New Audeze LCD3
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:15 PM Post #3,961 of 11,521
Interesting article I just came across on Stereophile:
 
http://www.stereophile.com/content/headphone-heaven-audio-high
 
FWIW, for the past 10 days, I've only listened to my LCD-3s. I need to force myself to listen to my other cans now. I paid a lot for them and they deserve better treatment from me.
tongue.gif

 
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:19 PM Post #3,962 of 11,521


Quote:
 

As I had mentioned several posts back, I take, with a pinch of salt, posts which are subjective claiming that the LCD-3 sound veiled. I think I may have been lucky as I have not experienced this 'veil' with my LCD-3. Do I believe that it exist? Possibly. But I would really like to A/B various LCD-3s myself so that I personally experience this phenomenon first hand.
 

What if one person had two pairs of LCD-3's and one sounded veiled and the other one didn't.  Would that still be a subjective claim?  
 
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:29 PM Post #3,965 of 11,521


Quote:
 

As I had mentioned several posts back, I take, with a pinch of salt, posts which are subjective claiming that the LCD-3 sound veiled. I think I may have been lucky as I have not experienced this 'veil' with my LCD-3. Do I believe that it exist? Possibly. But I would really like to A/B various LCD-3s myself so that I personally experience this phenomenon first hand.
 
 

Besides the fixing of driver issues (i.e. cutting in and out), I don't think there will be other 'improvements' to the LCD-3. Only time will tell. I hope there won't be a LCD-3 r1 and LCD-3 r2 situation. That will really get out of hand.
 



Probably you should contact all the people present at our last Detroit Metro meet at Headfi.com headquarters. We had two different LCD-3. One sounding great (Jude's) and another one I got from TTVJ as a loaner sounding veil. We were also able to make a comparison of their ear pads finding inconsistency strength between both headphones where the veiled one had softer pads. You can see those pictures a few pages back.
 
After that A/B comparison I am convinced there is an inconsistency in the sound among LCD-3 headphones sets. 
 
 
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Feb 23, 2012 at 9:32 PM Post #3,966 of 11,521


Quote:
What if one person had two pairs of LCD-3's and one sounded veiled and the other one didn't.  Would that still be a subjective claim?  


It would be subjective based on the fact that those are your personal opinions but objective from the point that there clearly was a difference with the way two LCD-3s sound in direct comparison with one another (considering all sources remain constant).
 
It was your post that led me to believe that there may be a possibility of the 'veil' effect on various LCD-3s. That, and Purrin's measurements which I find most helpful. Again, I would like to A/B various LCD-3s myself so I can hear for myself what this 'veil' sound like. Hope that clarifies.
 
 
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:33 PM Post #3,967 of 11,521

Nick (mwilson) was the first to report it  with side by side direct comparisons and I trust him. And so have a few others as well, though I'm not sure exactly how many have heard 2 units side by side (I can think of 2 more off the top of my head). So I think its real. But what % is affected and to what degree? I'm not sure as there's still a good amount of us who don't have any issues with ours. That said, I've talked to Sankar and he mentioned that Audeze keeps a close eye on this thread (which is also why they posted an update a few days ago), so most likely they've heard this message and I expect it to be addressed.
smile.gif

 
EDIT: I was able to directly compare my LCD-2 r.2 to my LCD-3s before I sold them (LCD-2) and there was no veil to my ears whatsoever. As well, the FR graphs from Audeze when compared showed slightly deeper bass extension, about 2dB ish more upper mids/lower treble and a slight improvement in treble with the LCD-3s....and this was confirmed my doing FR sweeps with my "well tuned 40 year old ears". But that said, some of my older jazz favourite recordings sounded worse on my LCD-3s. Not the fault of more transparent headphones showing me the garbage that I'm feeding them. I felt the LCD-2s were better at hiding these poor recordings faults.
 
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:36 PM Post #3,968 of 11,521


Quote:
It would be subjective based on the fact that those are your personal opinions but objective from the point that there clearly was a difference with the way two LCD-3s sound in direct comparison with one another (considering all sources remain constant).
 
It was your post that led me to believe that there may be a possibility of the 'veil' effect on various LCD-3s. That, and Purrin's measurements which I find most helpful. Again, I would like to A/B various LCD-3s myself so I can hear for myself what this 'veil' sound like. Hope that clarifies.
 



Well whatever it is/was I'm willing to bet it won't be there when they implement the new QC.  
 
Feb 23, 2012 at 9:45 PM Post #3,969 of 11,521
I didnt listen to 2 side by side, but I did listen to 2 in my system with direct comparisons to my lcd2 as being a constant for the comparison. One sounded horrible, and the other pretty good.
 
Feb 23, 2012 at 11:33 PM Post #3,970 of 11,521
Let us suppose 100 people, all active members of a forum, buy a certain product. Let us suppose this product has a quality problem affecting say 3% of cases. (As well, for simplicity I suppose that many more than 100 of this product have been produced). Now, doing the math the chance that not one of the 100 owners will have a faulty example is 0.97 ^ 100 = less than 5%.
 
Put another way, there's a more than 95% chance at least one (or more) bad example will be found and reported within this group. In other words, groups such as ours have a high level of power to detect faults, even when the problem rate might be described as "low".
 
This has its good side: problems are detected easily and early. Audez'e and other manufacturers are certainly wise to monitor groups like these for problem reports.
 
The flip side, many - maybe all - of the remaining owners may justifiably worry whether theirs is also faulty, even though there is nothing to worry about in fact.
 
But further, as we know in this example the problem rate is low, the chance of any one owner being able to locate a genuine problem unit conveniently near-by is low as well, quite understandably giving some owners grounds for doubt the problem exists at all.
 
Of course, I just plucked the 3% figure out of the air. I have no idea what problem rate there is with the LCD3. FWIW this example merely shows that even a small problem rate is almost certain to be detected and, quite properly, reported as a direct consequence of belonging to a large(-ish) group. Call it a cost/benefit of being a citizen of the internet.
 
 
 
Feb 24, 2012 at 12:01 AM Post #3,971 of 11,521
Let us suppose 100 people, all active members of a forum, buy a certain product. Let us suppose this product has a quality problem affecting say 3% of cases. (As well, for simplicity I suppose that many more than 100 of this product have been produced). Now, doing the math the chance that not one of the 100 owners will have a faulty example is 0.97 ^ 100 = less than 5%.
 
Put another way, there's a more than 95% chance at least one (or more) bad example will be found and reported within this group. In other words, groups such as ours have a high level of power to detect faults, even when the problem rate might be described as "low".
 
This has its good side: problems are detected easily and early. Audez'e and other manufacturers are certainly wise to monitor groups like these for problem reports.
 
The flip side, many - maybe all - of the remaining owners may justifiably worry whether theirs is also faulty, even though there is nothing to worry about in fact.
 
But further, as we know in this example the problem rate is low, the chance of any one owner being able to locate a genuine problem unit conveniently near-by is low as well, quite understandably giving some owners grounds for doubt the problem exists at all.
 
Of course, I just plucked the 3% figure out of the air. I have no idea what problem rate there is with the LCD3. FWIW this example merely shows that even a small problem rate is almost certain to be detected and, quite properly, reported as a direct consequence of belonging to a large(-ish) group. Call it a cost/benefit of being a citizen of the internet.
 
 


Well put.
 
Feb 24, 2012 at 10:35 AM Post #3,972 of 11,521
The first time i heard LCD 3 was by Stereo Shop in end of December 2011.
 
My first impression i have posted in  Cura Wong Thread , the sound was so muffeled or better veild.
 
Mid of January i have tried about 1 week by local Dealer in Indonesia , the LCD 3 sound Quality different like what i heard by Stereo Shop in Singapore.
 
After marathon listening i decided to buy LCD 3 , i am lucky i get the same like what i tried by Local Dealer In Indonesia , Sound Quality are very good.
 
Better separation and soundstage compare to my LCD 2 Rev 2.
 
Better layering compare to my LCD 2 Rev 2 also.
 
in this week end my friend want give his LCD 3 to me for comparison , because he feel his LCD 3 also veild or muffeled.
 
i will post the comoarison by monday with picture from the two LCD 3.
 
I have wrote email to Sankar from Audeze , he has not reply my email two days a go.
 
Feb 24, 2012 at 10:53 AM Post #3,974 of 11,521
Out of curiosity, what did you write to Sankar about if your LCD3 is excellent?

And, if one could quantify improvement and enjoyment, do you think the LCD-3 will be worth the extra $1000 above the LCD-2 rev2?   Yes, a very subjective question but I like to hear from owners of LCD-2 rev2 about making the leap to the LCD-3.  It's not pocket change.  
 
Quote:
The first time i heard LCD 3 was by Stereo Shop in end of December 2011.
 
My first impression i have posted in  Cura Wong Thread , the sound was so muffeled or better veild.
 
Mid of January i have tried about 1 week by local Dealer in Indonesia , the LCD 3 sound Quality different like what i heard by Stereo Shop in Singapore.
 
After marathon listening i decided to buy LCD 3 , i am lucky i get the same like what i tried by Local Dealer In Indonesia , Sound Quality are very good.
 
Better separation and soundstage compare to my LCD 2 Rev 2.
 
Better layering compare to my LCD 2 Rev 2 also.
 
in this week end my friend want give his LCD 3 to me for comparison , because he feel his LCD 3 also veild or muffeled.
 
i will post the comoarison by monday with picture from the two LCD 3.
 
I have wrote email to Sankar from Audeze , he has not reply my email two days a go.



 
 
Feb 24, 2012 at 11:47 AM Post #3,975 of 11,521

 
Quote:
Out of curiosity, what did you write to Sankar about if your LCD3 is excellent?

And, if one could quantify improvement and enjoyment, do you think the LCD-3 will be worth the extra $1000 above the LCD-2 rev2?   Yes, a very subjective question but I like to hear from owners of LCD-2 rev2 about making the leap to the LCD-3.  It's not pocket change.  
 


 

in our community are now fifty fifty , some said not worth it to buy LCD 3 , because the Sound improvement not so big.
 
for me LCD 3 improvement is worth it , because my personal tease are two different Headphone between LCD 2 Rev 2 and LCD 3.
 
I can get more sound refinement in LCD 3 that i can not find in my LCD 2 rev 2.
 
Many friends off mine said :
The Soundstage from LCD 2 Rev 2 is from left to right
The Soundstage from LCD 3 more 3 dimensional ,has better layering and music separation
The Sound Quality from my LCD 3 is more grand than my LCD 2 Rev 2
 
Note : to my opinion LCD 3 is the difficultest LCD series to drive.
          You must have very good Headphone Amp to drive the best Sound Quality from LCD 3
 
Here is my opinion for easy to drive LCD series : LCD 2 rev 1 > LCD 2 Rev 2 > LCD 3
 
The best sounding for my LCD 3 if i pair with my Tube Pre Amp from T + A  P 10.2 Germany
 

 
 
 
 

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