 19" CRT.

LCDs are indeed more expensive than a comparable size, CRT, but to me it's worth it -- you save enough money on electricity alone to pay for the difference in a year or two. They also save space, and generate much less heat.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

MacDEF, earlier in the thread, DanG was talking about scrolling up and down quickly in web browsers to check if the monitor will smear. That's the same test I do. When you scroll up and down with your LCD, do you get any smear? How good of a LCD do you have to get so that you don't have the smear?

Under normal use, I don't think you're going to save hundreds of dollars on energy using an LCD. I would think that the difference in energy cost would be almost negligible if you turn the computer off and night and have the monitor go into low power mode when you're not using it.

I haven't read everything from the beginning of this thread, so maybe someone else mentioned this, but what I like about LCD's is that you can rotate them. This would allow you to play a lot of those MAME arcade emulator games and use your whole screen without changing the aspect ratio of the games.

 

[kwkarth]

Well, CRESCENDOPOWER, I guess I'll jump in here.

I may not know much about headphones and audio stuff, but I do know a lot about 'puters.

Been in the biz since before the bigboard days of the Z80.

Micron is not a bad vendor, as far as vendors go, but both Gateway and in particular, Dell are better. Dell has been on the top of the heap for customer satisfaction for several years running. You can get into a P4 box for under a grand with a nice complement of features. Tell me what your intended application(s) are and I'll help you with O/S and memory config.

If your time isn't worth anything and you want to build your own box, that's fine, and I've built many, many, many in my day but now a days, it's not usually worth it in my opinion to roll your own any more. Like anything, there are always exceptions to the rule.

Regarding monitors, buy what looks good to your wallet and your eyes. Your original choice was fine.

 

[DanG]

I must say that I'm one customer very dissatisfied with Dell. I ordered my Planar LCD monitor from them and called to make sure they were in stock. They assured that it was in stock. (This is October 24th)

Then on the site they said that the Planar monitor was out of stock. Customer service claimed over the phone that two or three were still in stock and one would be shipped out to me.

Well, an e-mail then came that there would be no monitors in stock until the 16th of November. The order was canceled.

On November 6th, the monitor comes.

I'm happy I got my monitor, but the fact that they blatantly lied to get money and then didn't cancel the order as requested shows how shoddy of a company Dell is. My high school had a computer lab full of Dells and 3 of the 10 machines died within several months.

About Gateway, back in their earlier days when they still called themselves Gateway 2000, their computers were made so that it would be difficult to tweak your computer with different components than those installed by Gateway. I'd bet their warranty is void if you so much as open the case.

Now don't even get me started on Compaq.

I think the best way to go, if you don't want to build your own computer, is to call a well-reputed computer assembler in your area. Hi-Q used to build computers -- I don't know if they still do. I think that they have several national locations.

I bought my computer from a small company called PCs for Everyone in Cambridge, MA. Although there were a few mix-ups which made me a little unhappy (see my thread about my burned processor), I was at least able to negotiate with them to get my fair repayment for the problems I had. I doubt yelling at Gateway or Dell could make me get my computer back in under a week. Also, they would probably make you send the whole box back as opposed to just the motherboard, processor, and heatsink.

Well, that's my spiel. I'd basically only buy from Dell if I were getting a laptop computer. There's just no alternative to big companies in that area, it seems.

 

[kwkarth]

I'm really sorry to hear of your experiences. They're not the norm or Dell would be out of business!

BTW, if you can find a reputable clone builder in your area, that's a fine way to go too. Stick with Intel CPU's. (I know I'm biased, but I've got plenty of reasons)

 

[MacDEF]

Quote:

MacDEF, earlier in the thread, DanG was talking about scrolling up and down quickly in web browsers to check if the monitor will smear. That's the same test I do. When you scroll up and down with your LCD, do you get any smear? How good of a LCD do you have to get so that you don't have the smear?

I have two Apple 15" LCD Studio Displays, and neither smears at all (used with either a Mac or a Windows PC). I also have a 2001 iBook with an LCD display, and it doesn't smear, either. Granted, the ASDs are among the best 15" LCDs, and the iBook's screen is by far the best LCD of its size on the market... but that was kind of my point (the better LCDs don't have all the drawbacks being thrown around

)

Quote:

Under normal use, I don't think you're going to save hundreds of dollars on energy using an LCD. I would think that the difference in energy cost would be almost negligible if you turn the computer off and night and have the monitor go into low power mode when you're not using it.

I use my monitors 8-12 hours per day; I can assure you that going from CRT to LCD has dropped our electricity bills substantially

 

[CRESCENDOPOWER]

O.K. a friend of mine is going to help me build this thing, but I am going to take my time, and do it right.
First, I am going to order the Hawk X case from buycase.com
What I need from you guys is to tell me if you think their prices are to high for the 40mm, and 80mm fans, that fit the case. If I buy these fans, do I need a chipset cooler, or not? Also, how do their prices compare to others for the power supplies, CD ROM drives, and floppy drives? Any help will be appreciated. Thank you.

 

[rlaskey]

Dude, do not get that case. A power supply is a hefty amount of cash in most cases, and fan's aren't free, either.

Get an Antec SX830, or, if you want, go w/ an Antec SX630. They both come w/ 300W power supplies, which is worth ~$40 (they were this much before, anyway; not sure what they go for now). I haven't even heard of the SX630 till I checked the Antec site (antec-inc.com); it seems decent, but I'd still just go for the SX830. Anyway, the SX830 comes w/ two fan mounts at the front and the back, and also comes with two fans. That, and I can assure you that the build quality of the Antec will surpass that of this other case; I have one myself, and I wouldn't think to use anything else.

You also certainly need a processor (CPU) cooler. Some motherboards also have chipset coolers (i.e., to cool the northbridge), but this really isn't needed.

The case fans are something you can get pretty much anywhere; as long as it fits, it should work. With the processor fans, however, you have to make sure you get one for the specific CPU you buy. That is, an Intel heatsink/fan will not fit on an AMD processor / board.

 

[dhwilkin]

Decide on the CPU before deciding on the case & power supply, since later CPUs (especially recent Athlons) have quite demanding power supply requirements.

 

[ai0tron]

Ok LCD's aside (eventhough they are superior heh heh)

When it comes to cases, THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!!

WWW.COOLERMASTER.COM

PS Athlon power requirments have been changed back to the standard. Yes they are still large but standard power supplies will work now. The newer boards no longer require proprietary technology for the power supply connection...

 

[beni]

Hey ai...check out the antec sx1240. It's not the coolest-looking case or very transportable, but it'll give you more cooling power and flexible expansion space than anything short of a several-hundred-dollar file server case. I got mine for $135 shipped. Just make sure it will fit under your desk...it's over 2' tall.

Also, I'm not aware that athlon motherboards ever had any sort of proprietary power-supply connector. They've always been ATX afaik. Athlons do require a very powerful PSU, though...the old athlon 1400 (not sure about the new XP) could dissipate over 60W! 300W is the absolute minimum for a stable system based on a processor like that, and a high-quality 300W too, not some el-cheapo CompUSA special. The P4 motherboards, or at least the first ones, do/did have a special power supply connector...but just about any power supply that's good enough to use in a good athlon system will have this connector anyway.